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  • Re: Trump to win?

    Chris Hedges




    The Revenge of the Lower Classes and the Rise of American Fascism

    College-educated elites, on behalf of corporations, carried out the savage neoliberal assault on the working poor. Now they are being made to pay. Their duplicity—embodied in politicians such as Bill and Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama—succeeded for decades. These elites, many from East Coast Ivy League schools, spoke the language of values—civility, inclusivity, a condemnation of overt racism and bigotry, a concern for the middle class—while thrusting a knife into the back of the underclass for their corporate masters. This game has ended.

    There are tens of millions of Americans, especially lower-class whites, rightfully enraged at what has been done to them, their families and their communities. They have risen up to reject the neoliberal policies and political correctness imposed on them by college-educated elites from both political parties: Lower-class whites are embracing an American fascism....


    The Democrats are playing a very dangerous game by anointing Hillary Clinton as their presidential candidate. She epitomizes the double-dealing of the college-educated elites, those who speak the feel-your-pain language of ordinary men and women, who hold up the bible of political correctness, while selling out the poor and the working class to corporate power....

    Richard Rorty in his last book, “Achieving Our Country,” written in 1998, presciently saw where our postindustrial nation was headed.

    Many writers on socioeconomic policy have warned that the old industrialized democracies are heading into a Weimar-like period, one in which populist movements are likely to overturn constitutional governments. Edward Luttwak, for example, has suggested that fascism may be the American future. The point of his book The Endangered American Dream is that members of labor unions, and unorganized unskilled workers, will sooner or later realize that their government is not even trying to prevent wages from sinking or to prevent jobs from being exported. Around the same time, they will realize that suburban white-collar workers—themselves desperately afraid of being downsized—are not going to let themselves be taxed to provide social benefits for anyone else.

    At that point, something will crack. The nonsuburban electorate will decide that the system has failed and start looking around for a strongman to vote for—someone willing to assure them that, once he is elected, the smug bureaucrats, tricky lawyers, overpaid bond salesmen, and postmodernist professors will no longer be calling the shots. A scenario like that of Sinclair Lewis’ novel It Can’t Happen Here may then be played out. For once a strongman takes office, nobody can predict what will happen. In 1932, most of the predictions made about what would happen if Hindenburg named Hitler chancellor were wildly overoptimistic.


    -----
    the whole article is really worth reading, unfortunately.
    Last edited by jk; March 11, 2016, 11:21 AM.

    Comment


    • Re: Trump to win?

      There are tens of millions of Americans, especially lower-class whites, rightfully enraged at what has been done to them, their families and their communities. They have risen up to reject the neoliberal policies and political correctness imposed on them by college-educated elites from both political parties: Lower-class whites are embracing an American fascism.
      These Americans want a kind of freedom—a freedom to hate. They want the freedom to use words like “nigger,” “kike,” “spic,” “chink,” “raghead” and “fag.” They want the freedom to idealize violence and the gun culture. They want the freedom to have enemies, to physically assault Muslims, undocumented workers, African-Americans, homosexuals and anyone who dares criticize their cryptofascism. They want the freedom to celebrate historical movements and figures that the college-educated elites condemn, including the Ku Klux Klan and the Confederacy. They want the freedom to ridicule and dismiss intellectuals, ideas, science and culture. They want the freedom to silence those who have been telling them how to behave. And they want the freedom to revel in hypermasculinity, racism, sexism and white patriarchy. These are the core sentiments of fascism. These sentiments are engendered by the collapse of the liberal state.
      I read this the other day. I think various people exist that fit the quote description, but Hedges is taking all the worst traits of a minority of people and acting as if there are more such people than there are. It's certainly disingenuous to act as if all of Trumps supporters fit the description here. And while Trump may be happy to have the support of such people, I would be shocked if his actual policies (assuming he gets elected) reflect those sentiments.

      Comment


      • Re: Trump to win?

