Help Me Out

[c1ue]

Re: Help Me Out

Dried food is a rip off.

Chunky soup has a shelf life of 3-4 years and costs much less than dried food.

Dried food: $22/day (ouch)

Chunky soup & co. $6/day.

Largo,

Dried food has the advantage of being light.

After all, if TSHTF, you may have to run. Trying going very far with 1 month of Chunky's soup on your back.

But your point about cost is a good one.

You don't necessarily have to buy expensive freeze dried stuff.

Just make Jerky & Pemmican. Go to the store and buy several large round roasts or some other cheap beef.

Buy a couple of good knives and a sharpener, and spices. Some fruit: blueberries, mangos, whatever's on sale too.

Cut roasts into as thin a strip as you can. Dust with salt and spices, then put on trays in oven on lowest setting for 12 hours. You should wind up with a whole bunch of very hard, thin strips of meat. They should be hard enough to sharpen and stick someone with.

Take the trimmed fat and what not, pound and/or blend with salt, spices and fruit.

That should last you for a while and it is light. Shouldn't cost you more than $100 for a couple month's worth - excluding hardware cost.

[GRG55]

Re: Help Me Out

whatever you do, don't follow my lead and park your money under your house... along with your truck.

Well that's one less F150 for Mega to whine about...

[Basil]

Re: Help Me Out

I abhor cars, so that will not be a problem! :p I am a rather frugal person, but my desire for independence necessitates more spending than I would like; however, it is a trade-off. I will take your advice when it comes to inflation hedges.

Alas, that is why I am so concerned about being able to afford independence! Cannot get a rich wife living with your parents. :rolleyes:

Thank you.

Freedom and independence have many varieties, one of them is being independent of how people perceive living with one's parents.

I lived with my mother through most of college and loved it. My mother was very unobtrusive and let me do my own thing.

I then lived with my grandfather for a few years while in graduate school. It was great. Between going to a college where my mother worked for full tuition benefits and living at home, I saved well over 100k and was thus financially independent far sooner than most of my peers.

It would be interesting to go back and calculate all the money I saved for approximately seven years during which many of my peers paid rent and utilities but I did not. My grandfather also purchased all of the food so long as I did the shopping, so there is another big chunk of change. Calculate all of the interest on this, and we are talking about a big nut. I also had a chunk of GE that I would have sold to make ends meet, but instead held until 2001-2, when I sold it for a tidy sum.

Anyways, I realize every situation is different. But the amount of money you can save by living with your parents is not to be sneezed at. In addition, the opportunity to develop an adult relationship with your parents is invaluable, and something that will be quite useful when in later years you need to help them through difficult transitions.

[BadJuju]

Re: Help Me Out

Anyways, I realize every situation is different. But the amount of money you can save by living with your parents is not to be sneezed at. In addition, the opportunity to develop an adult relationship with your parents is invaluable, and something that will be quite useful when in later years you need to help them through difficult transitions.

Perhaps, but living with my parents necessitates me being a social recluse. I am tired of not having a girlfriend and stuff.

[tombat1913]

Re: Help Me Out

Dried food is a rip off.

Chunky soup has a shelf life of 3-4 years and costs much less than dried food.

Dried food: $22/day (ouch)

Chunky soup & co. $6/day.

Do the math.

...

Also, guns are nice, but a generator and a water purifier are essential and higher in the list of "must have" than the gun and ammo.

PS: TG1200 generator for $150 or so and swiss water purifier for $100 or so.

My dried food is $4.32 per day. It has a 10 year shelf life. It takes up much less space than chunky soup. It's a complete 2200 kcal per day balanced diet and it's not full of sodium like your chunky soup. If SHTF I need to be on my A-game baby, not hunched over on the toilet after three weeks of eating salty beef stew.

Agreed that water is more important than gun. Not agreed that generator is more important than gun, not even close. Humans (or close ancestors) have survived millions of years without electricity, weapons are inherent.

[tombat1913]

Re: Help Me Out

I second the opinion that you should live as normal as possible. However, I would not be as optimistic as Luke. I think it is more of mindset. I would think of having fun while doing things that increase your safety. That way, you could live a "normal" life without fear eating you up. I would adjust some of my lifestyle choices and free time allocation a little. For example, why don't you put some potatoes in a bucket on the fire escape, and a few tomatoes in the window sill? If you had always thought of learning to shoot, join a friendly gun club - but more for the social aspect. If you don't have an affinity for guns, don't. Have a little fun with being "Sergeant Quartermaster" for your own little barracks. For one week, write down everything you buy and spend money on, esp. grocieries. Then, slowly buy just a few extra items of the grocieries you use the most of. Find some physical activities that you enjoy, and do them a little more than you otherwise would. Continue to be frugal, even if you get some extra income.

