Trump to win?

[Polish_Silver]

Re: Trump to win?

I might be wrong, but I thought the conformity results varied only slightly when a person's decisions were anonymous. They did vary greatly when some variation in other's choices
was seen. Cultural differences were also seen, Americans being the most likely to differ from the group.

[Woodsman]

Re: What is the plan ?

"First order" Those 2 words seem like a dog whistle to me.

I'm sure it does, as it seems you are primed to look for controversy where none exists. Let me help you since you may have convictions but insufficient courage to express them.

By dog whistle, you are asserting that because I seem to care more about maintaining public peace and order, that I want to see an end senseless violence, rioting, looting, shootings and raping against people with no involvement in the event that precipitated this chaos, this to you is evidence of racial malice. You want to call me a racist, but you are either too smart or too prudent to run the rapier straight through. Is that about right?

You are free to create whatever internal narrative you need to get through the day, Thailandnotes. You are even free to make existential judgments about the content of my character based on the scantest evidence, with no personal experience or interaction beyond black type on a white background. Nothing in creation I can do about that.

But before you commit to engaging in behavior quite similar to that you seem primed to accuse me - bigotry - my desire for peace remains my first order concern both domestically and internationally. Before you commit yourself further, consider that I've been asked by "The Man" to keep a friendly tone but I feel under no such constraint if I am to be subject to slander.

So in as friendly a tone as I can muster under the circumstances, please do tread carefully sir. If it's a fight you are looking for, I'd ask you to look elsewhere.

PS: Raz was right and I was wrong. SF, JK and now it seems you Thai helped me to understand how wrong I was and what wrong I did to that man. I want to take this opportunity to apologize to him here in this public forum. You were right, Raz. I was wrong.

[Polish_Silver]

Re: What is the plan ?

Meanwhile, what the NYT won't show you

Bet this poor fellow was wishing he had exercised his Second Amendment rights. You want a picture of America without the Second Amendment, after HRC takes your birthright to defend yourself, your neighbors, your city, then look no further than to this innocent man's suffering..

Among other things, gun prohibition gives the state a monopoly on deadly force. I just do not feel comfortable with that.

[Woodsman]

Re: Trump to win?

I might be wrong, but I thought the conformity results varied only slightly when a person's decisions were anonymous. They did vary greatly when some variation in other's choices
was seen. Cultural differences were also seen, Americans being the most likely to differ from the group.

The whole shebang has come under suspicion; not for any malfeasance but for reaching the wrong conclusions from the data.

...the interpretation of the Asch conformity experiments as normative influence is inconsistent with the data.^[12][13][14] They point out that post-experiment interviews revealed that participants experienced uncertainty about their own judgement during the experiments. Although the correct answer appeared obvious to the researchers, this was not necessarily the experience of participants. Moreover, subsequent research has demonstrated similar patterns of conformity where participants were anonymous and thus not subject to social punishment or reward on the basis of their responses.^[18]

But the wrong conclusions dominate the psych textbooks:

... However, a 1990 survey of US introductory psychology textbooks found that most ignored independence, instead reported a misleading summary of the results as reflecting complete power of the situation to produce conformity of behavior and belief.^[26] A 2015 survey found no change, with just 1 of 20 major texts reporting that most participant-responses defied majority opinion. No text mentioned that 95% of subjects defied the majority at least once. Nineteen of the 20 books made no mention of Asch's interview data in which many participants said they were certain all along that the confederates were wrong.^[27] This portrayal of the Asch studies was suggested to fit with social psychology narratives of situationism, obedience and conformity, to the neglect of recognition of disobedience of immoral commands (e.g. disobedience shown by participants in Milgram Studies), desire for fair treatment (e.g. resistance to tyranny shown by many participants in the Stanford prison studies) and self-determination.^[27]

I'm not saying there's nothing to the research. It's just not the slam dunk it's said to be. People are infinitely variable despite the social engineer's desire to make them otherwise for profit, organizational efficiency or the maintenance of the preferred social order. Some of the nuttier types who are suspicious of crowds and crowd-thinking, these crazy cats actually like being in the minority; even when it's a minority of one.

[Polish_Silver]

Re: Trump to win?

There's a good analysis of Asch in Shiller's book "Irrational Exuberance" , touching on several of the points you made.

[Thailandnotes]

Re: What is the plan ?

I'm sure it does.

I have absolutely no conviction nor courage, definitely no patriotism, and certainly spend no time “getting through the day.”

[Woodsman]

Re: What is the plan ?

I have absolutely no conviction nor courage, definitely no patriotism, and certainly spend no time “getting through the day.”

Do have a nice day.

[jk]

Re: What is the plan ?

Sure, and black lives matter. But can we stop rioting, looting, raping, shooting and pillaging first. It seems to me that is the first order of business.

it is tied for first with stopping the police from arbitrarily killing people.

[Chris Coles]

Re: Trump to win?

I have talked to several software engineers about the electronic voting systems, and most of them are quite suspiscious of them. The actual "firmware" is proprietary, so no one outside
the company really knows how they work. Also, if the machine was skewing the results 5%, how would we know? I really think a more accountable voting system is possible.

Considering the number of times I have been hacked into, several times ending up with a Japanese or Chinese Desk Top; with just a few days ago when I was drafting a rocket to my new Hosting service the whole machine locked up and when re-started, I had lost a number of settings; it is my very humble opinion that it is impossible to keep another from access to ANY computer. That using computing to count votes is a license to cheat given to the supplier of the machine, or whomever wishes to.

A ballot paper slip with a cross marked can be counted and re-counted. Using any form of a computer is simply wide open to fraud.

[vt]

Re: What is the plan ?

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-0...-out-state-ids

[vt]

Re: Trump to win?

What is ignored in the narrative we see in these police shootings is the out of control black on black crime. And it's not just criminals that are affected by the shootings. Innocent citizens, and even children are killed or wounded by the senseless violence.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/13/us...soar.html?_r=0

The police are there to because black lives do matter, and citizens want the police to protect them.

There are tens of millions of guns but you don't see the gun violence in Asian, Hispanic, or White communities. None of these races have the murder rate that is seen in the black community.

Where are the studies, the media looking into this issue, calls for congressional action?
.
Until these key issues are addressed the deaths will continue to haunt us.

[Woodsman]

Re: What is the plan ?

it is tied for first with stopping the police from arbitrarily killing people.

Do I need to state that explicitly or am I to be denied the a priori assumption that I don't support the arbitrary killing of anyone, animal, vegetable or mineral?

[jk]

Re: What is the plan ?

Do I need to state that explicitly or am I to be denied the a priori assumption that I don't support the arbitrary killing of anyone, animal, vegetable or mineral?

your original statement was about priorities. saying something is not the first priority is not to deny it.
i think it's worth being as explicit as possible in these contentious times.

[Woodsman]

Re: What is the plan ?

...i think it's worth being as explicit as possible in these contentious times.

And how!

[Woodsman]

Re: Trump to win?

This is cosmic. Can you believe the coincidence? Feeling a bit like the Cheshire Cat right now.

Palmer Luckey: The Facebook Near-Billionaire Secretly Funding Trump’s Meme Machine

Palmer Luckey—founder of Oculus—is funding a Trump group that circulates dirty memes about Hillary Clinton.

GIDEON RESNICK


BEN COLLINS


09.22.16 9:00 PM ET

A Silicon Valley titan is putting money behind an unofficial Donald Trump group dedicated to “shitposting” and circulating internet memes maligning Hillary Clinton.

Oculus founder Palmer Luckey financially backed a pro-Trump political organization called Nimble America, a self-described “social welfare 501(c)4 non-profit” in support of the Republican nominee.

Luckey sold his virtual reality company Oculus to Facebook for $2 billion in 2014, and Forbes estimates his current net worth to be $700 million. The 24-year-old told The Daily Beast that he had used the pseudonym “NimbleRichMan” on Reddit with a password given to him by the organization’s founders.