How the World Really Works: 1

[FRED]

[goadam1]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

Well, at least I know I'm not the only crazy person. When I tell people that North Korea was prompted to lob shells to remind America that we can restart the korean war if we keep pushing for a strong yuan, I'm usually met with blank stares and the conversation returns to celebrity gossip.

But are you saying the whole wikileak is psyop? It doesn't really seem so. It more seems to be about a 21st century empire spread thin and a State Department that is a little catty.

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

But are you saying the whole wikileak is psyop? It doesn't really seem so. It more seems to be about a 21st century empire spread thin and a State Department that is a little catty.

These two possibilities are not necessarily mutually exclusive.

In other words, perhaps it is a psyop intended to distract you with apparently catty inside messages of the State Dept.

My rule of thumb is that we might not know what something actually is, but we can be pretty sure of what it is not. It is not what they tell us it is.

[goadam1]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

It's a conspiracy turducken. A riddle in an enigma all wrapped in a conspiracy.

These two possibilities are not necessarily mutually exclusive.

In other words, perhaps it is a psyop intended to distract you with apparently catty inside messages of the State Dept.

My rule of thumb is that we might not know what something actually is, but we can be pretty sure of what it is not. It is not what they tell us it is.

[goadam1]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

A lot of what has come out seems pretty legit from a common sense point of view. Plus, it seems crazier that people made up 250,000 pages of stuff for psyops, than if there are cable asking if the president of Argentina is on meds.

The weird part is the site goes down after they say that a bank is coming next. Now that is crossing the line. Although it seems pretty easy to put some documents on the web if you want to.

[dbarberic]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

A lot of what has come out seems pretty legit from a common sense point of view. Plus, it seems crazier that people made up 250,000 pages of stuff for psyops, than if there are cable asking if the president of Argentina is on meds.

The weird part is the site goes down after they say that a bank is coming next. Now that is crossing the line. Although it seems pretty easy to put some documents on the web if you want to.

The content could completely be legit, but basically worthless from a value point of view. That's the idea of a "limited hangout".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_hangout

When you step back and look at the actual value of information learned from cable gate, its actually quite worthless. If it is worthless, the question is, who released the information and what is their motiviation? Is it (or parts of it) just propaganda disguised as secret communications released by a whisleblower?

This was posted on another iTulip thread and is quite good: http://theintelhub.com/2010/08/07/wi...rs-cointelpro/

The quote by Wayne Madison is questionable, as he is a DC rumor raker. But the quote by John Young is quite good. He is a former founder of WikiLeaks and owns a similar site called Cryptome.

“The principal deficiency of Wikileaks is its lack of transparency about its operators and funds, characteristics of spies and secret societies up to no good and whose main purpose is to hide from public accountability and conceal corruption and criminality.
Such organizations always use a noble purpose and claim secrecy is needed to protect supporters. In practice the secrecy protects the principal beneficiaries, the operators and sources of funds, and supporters are sacrificed to protect the continuation of the enterprise.
Wikileaks has followed the lucrative model of the cult of national security, the largest world’s secret enterprise, composed of selected elements of governments, military, intelligence, NGOs, contractors, lobbyists and supporters, identified by their clearance for access to classified information.
Royalty and religion have long demonstrated the power of secrecy in misrepresenting what they are up to, pronouncing a great public benefit while reaping privileged rewards behind this cloak — a lavish cloak of property, ceremony, titles and prizes, architecture, clothing, language and literature, music, fine arts, and not least, a complex apparatus of punishment for apostates and infidels, often by military means but equally often by covert attacks.
Cults of royalty, religion, military are the main practitioners of secrecy and they are role models for ambitious persons who believe they have a mission to be superior to the public and must violate public trust to battle those who have similar ambitions. They invent enemies to warrant this betrayal.
They also combine with their competitors to advance their causes. Thus the appeal of global initiatives to violate national borders in transgression of local law hidden by secrecy.
That’s the short sermon. Far better is the browsible library of bountiful supporting information undoctored by sermonizing, Cryptome.”

One thing is for sure, the rabbit hole regarding WikiLeaks sure is deep.

