BP, its a nightmare!

[touchring]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

That is not how the oil market works. Oil is a fungible product. Those that own it will sell it to someone who needs it closer to the production and then buy the oil that is closer to them. Who owns the oil company is no way relevant. How much they use is.

Does oil pumped out from the oil fields of Sudan and Iran gets exported to Europe? Sudan and Iran are just next to Europe.

Oil is not an end to itself, it facilitates the entire world economy. How many hundred billions a year (not to mention the number of soldiers maimed) does the US spend on its military in the Middle East. How many people in Sudan died because of oil?

The real cost of oil is far higher, probably many times of what the market price per barrel suggests.

[oddlots]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Jesus you guys have stamina. You could outlast all the world's graduate school pub arguments. And no alcohol served far as I can tell. Cudos.

[Slimprofits]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

I fully understand the tendency to lash-out at the messenger, this is a normal response.

It's not about you. It's about the stupid video you posted and I see now finally, eventually saw for what is. Congratulations, Mr. "I'm smarter and more open minded than everyone else". How long did it take you to figure out what some of us saw on the first viewing while you're looking for anything to latch onto to support your latest theory to shove down the throats of people while you proclaim your lone brilliance in the world?

All the shit you've read in the last 6 months, the alternative theories and ways at looking at things? Seen it, read it, done it a million times over. Where were you a decade ago, sucking your thumb? You are not the smartest guy in the room. You don't get "it" and the rest of us are not in the dark.

[oddlots]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Reggie. Here's an idea. Read some H L Mencken. Bauldrillard is an academic artifact of an age that just jumped the shark. You can learn more of relevance to the present situation IMHO from journalists of the 19th and early 20th century than you can from the echo-chamber of the academy.

[Slimprofits]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

I'm just curious when oil starts washing up on beaches, what is Reggie going to say then? It is all fake and those of that don't believe him are the fools, Rachel Maddow videotaped it all in a studio.

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

So, are you saying that:

• who is the messenger matters little, for they can say anything and deceive us all, and
• what is in a digital image matters even less, for it can show anything,
• what does matter is learning certain sciences for by these we may learn what and who to trust or not?

I know of no science sufficiently subtle to bear such a burden.

Yes, that's a fair summation.

As far as the science, it's all in the public domain, just written mostly in double-speak. But it's all learn-able, and this audience is more than capable. It's just really hard to break through all the self-imposed barriers, which always seem to manifest themselves in odd ways, which is already totally evident here by many of the comments. That stuff gets really old after a while.

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

It's not about you. It's about the stupid video you posted and I see now finally, eventually saw for what is. Congratulations, Mr. "I'm smarter and more open minded than everyone else". How long did it take you to figure out what some of us saw on the first viewing while you're looking for anything to latch onto to support your latest theory to shove down the throats of people while you proclaim your lone brilliance in the world?

All the shit you've read in the last 6 months, the alternative theories and ways at looking at things? Seen it, read it, done it a million times over. Where were you a decade ago, sucking your thumb? You are not the smartest guy in the room. You don't get "it" and the rest of us are not in the dark.

Exposing the sham.

But yes, you are correct, I am NOT the smartest guy in the room. However, I am probably the least indoctrinated.

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

As far as the science, it's all in the public domain, just written mostly in double-speak. But it's all learn-able, and this audience is more than capable. It's just really hard to break through all the self-imposed barriers, which always seem to manifest themselves in odd ways, which is already totally evident here by many of the comments. That stuff gets really old after a while.

So far as I can tell, you haven't really told us what this "science" is, at least not in a coherent and useful form from which the rest of us could learn.

However it remains clear to you that any resistance you encounter to our accepting the insights offered by this "science" (whatever those insights might be, which you seem only to allude in double speak) must be do to our self-imposed barriers.

You are continuing to do an excellent job of provoking the very resistance against which you rail.

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

So far as I can tell, you haven't really told us what this "science" is, at least not in a coherent and useful form from which the rest of us could learn.

I've actually already started to identify the impact of the science, by highlighting the source of some of the reactions here to date. But rather than elicit further inquiry, this identification elicits further resistance, which is typical.

However it remains clear to you that any resistance you encounter to our accepting the insights offered by this "science" (whatever those insights might be, which you seem only to allude in double speak) must be do to our self-imposed barriers.

Yes, that's correct, except for the double-speak part.

You are continuing to do an excellent job of provoking the very resistance against which you rail.

If you are so open to "Truth" (as you call it), then how can I provoke resistance? That's illogical.

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Reggie. Here's an idea. Read some H L Mencken. Bauldrillard is an academic artifact of an age that just jumped the shark. You can learn more of relevance to the present situation IMHO from journalists of the 19th and early 20th century than you can from the echo-chamber of the academy.

I don't take seriously people who subscribe to any theory of elitism, no matter how they mask it. It's all the same end-game.

[Fiat Currency]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Only 100 years???

I said 100 years because (per a Select post I made) ....

While this $hit (corruption and currency debasement) has been going on for thousands of years, all sheeple will be lucky to participate in it for 100 years - myself included.