This is the "non-doomer soft approach to doom". These are really sensible things at any point in time - the impending sense of doom just makes it prudent to put a little more emphasis on them. Like turning a supertanker around - just a few degrees of change early on will put you in a better spot later down the road.

The problem is that no one has a crystal ball. Lot's of people headed for the hills just before Y2K - which was silly. But as far as I can see, global society is creaking in its fundaments, so I would take this much more seriously than Y2K. I'm a doomer now, which EJ says you shouldn't do. So I do the stuff above to a larger extent: planting more potatoes, making a composting bin, reducing expenses, increasing income etc. No comments on defense & financials.

I think the key thing here is to realize that there is no safe haven. It is all a question of relative safety. And have fun.

Very well said!

[LargoWinch]

Re: Help Me Out

If SHTF I need to be on my A-game baby, not hunched over on the toilet after three weeks of eating salty beef stew.

Well put. I guess the "weight" c1ue mentionned needs to go somewhere. May I ask where you buy your dried food for such a bargain price?

Agreed that water is more important than gun. Not agreed that generator is more important than gun, not even close. Humans (or close ancestors) have survived millions of years without electricity, weapons are inherent.

Ok but what about TMZ?

Remember: no electricity = no hot water, no fridge (very hard to keep food), no heat (in Toronto we have 3+ months at -10C/-20C per year so without a reliable heat source you are dead), the bonus is the oven and light.

Having said that, I must say that I agree, especially in the early stages of SHTF; over the long run however, I have no doubt that I would learn to like my generator as much as my wife.

[Spartacus]

Re: Help Me Out

Perhaps, but living with my parents necessitates me being a social recluse. I am tired of not having a girlfriend and stuff.

go behind their backs.

Or (the preferable route) don't try to hide it - feature it. Have fun with it. Make sneaking behind your parents into a game for you & your GF - like you're a team trying to pull a caper. Some girls LOVE that kind of stuff.

PS - how do you know Jesus was Italian (I've also heard Irish and Indian) -

Who else lives with their mother til they're 30?

[BadJuju]

Re: Help Me Out

go behind their backs.

Or (the preferable route) don't try to hide it - feature it. Have fun with it. Make sneaking behind your parents into a game for you & your GF - like you're a team trying to pull a caper. Some girls LOVE that kind of stuff.

PS - how do you know Jesus was Italian (I've also heard Irish and Indian) -

Who else lives with their mother til they're 30?

Heh, thanks for the encouragement, but it is more about the fact that I'm still living with a parent at 23 that I find discouraging

[Fiat Currency]

Re: Help Me Out

May I ask where you buy your dried food for such a bargain price?

You might want to look here ...

http://www.readyreservefoods.com/index.html

[Spartacus]

Re: Help Me Out

If you want to get really cheap, try this

1. protein (get lots) - search online for "hemp protein isolate". I've seen it $3 per kilo. Tastes like absolute crap. Hemp is better than pea - the pea protein comes close to making me retch. Milk protein isolate almost tastes OK and may be had for $11 per kilo. Remember that cheap meat cuts, say $3 per pound, are still 70 % water. You get (1000g - 700 grams water - 100g fat) = 200 grams protein. The 1kg milk protein isolate will give you 1kg of protein. Cheaper than cheap meat, cheaper than eggs, cheaper than retail milk ...

2. fat - get some suet for free off a local butcher shop. Render the fat off (boil the suet, toss out the left over collagen, keep the fat). See "fight club" for hints. don't make friends with a liposuction doc, thou

3. carbs - the human body "needs" almost zero carbs so I've never looked for ultra-cheap cabs, but sacks of wheat are pretty cheap, aren't they?

4. some mutivitamin/mineral. If you eat no carbs you may not need vitamin C. Glucose uses the same transport mechanisms as vitamin C, so if you have lots of glucose (potatoes, rice, wheat) you are clobbering the vitamin-C handling systems and you need more vitamin C. without carbs you may not need any vitamin C, like the Inuit and Yupik could go their whole lives without any vegetable source of vitamin C, though some livers have some vitamin C. You DO need some fat. Pritikin was WRONG. If you eat lots of protein and almost zero fat you may need lots of extra vitamins A and D.

Well put. I guess the "weight" c1ue mentionned needs to go somewhere. May I ask where you buy your dried food for such a bargain price?

