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  • Canada headed to the polls...

    The Prime Minister of Canada confirmed today the worst kept secret in Ottawa...the nation is going to the polls on October 14 (the day after the Canadian Thanksgiving holiday), a 37 day campaign before they choose a new federal government.

    There is a substantial difference in political platforms (by Canadian standards) as the opposition Liberal Party earlier this year announced a "climate change" motivated carbon tax policy they call the "Green Shift".
    The Green Shift proposes taxes on hydrocarbon transport and heating fuels (excluding gasoline) with the money being doled out by a "new" Liberal Federal Government to favoured "green/renewable/clean" energy alternatives [apologies for the sounds of wretching coming from this keyboard].

    The natural resources/oil producing western part of the country sees this as another transfer of wealth from west to east, as it is quite certain that the vast majority of the government funds will be doled out in Quebec (home province of the Liberal leader) and vote-rich Ontario. This is shaping up to be one of the most divisive elections since the Pierre Trudeau Liberals brought us the 1980 National Energy Policy, which helped smash the economy of western Canada for more than a decade.

    Interestingly, the provincial government in British Columbia brought in a "green" [carbon] tax on gasoline that initially had broad public support, based on the polling that was done as the policy was being developed. Now that BC drivers are experiencing first hand the cost of "saving the environment", support for the carbon tax has plummeted and to its dismay the government is in a wee spot o'trouble. It's possible the Federal Liberal Party will discover the same reaction as they are now stuck having to campaign against the Conservative Party's platform of "lower taxes, control government spending & avoid budget deficits" (Canada is the only G7 nation that has consistently run budget surpluses in the last decade).

    I think this election could be a real litmus test of how much voter support climate-change related tax policies are likely to receive in developed nation democracies as the global economy slows and inflation settles in for a long-term visit. If carbon taxes cannot be sold to the "kinder, gentler, soft and cuddly" voters of Canada, I seriously question how they'll play in places like the UK, France, and the USA.

    Regardless, the campaign promises to be nasty, brutish and short (to paraphrase Thomas Hobbes)...quite possibly the preferable way to run any election campaign??
    Harper, Dion begin campaign heralding 'clear' and 'stark' choice for Oct. 14 vote


    Norma Greenaway and Andrew Mayeda, Canwest News Service

    Published: 9:10 am
    OTTAWA -- Prime Minister Stephen Harper pulled the plug on his own minority government on Sunday, setting off a national election campaign that will send voters to the polls on Oct. 14 at a cost of about $300 million.

    Harper said the campaign will give voters a choice "between clear direction or uncertainty" at a time of global economic trouble, and said his government's record proves it will be a sound steward in the future.
    Last edited by GRG55; September 07, 2008, 10:51 AM.

  • #2
    Re: Canada headed to the polls...

    Unlike Britans Gordon Brown this guy is SMART!
    He knows that a MEGA recession IS coming and best to get out & vote him back in now rather than wait till he toast!

    Mike

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Canada headed to the polls...

      transport fuels EXCLUDING GASOLINE? so consumers won't feel it at the pump but it will be incorporated in the price of all goods moved by truck, non-electrified train, and boat or barge? sneaky, but a step towards a general carbon tax, i suppose.

      when you talk of the alternative energy supports, are these to be tax or investment credits available to any entrepreneur, or [as you seem to suggest] grants-in-aid to chosen enterprises?

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Canada headed to the polls...

        Originally posted by Mega View Post
        wait till he toast!

        Mike

        Haha Mega, you got a funky moniker cause of ME

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Canada headed to the polls...

          Originally posted by jk View Post
          transport fuels EXCLUDING GASOLINE? so consumers won't feel it at the pump but it will be incorporated in the price of all goods moved by truck, non-electrified train, and boat or barge? sneaky, but a step towards a general carbon tax, i suppose.

          when you talk of the alternative energy supports, are these to be tax or investment credits available to any entrepreneur, or [as you seem to suggest] grants-in-aid to chosen enterprises?
          The Green Shift document starts off declaring "Climate change is the greatest ecological challenge of this generation". And on the face of it the Liberal Party's Green Shift would appear to strike all the right chords; tax "pollution, greenhouse gas emissions and waste" while reducing taxes on "income, investment and innovation".

