Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

[Guest]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

No matter, Krakknisse and Rajiv are two very smart guys. I pay my full respects to them both. Krakknisse who only showed up here weeks ago is posting a lot of really condensed wisdom in a lot of his comments. And Rajiv we all know is orbiting right up there in the stratosphere in terms of his breadth of reading, and his personal modesty I find exemplary.

[Rajiv]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

Here is an interview with John McGlynn the author of the piece

[media]http://dissentradio.com/radio/08_03_26_mcglynn.mp3[/media]

Another piece in the Sydney Morning Herald along the same lines

And a discussion of this at the Duckpond - WAR DECLARED?

A particularly relevant quote from the Duckpond

I had not realized until I listened to the interview the significance of the time delay between the application of financial strangulation and the effect Iranians, which may make it impossible to acquire life saving medications. The analogy with aerial warfare does hold in that however precise it may claim to be, civilians are inevitably in the area, and inevitably suffer and get killed, and those who do the killing are remote from the consequences of the act, so there is no human response of remorse or guilt. It is, as Admiral Fallon was reported to have observed, like crushing ants.

The violence of our attitudes and of social forms can be hidden from conscience, however destructive and painful the implications are for “the other”, whoever is so-defined in that role. Imagination is the human weapon for which we have a responsibility to employ against both criminal negligence and war. The duty is not be virtuous, but to act with foresight and be responsible, to recognize our “duty of care” towards other people.

[krakknisse]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

1. Definite: Financial blockade.
2. Suggestive: Attack on Mahdi Army, a strong Shiite player.
3. Suggestive: Admiral Fallon resigns.
4. Speculative: withdrawal of Russian staff at Bushehr autumn 2007.
4. Rumors, just rumors, of an April attack.

We'll have to see. Difficult to be anywhere near certain. How would an Iran attack work out for one's personal investments, in the long and short term?

To this list, I forgot to add:
5. Suggestive: three or four Internet fiber-optic cable breaks in the Middle East, with little in the way of explanation to suggest a purely natural cause.

[touchring]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

i don't believe that a new war is in plan this year, but i do believe that the risk of a terror attack has increased - they would love to shake the market with all the bad news on banking.

[bart]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

...
And Rajiv we all know is orbiting right up there in the stratosphere in terms of his breadth of reading
...

And there are some mild parallels between the current banking actions, and what the U.S. and Japan were doing in the 1930s regarding trade.

[Guest]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

Of course there are parallels Bart. The US "cornering" actions upon Iran via banking are indeed precisely that - fully intended cornering actions.

You may agree however that to extract these actions from the present general context and present them utterly sanitized of any contextual background would constitute "highly edited reportage", which distorts their meaning, let alone any balanced evaluation of their justification.

A very convincing argument can be made that cornering Iran right now is "not constructive", but then the full objectivity of that argument is somewhat discredited if you apparently consciously omit describing as "relevant context" that unequivocal evidence has accrued and dragged on for the past two years +, that the Iranians were indeed systematically bankrolling, arming and training not only the rogue Sadr Militia in Basra who are actively subverting an extremely delicate Iraqi government.

And yes, ANY coherent multi-ethnic government in Iraq is much better than NO government! All of us who favor any solution avoiding the disintegration of Iraq into ethnic factions, please raise your hands! It appears the Iranians have been actively engaged in bankrolling, arming, and training factions who wish to subvert that goal. Hello? Any comments on the scruple or constructiveness of this Iranian aim here?

As if that were not enough to damn the apparently quite reckless Iranian machinations in the region, for good measure they are (quite demonstrably, if you are willing to look) bankrolling, arming and training also the Hezbollah in Lebanon AND Hamas in Gaza? Excuse me, that is fully THREE countries in the region which Iran is actively fostering rogue militias within? Not worth your passing comment as context to your above objections?

Excuse me - you wish to establish objective credentials for critiquing US government's increasingly strenuous efforts to put critical presssure upon Iran, but you don't wish to acknowledge these actions by Iran to foment fully THREE separate rogue militias in THREE separate countries in the region?

What are we wishing to term this kind of activity in the region: "constructive Iranian engagement" perhaps - or is it all fabrication and lies by the lackey US press?? I read around, and I happen to know it's entirely true. Anybody wish to argue otherwise?

Let's hear you guys openly and frankly acknowledge these things are REAL - THEN we can have an objective discussion of what's required or wise to undertake to curtail Iran's out of control support for militias in the region. They are not just standing militias - they are all three ACTIVELY SHOOTING AND BOMBING militias.

I would suggest, it's only by all of us reaching for the truly objective middle ground, that such "misunderstandings" are resolved constructively. Painting the US Govt's actions here as existing in some sort of quixotic limbo, devoid of any contextual basis is nonsense, at least in my view, and you proponents of this "gross US irresponsibility" need to be called fully to account to explain whether you regard the above extenuating circumstances to be "minor details".

[bart]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

Of course there are parallels Bart. The US "cornering" actions upon Iran via banking are indeed precisely that - fully intended cornering actions.

You may agree however that to extract these actions from the present general context and present them utterly sanitized of any contextual background would constitute "highly edited reportage", which distorts their meaning, let alone any balanced evaluation of their justification.

...