[LargoWinch]

Re: Help Me Out

If you want to get really cheap, try this

1. protein (get lots) - search online for "hemp protein isolate". I've seen it $3 per kilo. Tastes like absolute crap. Hemp is better than pea - the pea protein comes close to making me retch. Milk protein isolate almost tastes OK and may be had for $11 per kilo. Remember that cheap meat cuts, say $3 per pound, are still 70 % water. You get (1000g - 700 grams water - 100g fat) = 200 grams protein. The 1kg milk protein isolate will give you 1kg of protein. Cheaper than cheap meat, cheaper than eggs, cheaper than retail milk ...

2. fat - get some suet for free off a local butcher shop. Render the fat off (boil the suet, toss out the left over collagen, keep the fat). See "fight club" for hints. don't make friends with a liposuction doc, thou

3. carbs - the human body "needs" almost zero carbs so I've never looked for ultra-cheap cabs, but sacks of wheat are pretty cheap, aren't they?

4. some mutivitamin/mineral. If you eat no carbs you may not need vitamin C. Glucose uses the same transport mechanisms as vitamin C, so if you have lots of glucose (potatoes, rice, wheat) you are clobbering the vitamin-C handling systems and you need more vitamin C. without carbs you may not need any vitamin C, like the Inuit and Yupik could go their whole lives without any vegetable source of vitamin C, though some livers have some vitamin C. If you eat lots of protein and almost zero fat you may need lots of extra vitamins A and D.

Spartacus, that is very insightfull, thank you. I think you should open a "Toronto's Hells Kitchen for Doomer".

I must admit that the "fat" section is grossing me out a bit. What about I stock-up on nuts and we call it quits?

I happens to start my day with a blend of Soy Protein, Fruit and Skim Milk with Multivitamins/Omega thrown in the mix. I have been at that for 5 years or so.

Since I use alot of Soy Protein, I guess it would make sense to stock-up on that so thats its a win-win: Doom or not, I use it anyway.

[Spartacus]

Re: Help Me Out

The suet thing sounds gross but it's really quite good in the end.

I used to make pemmican with that beef fat. Tasted great.

Spartacus, that is very insightfull, thank you. I think you should open a "Toronto's Hells Kitchen for Doomer".

I must admit that the "fat" section is grossing me out a bit. What about I stock-up on nuts and we call it quits?

fair enough, BUT ... lots of the fats in nuts are polyunsaturates. Much more likely to become free radicals and/or tarry. Flax (Linseed) oil is famous for going tarry and full of free radicals after just a couple of weeks. Linoneum used to be made of flax oil because it turns into a tarry sludge pretty quick.

As a good example, you have to store pine and maccadamia nuts in a fridge, they go bad so quick.

The hemp and pea proteins are actually reported to be good for bulking in regular, salty food recipes, just really bad by themselves.

I would be doing all this for storage right now (I'm doing it for cheap eats), if I could afford a place bigger than a shoebox.

[c1ue]

Re: Help Me Out

The other thing to keep in mind is that Soy protein alone is a bad long term diet.

There are parts missing - if you're only using it for a month or two, likely no problem.

But longer term you end up hurting yourself.

The good thing about beef is that you don't need to worry about any of that.

As for fat - when you're starving to death, fat is a good thing.

When you're sitting in front of a TV/computer 15 hours a day, lots of fat is a bad thing.

Its all relative.

[tombat1913]

Re: Help Me Out

Well put. I guess the "weight" c1ue mentionned needs to go somewhere. May I ask where you buy your dried food for such a bargain price?

http://www.efoodsdirect.com

Ok but what about TMZ?

Remember: no electricity = no hot water, no fridge (very hard to keep food), no heat (in Toronto we have 3+ months at -10C/-20C per year so without a reliable heat source you are dead), the bonus is the oven and light.

Having said that, I must say that I agree, especially in the early stages of SHTF; over the long run however, I have no doubt that I would learn to like my generator as much as my wife.

Ideally you have both the generator and some form of personal protection. In my view the gun isn't so much for initial looting or riots or things of that nature, it's for the slow steady increase in crime rates as unemployment continues to rise fairly quickly. To me it seems that economic turmoil is more likely to cause rising crime rates than power outages. However, should the condition become so dire that even the power grid is impeded then certainly we wouldn't be able to count on going down to the local gas station and filling up 5 gallon cans either, so if you're depending on that generator to keep yourself from freezing to death when vital infrastructure goes down then I hope you have 3+ months worth of fuel on hand.