        Originally posted by davidstvz View Post
        I read this the other day. I think various people exist that fit the quote description, but Hedges is taking all the worst traits of a minority of people and acting as if there are more such people than there are. It's certainly disingenuous to act as if all of Trumps supporters fit the description here. And while Trump may be happy to have the support of such people, I would be shocked if his actual policies (assuming he gets elected) reflect those sentiments.
        yes and no imo. trump disavows the violence of his crowds, but otoh says how he'd like to punch someone in the face. i don't think all his supporters match hedges description, but some do. BUT, e.g., you also have trump saying he'd like to "open up" the libel laws, i.e. make it easier to sue someone who says something about you that you don't like. he's authoritarian in his thinking and the polling has shown that an attraction to authoritarian thinking is the major common denominator of his supporters.

        i certainly don't agree with everything in hedge's article, but i think there's a lot there worth thinking about. and i certainly agree with the diagnosis that the white working class' support for trump [AND FOR SANDERS] is in a big way about a rejection of "free" trade, and an embrace of protectionism. paul krugman had a little piece on his blog at the nyt recently about trade. he pointed out that the analyses were that everyone could win from free trade PROVIDED there was provision for redistribution of some of the gains to compensate the losers in every deal. of course we know how that's worked out.

        Comment


        • Re: Trump to win?

          Originally posted by jk View Post
          Chris Hedges

          The Revenge of the Lower Classes and the Rise of American Fascism

          College-educated elites, on behalf of corporations, carried out the savage neoliberal assault on the working poor. Now they are being made to pay. Their duplicity—embodied in politicians such as Bill and Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama—succeeded for decades. These elites, many from East Coast Ivy League schools, spoke the language of values—civility, inclusivity, a condemnation of overt racism and bigotry, a concern for the middle class—while thrusting a knife into the back of the underclass for their corporate masters. This game has ended.

          There are tens of millions of Americans, especially lower-class whites, rightfully enraged at what has been done to them, their families and their communities. They have risen up to reject the neoliberal policies and political correctness imposed on them by college-educated elites from both political parties: Lower-class whites are embracing an American fascism....


          The Democrats are playing a very dangerous game by anointing Hillary Clinton as their presidential candidate. She epitomizes the double-dealing of the college-educated elites, those who speak the feel-your-pain language of ordinary men and women, who hold up the bible of political correctness, while selling out the poor and the working class to corporate power....

          Richard Rorty in his last book, “Achieving Our Country,” written in 1998, presciently saw where our postindustrial nation was headed.

          Many writers on socioeconomic policy have warned that the old industrialized democracies are heading into a Weimar-like period, one in which populist movements are likely to overturn constitutional governments. Edward Luttwak, for example, has suggested that fascism may be the American future. The point of his book The Endangered American Dream is that members of labor unions, and unorganized unskilled workers, will sooner or later realize that their government is not even trying to prevent wages from sinking or to prevent jobs from being exported. Around the same time, they will realize that suburban white-collar workers—themselves desperately afraid of being downsized—are not going to let themselves be taxed to provide social benefits for anyone else.

          At that point, something will crack. The nonsuburban electorate will decide that the system has failed and start looking around for a strongman to vote for—someone willing to assure them that, once he is elected, the smug bureaucrats, tricky lawyers, overpaid bond salesmen, and postmodernist professors will no longer be calling the shots. A scenario like that of Sinclair Lewis’ novel It Can’t Happen Here may then be played out. For once a strongman takes office, nobody can predict what will happen. In 1932, most of the predictions made about what would happen if Hindenburg named Hitler chancellor were wildly overoptimistic.


          -----
          the whole article is really worth reading, unfortunately.
          There's a difference between a strong leader and a strongman. Is the writer worried that Trump will disband Congress? Does anyone here think that would happen? We've already had Congress relinquish their Constitutionally-mandated responsibility to the President, e.g. when they gave Bush carte blanc to invade the Middle East without having the guts to declare war.

          There's a difference between social fascism and economic fascism. According to Wikipedia's definition of economic fascism, we've had it for quite awhile already. It's your sig, jk:

          Fascism operated from a Social Darwinist view of human relations. The aim was to promote superior individuals and weed out the weak.[6] In terms of economic practice, this meant promoting the interests of successful businessmen while destroying trade unions and other organizations of the working class.[7] Fascist governments encouraged the pursuit of private profit and offered many benefits to large businesses, but they demanded in return that all economic activity should serve the national interest.[8] Historian Gaetano Salvemini argued in 1936 that fascism makes taxpayers responsible to private enterprise, because "the State pays for the blunders of private enterprise... Profit is private and individual. Loss is public and social."[9] ...
          I am worried about where we are in the historical cycle. We're ripe for dictatorship, for a strongman savior figure. I don't know if it will be Socialist, Fascist, something else-ist. But I do rankle though when, after decades of economic fascism, endless wars and the gutting of the middle-class have taken us to the brink of disaster, people are warning that Trump is the Beast.