          The gasoline exclusion addresses the main political vulnerability of any carbon tax, while raising taxes on jet fuel and diesel is being sold as an appropriate tax on "businesses that pollute", with the accompanying promise that the "government will help these companies to adopt new technologies and become more efficient". In Canada that's code for sprinkling gobs of cash among the favoured few.

          To deal with the remaining political fallout from creating a new set of taxes, the Liberals have stuffed their Green Shift with a hodge podge of things, none of which appear to have anything to do with climate change, and everything to do with that age old political passtime: Buying Votes.

          These include a "universal child tax benefit", an $1850 "refundable employment credit", an "enriched Working Income Tax Benefit", a "refundable Disability Tax Credit", a "Green Rural Credit", and a $1000 increase [to $7000] in the Northern Residents Deduction. On it goes for pages and pages. Accelerated Capital Cost Allowances for "green technologies", "Better" (sic) R&D incentives, breaks for small business, breaks for corporations, and a $1 Billion Advanced Manufacturing and Prosperity Fund.

          Based on a long history of federal Liberal Governments, no one looking at this objectively is under any illusions. It will increase the costs of the entire resource sector (which is predominantly based in western Canada, a region where the Liberals have for decades had trouble electing anyone) to the benefit of the Toronto/Ottawa centred FIRE economy interests which funds it. To the degree that any central Canada businesses are hurt such as perennial favourite Quebec-based Bombardier (maker of Learjets, Canadair regional jets, deHavilland Canada turbo-props, and all manner of commuter trains, as well as those famous yellow Ski-doos and Sea-doos - ALL of which run on hydrocarbons), there will be more direct grants and non-refundable "loans" of the sort the company apparently cannot survive without in good times or bad.

          Ohhhhh Canada

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Canada headed to the polls...

            Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
            The Prime Minister of Canada confirmed today the worst kept secret in Ottawa...the nation is going to the polls on October 14 (the day after the Canadian Thanksgiving holiday), a 37 day campaign before they choose a new federal government.

            There is a substantial difference in political platforms (by Canadian standards) as the opposition Liberal Party earlier this year announced a "climate change" motivated carbon tax policy they call the "Green Shift".
            The Green Shift proposes taxes on hydrocarbon transport and heating fuels (excluding gasoline) with the money being doled out by a "new" Liberal Federal Government to favoured "green/renewable/clean" energy alternatives [apologies for the sounds of wretching coming from this keyboard].

            The natural resources/oil producing western part of the country sees this as another transfer of wealth from west to east, as it is quite certain that the vast majority of the government funds will be doled out in Quebec (home province of the Liberal leader) and vote-rich Ontario. This is shaping up to be one of the most divisive elections since the Pierre Trudeau Liberals brought us the 1980 National Energy Policy, which helped smash the economy of western Canada for more than a decade.

            Interestingly, the provincial government in British Columbia brought in a "green" [carbon] tax on gasoline that initially had broad public support, based on the polling that was done as the policy was being developed. Now that BC drivers are experiencing first hand the cost of "saving the environment", support for the carbon tax has plummeted and to its dismay the government is in a wee spot o'trouble. It's possible the Federal Liberal Party will discover the same reaction as they are now stuck having to campaign against the Conservative Party's platform of "lower taxes, control government spending & avoid budget deficits" (Canada is the only G7 nation that has consistently run budget surpluses in the last decade).

            I think this election could be a real litmus test of how much voter support climate-change related tax policies are likely to receive in developed nation democracies as the global economy slows and inflation settles in for a long-term visit. If carbon taxes cannot be sold to the "kinder, gentler, soft and cuddly" voters of Canada, I seriously question how they'll play in places like the UK, France, and the USA.

            Regardless, the campaign promises to be nasty, brutish and short (to paraphrase Thomas Hobbes)...quite possibly the preferable way to run any election campaign??
            Harper, Dion begin campaign heralding 'clear' and 'stark' choice for Oct. 14 vote


            Norma Greenaway and Andrew Mayeda, Canwest News Service

            Published: 9:10 am
            OTTAWA -- Prime Minister Stephen Harper pulled the plug on his own minority government on Sunday, setting off a national election campaign that will send voters to the polls on Oct. 14 at a cost of about $300 million.

            Harper said the campaign will give voters a choice "between clear direction or uncertainty" at a time of global economic trouble, and said his government's record proves it will be a sound steward in the future.
            GRG55; Harper will win. Nothin we can do bout it.