I would suggest, it's only by all of us reaching for the truly objective middle ground, that such "misunderstandings" are resolved constructively. Painting the US Govt's actions here as existing in some sort of quixotic limbo, devoid of any contextual basis is nonsense, at least in my view, and you proponents of this "gross US irresponsibility" need to be called fully to account to explain whether you regard the above extenuating circumstances to be "minor details".

Of course its an isolated point and must be viewed within a huge group of other items. "Minor details" do have a disturbing habit of becoming major, and even the term "minor details" itself can be used in a "P.R." way.


But I'm not going to accept your kind offer of commenting on "gross US irresponsibility", not of course due to its relationship to poli (meaning all) and tics (being a bothersome blood sucker) and my well known headgear... :eek: ;)

[Guest]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

You mean the crinkly silver tinted headgear? Very fashionable in certain circles!

Still, my objections are substantive. There are millions of people out there baying and barking away about the 'bloodthirsty" and "grossly irresponsible" US actions regarding Iran.

What does it take to convince these people their objections would be much more persuasive to the mainstream opinion if they carefully weighed the "danger quotient" being contributed in the middle east by Iran bankrolling three militias, all of whom seem to be intermittently in pitched battles in their respective regions.

Not a peep is heard about them from proponents of the "gross US irresponsibility", and this gravely detracts from such critics credibility - at least it does in my view. Iran's "highly adventurous" policy (what you might euphemistically refer to as their "foreign policy") in the region is crying out for someone to require them to cease and desist from provoking further conflict.

Who in their right mind does not imagine an incoming US new President does not understand we need to seek avenues to reduce US commitment to Iraq to prevent the US from doing the fiscal impersonation of a ripe tomato hitting the asphalt at speed in the next few years.

The US has overhwelming reasons to wind this all up. Iran has powerful regional reasons for crippling the US ability to wind it all up with any functioning US sponsored (or even barely US friendly) government left standing in Iraq. Any other interpretation of events there (mad US neocons looking actively to widen the war to Iran directly) is getting blinded by it's ideological "requirement" that the US be displayed as the "sole rogue entity" in this mess. I think that is needlessly pernicious rubbish.

[bart]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

You mean the crinkly silver tinted headgear? Very fashionable in certain circles!

The Wizard lives... and so does Frodo! :cool:

http://www.nowandfutures.com/grins/oz_curtain.wav

(a.k.a., cui bono :p )

[BiscayneSunrise]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

Still, any threat of US attack on Iran is just posturing.

The reason Adm. Fallon resigned because he went public saying an Iran attack was a bad idea and off the table. EVERTHING is always on the table when pressuring someone in negotiations. To say otherwise weakens your position. Good idea to make the Iranians sweat and think there may be consequences to their actions.

Notice that Al-Sadr declared a cease fire yesterday. Reports say that it was US diplomatic pressure that forced Iran to call off their Shia groups in Iraq. Not only was there a threat of US attack on Iran but more importantly, the US was threatening the re-establishment of a Sunni government in Iraq. That would be Iran's worst nightmare.

The irony is that the Iranians, while trying to destabilize Iraq, are inching closer to what they fear the most. If the Iranians would back off trying to de-stabilize Iraq, they would get what it is they desire: a stable, Shia controlled and friendly neighbor to their west.

Too soon to say exactly how this will work out but Al-Sadr agreeing to rejoin the Shia coalition is a step in the right direction.

Bottom line: No US attack on Iran anytime soon.

[GRG55]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

The title of this thread is: "Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th"

That'll make it right during the Formula One race weekend in Bahrain with all the glitterati in town. I doubt it...

[Spartacus]

Re: Paul Craig Roberts / UK news weighs in

http://www.lewrockwell.com/roberts/roberts243.html

Thank god it didn't happen, but ....

[Guest]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

Spartacus -

My most sober opinion of Paul Craig Roberts is that he is a hysterical yapping poodle. His analysis of events is pure mush. You really need to dig up some more reputable, sober-minded critics of current US policy blunders in the ME. The blunders are there, asking for a rational critique, but Craig Roberts is most decidedly not up to the task.

I'm looking at your proclivity to label everything 'fascist' with some curiosity - do you really buy into Craig Roberts rants? Why not try using a few less 'fascist this' and 'fascist that' tags in your critiques and you'll find your observations become far more empowered - to draw in a lot more interest from the centrists among us. This kind of overwrought denunciation of hidden fascism everywhere across the board is just silly.

Of course Iran is actively funding myriad splinter groups - they certainly are not only active in Iraq. Ask Paul Craig Roberts and he'd tell you this is all 'neo-con propaganda'. The man is an idiot, and a pernicious one at that. The sum of his editorial output is mis-informing bilge, in my view.

[phirang]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

God, this is almost as bad as the RBS rumor of a hojillion $ writedown...

[metalman]

Re: Rumors: Iran bombing April 4th-6th

God, this is almost as bad as the RBS rumor of a hojillion $ writedown...

here's to the last non-ideology based econ/finance site left on the internet. when itulip goes... and someday it will, trust me on this... there will be no place left to go. all right wing crap like lew rockwell or left wing crap like alternet.org or mishmash crap with nothing based on good old fashioned apolitical analysis.

sigh. :mad: