“The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

[D-Mack]

“Obama is “the president of hope”, but in a year there won’t be any hope. He’s practically another Gorbachev – he likes to talk but hasn’t really managed to do anything. Gorbachev at least had been a secretary of a regional communist party administration, whereas Obama was just a social worker. His mentality is totally different. He’s a nice person and talks nicely – but he’s not a leader and will take America to a crash. When Americans understand that – it will be like a bomb explosion,” Panarin said, speaking to journalists during the unveiling of his book.


...

“I’m not anti-American, the US population has nothing to do with the part of its political elite that implements an absurd and aggressive policy that aims to create conflicts around the planet…….I hope to see the reasonable part of the American elite – I know there is one – benefiting in these two months left till the collapse. I can name two people that belong to this reasonable part – US Secretary of Defense Robert Gates and Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs William Burns. If they triumph in the political strife, the consequences of the collapse will be minimized.”

...
http://russiatoday.com/Top_News/2009...collapse.html#

Robert Gates ?

[metalman]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

“Obama is “the president of hope”, but in a year there won’t be any hope. He’s practically another Gorbachev – he likes to talk but hasn’t really managed to do anything. Gorbachev at least had been a secretary of a regional communist party administration, whereas Obama was just a social worker. His mentality is totally different. He’s a nice person and talks nicely – but he’s not a leader and will take America to a crash. When Americans understand that – it will be like a bomb explosion,” Panarin said, speaking to journalists during the unveiling of his book.


...

“I’m not anti-American, the US population has nothing to do with the part of its political elite that implements an absurd and aggressive policy that aims to create conflicts around the planet…….I hope to see the reasonable part of the American elite – I know there is one – benefiting in these two months left till the collapse. I can name two people that belong to this reasonable part – US Secretary of Defense Robert Gates and Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs William Burns. If they triumph in the political strife, the consequences of the collapse will be minimized.”

...
http://russiatoday.com/Top_News/2009...collapse.html#

Robert Gates ?

2 months, eh? barely time to dig my doom cave... :eek:

MOSCOW, Russia (CNN) -- A cult member who spent several months holed up in a cave with dozens of other people anticipating the end of the world claimed Wednesday that two women died and were buried inside.

The former cave-dweller, Vitaly Nedogon, relayed his claims to Russian TV journalists, according to Anton Sharonov, a spokesman for the administration of Penza, a region southeast of Moscow.


The official said Nedogon did not report the information to police or authorities. Once the rest of the apocalyptic sect leaves the cave, investigators will move in to try to confirm Nedogon's report, Sharonov said.

maybe one of our russian members can explain the russian doomer phenomenon.

[D-Mack]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

2 months, eh? barely time to dig my doom cave... :eek:


maybe one of our russian members can explain the russian doomer phenomenon.

Its a bit less than the 81 days from Sinclair on Aug. 19th

That downtrend is 81 days from implosion
http://jsmineset.com/2009/08/19/the-...of-the-dollar/

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

http://russiatoday.com/Top_News/2009...collapse.html#
Robert Gates ?

Panarin is pretty clearly "talking his book" here, his book being Russian power. As such, one cannot trust that Panarin will speak the truth when it would serve him ill, nor avoid deception when it serves him well. His more dramatic lines are for the purpose of gaining attention.

Gates is a major power player from what I can sense. He is the opposite of Obama, more power than rhetoric. I don't trust Gates, but I do fear him.

[jk]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

by way of background, i had a strong interest in, and a fair amount of knowledge about, the soviet system, history and organizational/bureaucratic evolution.

as soon as i saw the comparison of obama and gorbachev i literally felt a tingle along my spine. i think this comparison is - unfortunately - right on the money.

gorbachev was something of a visionary, who dreamed of reforming the soviet system. perestroika meant "restructuring" in the same way we use that term - restructuring- for corporate reorganizations. he wanted to flatten the hierarchy, devolve some decision making authority, and in general do with the soviet system what restructuring did for many companies.

i think obama has a similar vision. not in the details of reorganization, but in looking for a well-intentioned reformist kind of agenda.

but in the soviet union the rot had gone too far, and the ethnic tensions vis a vis the border regions were too strong, for gorbachev's agenda to succeed.

and obama has underestimated, or perhaps been totally blind to the economic forces at work in u.s. society. he relies on "expertise" in the implementation of conventional wisdom. and i'm thinking more and more he will succeed no more than gorbachev did, another well-intentioned guy who didn't see what was really going on.

[thedanimal]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

“Obama is “the president of hope”, but in a year there won’t be any hope. He’s practically another Gorbachev – he likes to talk but hasn’t really managed to do anything. Gorbachev at least had been a secretary of a regional communist party administration, whereas Obama was just a social worker. His mentality is totally different. He’s a nice person and talks nicely – but he’s not a leader and will take America to a crash. When Americans understand that – it will be like a bomb explosion,” Panarin said, speaking to journalists during the unveiling of his book.

I'll have to watch the video later because I don't have time right now, but this quote is utter BS. Obama was never a "social worker." He was a Harvard and Columbia educated lawyer, University of Chicago professor, state senator, US senator. Also, you might not agree with what Obama has done, but to say he has done nothing just isn't the case.

That said, I think there's something to the Gorbachev comparison. But the hyperbole above does little to further his case.