            The problem is Dion in my view. Liberals would have a shot right about now, but pleeeaaase....my English (and charisma -- references available :cool are much greater than Stephane, but a lot worse than Mulroney; so you get the picture...

            Layton; poor guy. A write off.

            ...so what do we have left? Nothing. Well the Bloc, but "hey" tabarnac, dont get me started. Enough said.

            I will pray for a majority govt. that can keep the spending under control and reduce our debt (starting with Afghanistan)...thats all.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Canada headed to the polls...

              Originally posted by LargoWinch View Post
              GRG55; Harper will win. Nothin we can do bout it.

              The problem is Dion in my view. Liberals would have a shot right about now, but pleeeaaase....my English (and charisma -- references available :cool are much greater than Stephane, but a lot worse than Mulroney; so you get the picture...

              Layton; poor guy. A write off.

              ...so what do we have left? Nothing. Well the Bloc, but "hey" tabarnac, dont get me started. Enough said.

              I will pray for a majority govt. that can keep the spending under control and reduce our debt (starting with Afghanistan)...thats all.
              I think we should lock up all the politicians, starting with the Bloc, and let the people organize a decent exchange program. Maybe start with swapping BC wild salmon or prime Alberta beef for some of Dunn's Montreal smoked meat (we'll pass on the poutine, thanks ).

              Years ago my family (in BC) hosted an exchange student from Quebec. Her first question on arriving at Vancouver International was where could she exchange some of her Canadian $ for the "local currency" [now that was a complete 180 for us!]. As (US) comedian Dave Barry is fond of reminding us..."Canada, which is technically a country..."

              Finally, with the Natural Ruling Party peddling the gobbledegook in the Green Shift, maybe you should want Harper to win...

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                Regarding Stephane Dion , he is not well received in his home province. As Largowinch pointed out , not a chance to win , even a minority gov't.

                The weakness of the Bloc Quebecois after 15 years in opposition is favoring the conservatives in Quebec province so it is likely that they will win more seats in Qc and have a majority comes October 14th.

                Dion taxation system and credit system through governement management reminds me of the fire arm registration fiasco. The frictional costs will be so high that the system can not work effectively , even on a theoritical basis.

                As far as poutine is concerned, it is all a matter of taste ....:rolleyes:

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                  I was born and lived in Quebec City until I was 22, but now in Toronto.

                  I hated the Bloc back then and I hate them even more now. What a joke. The most disgusting is that they still talk about a referendum! The party should have been gone forever after the 1st lost, let alone after the 2nd loss in the mid-90s.


                  As for Harper, I guess he falls in the "I have no better option" slot. I hate the Conservative wasteful spending, especially on the military. I don't know about Vancouver, but a walk on Church St. in Toronto should be enough to convince you that some people need the money more than refuelling FA-18 in Afghanistan.

                  Conservative, should reduce the size of the government and pay back the National debt "mortgage style" i.e. 30 or 40 years term. That should be a law so that a future party cannot decide to go on a spending spree. Is someone aware that our population is aging? The US economy is crashing? That we will not ride the commodities boom forever? That we enjoyed our best run in our history and yet only paid a small portion of our debt back?

                  As for the poutine; this should be on the National flag. Atkins is now over and so turn of the millenium, now the coast is clear! Long live poutine! (Maybe I should open my poutine shop in Toronto? - actually I had given it a thought....)

                  For all our International iTulipers, find below a picture of Quebec's most famous meal:
                  (TIP: If you are in Quebec City: ASHTON is the place to taste this oh so good food)

                  Last edited by LargoWinch; September 08, 2008, 08:30 AM. Reason: Clarification regarding poutine and TIP added, yeah cause I am such a nice guy...

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                    Originally posted by LargoWinch View Post
                    I was born and lived in Quebec City until I was 22, but now in Toronto.

                    I hated the Bloc back then and I hate them even more now. What a joke. The most disgusting is that they still talk about a referendum! The party should have been gone forever after the 1st lost, let alone after the 2nd loss in the mid-90s.


                    As for Harper, I guess he falls in the "I have no better option" slot. I hate the Conservative wasteful spending, especially on the military. I don't know about Vancouver, but a walk on Church St. in Toronto should be enough to convince you that some people need the money more than refuelling FA-18 in Afghanistan.