          I think he's a Nationalist and a Capitalist. Not sure if he's a Fascist. He might indeed become the disastrous dictator people fear, or he might be the last chance to prevent that disastrous dictator from appearing in the next election cycle if things continue as they are. I look at the writers and the pundits, at what their allegiances are, and what, if anything, they stand to lose if he wins.

          Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

          Comment


          • Re: Trump to win?

            in many threads and many times for several years i've expressed the opinion that we are recapitulating the 1930's, with the understanding that - as marx said - history repeats itself, the first time as tragedy, the second time as farce. so i just read that trump's chicago rally tonight was just cancelled because of security concerns, as violence broke out between his supporters and various protesters. the times webpage displayed some muslim women with arms upraised in celebration as they learned the rally was cancelled.

            Originally posted by nytimes
            One protester in North Carolina this week was sucker-punched by a rally attendee. Mr. Trump, the front-runner in the race for the Republican presidential nomination, has insisted he does not condone the violence but that in the “good old days,” protesters were roughed up to keep them in line.
            so this stirred some memories from my historical readings, and i looked it up:

            In the mid-1920s, the [nazi] party engaged in electoral battles in which Hitler participated as a speaker and organizer,
            [b] as well as in street battles and violence between the Rotfrontkämpferbund and the Nazi's Sturmabteilung (SA).

            i am not trying to say that trump is like hitler, btw. i think - more fitting to our theme of farce - his closest comparator is silvio berlusconi with both his forza italia and his bunga bunga parties. [2 different types of party] maybe with a touch of mussolini.
            Last edited by jk; March 11, 2016, 09:21 PM.

            Comment


            • Re: Trump to win?

              The left is attempting is attempting to shut down free speech through violence and massive protests. Chicago tonight is no different from Chicago in 1968.

              The left gave us Nixon in 1968 and their futile efforts will result in Trump in 2016.

              Comment


              • Re: Trump to win?

                Thomas Frank...

                "A map of Trump support may coordinate with racist Google searches, but it coordinates even better with de-industrialization and despair, with the zones of economic misery that 30 years of Washington’s free-market consensus have brought the rest of America."

                Frank links to this video...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3ttxGMQOrY which has 3 million views and Trump is talking about.

                Which takes you back to Hedges...

                "There is only one way left to blunt the yearning for fascism coalescing around Trump. It is to build, as fast as possible, movements or parties that declare war on corporate power, engage in sustained acts of civil disobedience and seek to reintegrate the disenfranchised—the “losers”—back into the economy and political life of the country. This movement will never come out of the Democratic Party."

                It is worth re-watching Ken Burns documentary on Huey Long. I think it's the best thing Burns ever made. The most fascinating parts are watching ordinary folks explain why they loved or hated the guy.

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iGxjtlKVok

                Comment


                • Re: Trump to win?

                  Originally posted by vt View Post
                  The left is attempting is attempting to shut down free speech through violence and massive protests.
                  I'm not sure where you see "the left" here, vt. And massive is not exactly the word I'd use to describe a little scrap between a few testosterone fueled young men.

                  Facile and ideologically driven attempts to rewrite the events of 1968 are laughably transparent. In 68 the young protesters were up against the very real prospect of being sent to VietNam and made party to an ongoing war crime and atrocity. Thousands of Vietnamese were being killed each month, as were hundreds of Americans. A undergraduate class site at UC Boulder serves as a good source for others needing remediation on the history.

                  It's hard to say with precision since the course of history was altered by antidemocratic forces, but it seems clear that by midnight on June 5, 1968 the left's first choice for President was RFK.



                  Since he would be assassinated minutes later, the convention saw the surviving left candidate Eugene McCarthy and the antiwar plank representing him voted down by the Democratic Party elites, giving the nomination to the center-right establishment candidate Hubert Humphrey. That news, along with the yeoman's work of agent provocateurs operating under the auspices of the Chicago Police and feds, lay the groundwork for the police riot that followed.



                  Folks should read up on who did what by way of dirty tricks campaigns in 1968 and then reflect on vt's comment about Nixon.

                  Originally posted by vt View Post
                  Chicago tonight is no different from Chicago in 1968. The left gave us Nixon in 1968 and their futile efforts will result in Trump in 2016.
                  I'm not willing to simply assume the videos present a genuine event and not some street theater ginned up by the private cloak and dagger boys on the GOP payroll. I mean, they had t-shirts printed up, for chrissakes. How does one "infiltrate" an event with SS protection of presidential candidates with intent to make mischief?

                  I guess we could expect Marco and Cruz to blame it on Trump, but that only makes it all seems more pat and scripted.