[D-Mack]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

I'll have to watch the video later because I don't have time right now, but this quote is utter BS. Obama was never a "social worker." He was a Harvard and Columbia educated lawyer, University of Chicago professor, state senator, US senator. Also, you might not agree with what Obama has done, but to say he has done nothing just isn't the case.

That said, I think there's something to the Gorbachev comparison. But the hyperbole above does little to further his case.

The article is longer than the clip, it's only 47 seconds long

I think he meant community organizer

On the Streets of Chicago, a Candidate Comes of Age
As a community organizer, Obama was a pragmatic leader
By Kenneth T. Walsh
Posted 8/26/07

CHICAGO—Far from the centers of power and privilege that have spawned so many commanders in chief, it's an unlikely place to incubate a future president. But the seemingly endless clumps of drab brick apartment buildings and patchy lawns on Chicago's South Side are where Sen. Barack Obama learned some of his most enduring lessons about politics, leadership, and the paths to social change. His experiences here, in fact, amount to a Rosetta stone that reveals the essence of the man who has catapulted out of nowhere into contention for the Democratic presidential nomination for 2008.

...

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/ar...826/3obama.htm

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

Mega just posted another link involving Professor Panarin's comments at er........You know Obama said Change.... Looks like Mega's thread naming skills are still uncontested ;).

[thedanimal]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

The article is longer than the clip, it's only 47 seconds long

I think he meant community organizer

Right, and a community organizer and a social worker are two very different things.

Since 1998, Panarin has been warning of a future disintegration of the United States and the collapse of the dollar. The recent election victory for Japan’s Democratic Party is another sign that the economic collapse of the U.S. is imminent, according to Panarin.

Wow, he's been saying it since 1998! Maybe he'll be right eventually. He's like the Nouriel Roubini of doomers. Even a stopped watch, etc.

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

Right, and a community organizer and a social worker are two very different things.

The professor was speaking in Russian via a translator; one should not put too fine a point on the choice of words.

Wow, he's been saying it since 1998!

He's been saying since 1998 that the breakup would be in 2010. So far he's consistent, and so far it is too early to use history to disprove this prediction.

[thedanimal]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

He's been saying since 1998 that the breakup would be in 2010. So far he's consistent, and so far it is too early to use history to disprove this prediction.

My mistake on this point.

The mayans predicted the world will end in 2012. So far they've been right too.

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

My mistake on this point.

The mayans predicted the world will end in 2012. So far they've been right too.

So far. Are you prepared? ;)

[ggirod]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

I think that the main thing Russian Professor Igor Panarin misses in the US is that we have oligarchs who are mostly national in scope. You might better to try to find a spot without air than to find a spot without wall street influence. Ditto for all other aspects of the FIRE economy. Even garden variety corporations and manufacturers are national in scope. How do you think we got into this mess in the first place? Washington was the choke point to keep lawmakers under control. If you influenced the federal level you wouldn't have to influence 50 state governments with all the complexities and costs that brings.

The last things these truly powerful organizations want is to see their loot divided into pieces and owned by different governments. With a clean slate in each area they would lose big. In fact, it could be that by publishing that book he assures that his prediction will NOT come true because now the oligarchs are on notice that if they want this gravy train to continue they have to avoid the crash.

The Soviet Union, (apologies if my recollections and perceptions are off base) was much more a loose federation of nations held together by force. When it collapsed the underlying differences shattered unity in a hurry and the oligarchs, who mostly had regional scope, were freed to do their thing, but regionally. The US is not yet in a condition where that could happen. While personalities and charisma might make a difference in Russia, it makes not one whit of difference who the president is (witness 8 years of Bush) ... the oligarchs will get what they want.

Secession in Texas, Tenn, Montana, and maybe some others, is a notion entertained by a few extremists who haven't figured out what they would do if Washington simply said "Have a go at it", so the people even in those states would probably resist the split-up.

Otherwise, the only splits in the nation are those created, led, and cultivated by the oligarchs themselves ... leading to the illusion of left, right, democrat, republican, etc. In fact, you can see the oligarchs making sure that the right and left hate each other so it would be impossible for them to ever heal their differences. If they could, well God knows what kind of laws they might pass! If you look around you see that those ideological differences are carefully planned to allow well funded bipartisan majorities to form invisibly behind the scenes to take care of oligarch needs like bailouts and then disappear before anybody sees them for what they are. When was the last time a bipartisan majority formed for anything other than corporate interests? The oligarchs require the nation to stay together. They need the illusion of democracy and freedom, crossing state lines and cultural differences, to keep control of the nation in the hands of the few ... the powerful ... the oligarchs.

[jk]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

when i said i see the gorbachev-obama comparison, i am NOT saying the u.s. will break apart. i am saying that obama - on his current course- will be as grand a failure in achieving his goals.

[Slimprofits]

Re: “The Crash of America” author compares Obama to Gorbachev

When was the last time a bipartisan majority formed for anything other than corporate interests? The oligarchs require the nation to stay together. They need the illusion of democracy and freedom, crossing state lines and cultural differences, to keep control of the nation in the hands of the few ... the powerful ... the oligarchs.

campaign finance reform? Just kidding. Great post. Tremendous post. I am of the same school of thought.