                    Conservative, should reduce the size of the government and pay back the National debt "mortgage style" i.e. 30 or 40 years term. That should be a law so that a future party cannot decide to go on a spending spree. Is someone aware that our population is aging? The US economy is crashing? That we will not ride the commodities boom forever? That we enjoyed our best run in our history and yet only paid a small portion of our debt back?

                    As for the poutine; this should be on the National flag. Atkins is now over and so turn of the millenium, now the coast is clear! Long live poutine! (Maybe I should open my poutine shop in Toronto? - actually I had given it a thought....)

                    For all our International iTulipers, find below a picture of Quebec's most famous meal:
                    (TIP: If you are in Quebec City: ASHTON is the place to taste this oh so good food)


                    Largo: I am no fan of how this "war on terror" is being conducted, and no argument from me that there's a lot of people in our country, including our aboriginal communities, that need the money/help, but would make the following observations:
                    1. Let's remember which federal political party got us into Afghanistan in the first bloody place;
                    2. Let's remember which federal political party continuously starved the military of the funds needed to maintain its aging equipment (the Sea King helicopters that are supposed to be protecting our frigates are older than the pilots flying them), not to mention single-handedly totally fzcked up the much needed replacement of our coastal Search and Rescue helicopters;
                    3. Our unmanned surveillance drones [bought by the Liberals] were incapable of operation at the altitudes in Afghanistan; every one of them was lost by crashing;
                    4. We have no CF-18s (the Canadian version of the McDonnell Douglas F/A-18) stationed in Afghanistan;
                    5. Our troop transport helicopters (the Griffons) are also incapable of operating in that theatre, and so they all remain firmly on Canadian soil, while our troops go without adequate air support, and now nearly 100 of them have also been lost. At least the damn Conservatives have tried to do something about that with the Boeing Chinooks that will be deployed, hopefully soon.
                    Canadians need to get over the idea that the Armed Forces is some sort of Boy Scout troop. Recently retired Chief of Defence Staff, Gen Rick Hillier said it best when he shocked Canadians, especially the Ottawa do-gooders, with the statement that the purpose of an army is to kill people. That is the real reason they were sent into Afghanistan, no matter what the politicos in Ottawa (of all parties) want us to believe. Let's either give them the tools they need to do their real job, or get them the hell out of there.

                    I will retract my previous comment about poutine. Actually I love the stuff, but only indulge when in La Belle Province. Anyone who has not been to Quebec City is missing one of the truly magnificent cities on this continent.
                    Last edited by GRG55; September 08, 2008, 09:34 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                      GRG55, the fact that some party made a mistake is not a reason to compound it. If you realize you made a mistake: then get the hell out.

                      Now I understand our military hardware is not the best, hence I agree with you we should buy modern stuff or stay home. I much prefer the later so that we can use these ressources on the working poor on this country and/or pay the debt.

                      I strongly feel that federal debt repayment should be in the top 3 of any party's agenda.

                      Yeah we lost 100 soldiers it is sad and unfortunate. How many Afghan under 5 years of age lost their lives again? How many women? At least the soldier enrolled and knew what to expect.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                        Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
                        Let's either give them the tools they need to do their real job, or get them the hell out of there.
                        I favour the latter, which is one of the reasons I'm voting NDP.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                          One place I used to eat at, every time someone ordered this they would yell "CLEAR !!!"

                          and as a joke they would sometimes give away a set of cardboard and string "cardio paddles".


                          Originally posted by LargoWinch View Post
                          As for the poutine; this should be on the National flag. Atkins is now over and so turn of the millenium, now the coast is clear! Long live poutine! (Maybe I should open my poutine shop in Toronto? - actually I had given it a thought....)

                          For all our International iTulipers, find below a picture of Quebec's most famous meal:
                          (TIP: If you are in Quebec City: ASHTON is the place to taste this oh so good food)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Canada headed to the polls...

                            Originally posted by LargoWinch View Post
                            GRG55, the fact that some party made a mistake is not a reason to compound it. If you realize you made a mistake: then get the hell out.

                            Now I understand our military hardware is not the best, hence I agree with you we should buy modern stuff or stay home. I much prefer the later so that we can use these ressources on the working poor on this country and/or pay the debt.

                            I strongly feel that federal debt repayment should be in the top 3 of any party's agenda.

                            Yeah we lost 100 soldiers it is sad and unfortunate. How many Afghan under 5 years of age lost their lives again? How many women? At least the soldier enrolled and knew what to expect.
                            Damn straight!

                            Comment

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