                  And like all conventional attacks on Trump (and this is oh-so conventional), it seems bound to backfire. I think should this continue, it will only embolden the racialist and neofascist elements of Trump's support and push him even higher, farther, faster.

                  It's almost like that's really the point of all of this.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Trump to win?

                    Originally posted by vt View Post
                    The left is attempting is attempting to shut down free speech through violence and massive protests. Chicago tonight is no different from Chicago in 1968.
                    So, do you imagine "The Left" having planning meetings where they discuss "How can we shut down free speech?" "How about violence?" "Let's incite some dupes on the ground!" ?

                    Or maybe it's just that bad things tend to happen when you have angry, disenfranchised people in crowds.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Trump to win?

                      LazyBoy,

                      There are angry disenfranchised people on both sides of the political spectrum. This is exacerbated by both political parties.

                      And yes the left does plan how to shut down free speech:

                      http://www.infowars.com/soros-funded...ce-in-chicago/

                      And this:

                      http://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/politics...Is-a-Sacrament

                      "A liberal pundit is calling out her fellow liberals for their growing intolerance, especially when it comes to conservative and Christian viewpoints.Kirsten Powers, a Fox News contributor and USA Today columnist, says the country is moving in an authoritarian direction, which endangers free speech and even free thought.
                      She writes about the trend in her new book, The Silencing: How the Left is Killing Free Speech."

                      The right has done it too in the past:

                      http://politicaldictionary.com/words/nattering-nabobs-of-negativism/

                      Comment


                      • Re: Trump to win?

                        Woody, I have no doubt that Trump's having a speech at the University of Illinois in Chicago would be a win- win. If few protesters show up, he is shown drawing a large crowd of his people in Obama's home town.

                        If too many protesters show up and do shut it down, this only enhances Trump's appeal to his base, and some wavering independents that could be turned off by the shutting down of free assembly.

                        It's all planned on both sides.

                        I have personally witnessed SDS trying to takeover liberal groups that were truly helping people.The same thing likely happens on the conservative side.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Trump to win?

                          Originally posted by vt View Post
                          Chicago tonight is no different from Chicago in 1968.
                          That's one of the top ten most absurd assertions ever posted on this site.
                          I don't believe you believe that.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Trump to win?

                            Originally posted by Thailandnotes View Post
                            That's one of the top ten most absurd assertions ever posted on this site.
                            I don't believe you believe that.
                            Thailandnotes, I hate to remind someone who clearly can think for himself of something so basic, but he did just cite Alex Jones' Infowars and CBN as though they're actual news sources. Sadly, this is an indicator that he probably does believe it, in spite of how mindbogglingly stupid such garbage appears to anyone who has studied history. Since only the most minimal study is required to identify such obvious propaganda, he must clearly writing without the benefit of even that.

                            When one encounters such one-sided credulity, it's often best to simply deny it the dignity of a reply. I find the "ignore" function to be quite helpful in this.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Trump to win?

                              Originally posted by Thailandnotes View Post
                              That's one of the top ten most absurd assertions ever posted on this site.
                              I don't believe you believe that.
                              Of the top 10 most absurd comments in the last year I'm fairly sure vt holds the decathlon in that department. I have him on ignore except in Rant and Rave where I feel free to express myself....

                              Comment


                              • Re: Trump to win?

                                Sure CBN and Infowars are certainly not credible but neither is the rest of the media. No one listens to them anymore either. There is NO source to turn to for objectivity.

                                http://www.gallup.com/poll/185927/am...rical-low.aspx

                                The media lies and they spouts propaganda.

                                Were any of you adults in the 1960's? There was anger then, and there is anger now. There were army troops and curfews in D.C. and other cities after Martin Luther King was killed. Then we lost Robert Kennedy in June, and he would have won the election.

                                Chicago sealed it and Nixon won a close race.

                                Chicago and other growing protests will seal the Democrat's chances. But Trump and his vile comments will seal the chances of the Republicans.

                                The people hate both parties and they are very angry. Unless we see a ticket like Warner-Webb the damage may be severe to the nation.
                                Yet the leading candidates of both parties are deeply unpopular to independents who determine the winner.

                                The new President is probably not yet in the race and may be an independent (not Bloomberg).

                                The nation is deeply divided and hates the elites on both sides. Bernie and Donald are not the answer. The people are yelling for someone to unite the nation.

                                Events have already began to unravel. There is still a chance for an independent to get on the ballots and to win the election. Stay tuned and suspend belief.
                                Last edited by vt; March 13, 2016, 09:51 PM.

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