[dbarberic]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

Another interesting interview of John Young.

http://cryptome.org/0001/wikileaks-views.htm

SM: 1) What makes you to believe that Wikileaks behaves like a secret spy operation? And who would be in charge of this op? The CIA? The Mossad? What are its purposes?
JY: All of Wikileaks operations are those of secret spying operations. Egotistical, bumbling, lack of transparency, exaggerated assurances of confidentiality, obscurity about internal affairs, unverifiable claims and assertions, asymmetry in protection (always the spy's over the dupes), exaggeration of the importance of information provided, few if any admissions of errors, heroic risks from powerful enemies, and much more. Hyperbolic claims about serving the public and protecting the weak -- as a "news" person you know this well.
SM: 2) Wikileaks did leak documents concerning the U.S., Britain, Israel, Germany , prominent banks like the Julius Baer Bank, etc. So it doesn't seem to me that Wikileaks is supporting any country, don't you think so?
JY: There is no way to tell due to lack of transparency. Spies typically cloak their operations by misleading disclosures. Nationalism is not the issue. The issue is vainglory about information control -- leaks if you will, sometimes called news.
SM: 3) Even people like Daniel Ellsberg, the famous leaker of the 'Pentagon Papers', was skeptical about Wikileaks, at the beginning. However, yesterday I had an interview with him and he told me that Wikileaks is doing a good job and he overcame the doubts he had at the beginning. Don't you think that leaks such as the "Collateral Murder" video are great stuff?
JY: Ellsberg appears to have been duped, either by himself or by others. His fondness for public appearance to recount his personal experience is unsettling. He has repeatedly exaggerated threats to Wikileaks and Assange by invoking his own experience.
The short version of Collateral Murder was a media event. The longer version tells a different story, more nuanced and informative. "Great stuff" is hypebole for the short version. The long version is not great stuff. Wash your mouth.
SM: 4) You write that recent events indicates that deception is integral. What do you mean exactly?
JY: Lack of transparency is deception, secrecy is deception, lack of accountability is deception, misinformation about the operation is deception. Exaggeration is deception. Tweets are deception. Publicity campaigns are deception. Manipulation of the media and the public is deception. Unsupportable promises of protection of those submitting documents is deception. Some analyses of documents have been deceptive. "Wiki" is deception, Wikileaks admits that.
SM: 5) You write that recent events have put in jeopardy those who have provided information to Wikileaks. HOwever, apart from Bradley Manning, no leakers had troubles due to leaks to Wikileaks and, starting 4 years ago, they leaked hundreds of hot documents, so I think it is a good record. Isn't it?
JY: Due to lack of transparency there is no way of knowing who has been exposed, enrapped, extorted, quietened, censored, or worse, only unsupported vainglorious claims have been made. It is common for spies to make such appealing claims to assure participation of sources and agents.
The hundreds of "hot documents" (hyperbole) likely include planted and orchestrated leaks. What is not known is what non-hot but information documents have been ignored for the hot ones, and now the video bombshells.
A technique used to build credibility of a spy-run outlet is seed it with alluring documents. There is no way of knowing where the documents came from. Instead, Wikileaks asserts validation by its own members, all unknown and without public substantiation -- a favorite of spies and cousins, con artists and flacks -- this too you know well.
SM: 6) You write: "There is a personal , legal and political risk for being duped in this matter. From my first contact with Wikileaks during its formation, this has been true.". What do you mean exactly?
JY: Anybody who has willingly linked to Wikileaks by participation or by submission of materials is implicated in what it turns out to be, or is converted into, or changed by desperation, bribes and lure of fame. This can be used to manipulate, extort and threaten by use of supposedly confidential and secret information. This is the basic means to control participants in spying and criminal operations -- suck them in then threaten exposurem a favorite of agents provocateurs and undercover cops and spies. This is the fault and beauty of secret operations whether used by journos, sex partners, official spies, the lot of those who fear transparency and symmetry, who out of cowardice seek to gain unfair advantage.

[D-Mack]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

He has "luck" on his side.....

Wikileaks' Julian Assange escapes arrest in UK due to clerical error

JULIAN Assange reportedly escaped arrest in the UK today because Swedish authorities failed to fill out an arrest warrant correctly.

British police and security services are believed to know where the WikiLeaks' founder is staying, thought to be a location in country's southeast. Assange is believed to have supplied Scotland Yard with contact details upon arrival in the UK in October.


Read more: http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news...#ixzz16x9MJeMf

[LargoWinch]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

NK is China's pit-bull.

[Slimprofits]

Re: How the World Really Works: 1

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/nati...03400315F.HTML

SEOUL, Dec. 8 (Yonhap) -- A South Korean military official said sounds of distant artillery fire were heard on Wednesday from within North Korea near the tense Yellow Sea border.

No shells have landed south of the border or on Yeonpyeong Island, the site of last month's bombardment by the North, the official at the South's Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS) said on condition of anonymity.

"We assumed North Korea was carrying out its regular firing exercises," the official said.