Family units need to figure out how to pass on knowledge and wealth preservation. It's generational.

[Serge_Tomiko]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

In the particular case of the few video frames showing a door opening and closing, on your posted video above, yes there may well not be a tangible baseline that can be validated. Even there, however, my recollection is that warren_c posted some information that improved our understanding of that video.

However in the general case, there often is such a baseline, flowing through a chain of other people whom one has learned to trust in various ways. The Web of Trust in public key cryptography is a specific instance of such a chain of trust. Many honest and capable people have first hand experience with and expert understanding of bits and pieces of the puzzle (heh! - not so much a puzzle as a large church with many stain glassed windows, caught up in a tornado and thus masquerading as a kaleidescope.) For example I personally might have a little bit of first hand knowledge of large U.S. military or intelligence radar stations, or of a few system software internals of some very large computers operated by the U.S. military or intelligence or NASA.

Over time, we may choose to reveal bits and pieces of who we are. We do so selectively, of course, and when and if and to what extent we do so is a matter of our own choosing.

However ... by revealing various selected aspects of our own lives, views and observations which might overlap with aspects of someone else's life, others can come to judge, based on how our view of those aspects compares with their's, the value (or not) of what we say.

If we find ourselves looking at a black and white splotched animal, and if I keep calling it a cow whilst others competent in animal identification keep calling it a calico cat, then I come not to be trusted in matters of animal identification, and by extension, my bird and fish identifications are given little credence as well.

This web of trust shifts over time for each of us. Whereas ten years ago, I trusted Rush Limbaugh for astute political analysis (and even a little bit for economic analysis), nowadays I would only consider his opinion on a few subjects, such as fine cigars and exorbitantly expensive Florida beach property. Forty years ago, I knew first hand (first ear) that Arthur Janszen had designed some fine electrostatic speakers, but I did not know he had a son named Eric. I am now too deaf too appreciate the speakers sound, and too poor to afford them. But his son does some pretty fair work in some other subjects of interest to me now.

A fascinating post cow.

[KGW]

Methane in Large Quantities. . .

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65L6IA20100622

Methane in Gulf "astonishingly high": U.S. scientist

Julie Steenhuysen
CHICAGO
Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:58pm EDT










CHICAGO (Reuters) - As much as 1 million times the normal level of methane gas has been found in some regions near the Gulf of Mexico oil spill, enough to potentially deplete oxygen and create a dead zone, U.S. scientists said on Tuesday.


Texas A&M University oceanography professor John Kessler, just back from a 10-day research expedition near the BP Plc oil spill in the gulf, says methane gas levels in some areas are "astonishingly high."
Kessler's crew took measurements of both surface and deep water within a 5-mile (8 kilometer) radius of BP's broken wellhead.
"There is an incredible amount of methane in there," Kessler told reporters in a telephone briefing.
In some areas, the crew of 12 scientists found concentrations that were 100,000 times higher than normal.
"We saw them approach a million times above background concentrations" in some areas, Kessler said.
The scientists were looking for signs that the methane gas had depleted levels of oxygen dissolved in the water needed to sustain marine life.
"At some locations, we saw depletions of up to 30 percent of oxygen based on its natural concentration in the waters. At other places, we saw no depletion of oxygen in the waters. We need to determine why that is," he told the briefing.
Methane occurs naturally in sea water, but high concentrations can encourage the growth of microbes that gobble up oxygen needed by marine life.
Kessler said oxygen depletions have not reached a critical level yet, but the oil is still spilling into the Gulf, now at a rate of as much as 60,000 barrels a day, according to U.S. government estimates.
"What is it going to look like two months down the road, six months down the road, two years down the road?" he asked.
Methane, a natural gas, dissolves in seawater and some scientists think measuring methane could give a more accurate picture of the extent of the oil spill.
Kessler said his team has taken those measurements, and is hoping to have an estimate soon.
"Give us about a week and we should have some preliminary numbers on that," he said.

[Starving Steve]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Oil is NOT a pollutant, any more than carbon-dioxide is a pollutant. The entire paradigm of the EPA and Greenpeace, the UN, the Sierra Club, and Dr.Chu in U.S. Energy Department is wrong and based upon junk science and total non-science, group-think, and eco-fraud propaganda.

Might it be that BBC and the Obama Administration are WRONG again, just like they were about global warming? Might it be that the American courts have given too much power to the EPA? Might it be that the U.S. courts have made really poor decisions in the past about so-called "pollutants" in the environment like taconite-tailings in Lake Superior, like CO2, and like crude oil?

Dr. Chu: why is crude oil a pollutant? Says who? You? Show us your studies. Why do I even have to ask for transparency here?

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Oil is NOT a pollutant, any more than carbon-dioxide is a pollutant. The entire paradigm of the EPA and Greenpeace, the UN, the Sierra Club, and Dr.Chu in U.S. Energy Department is wrong and based upon junk science and total non-science, group-think, and eco-fraud propaganda.

Might it be that BBC and the Obama Administration are WRONG again, just like they were about global warming? Might it be that the American courts have given too much power to the EPA? Might it be that the U.S. courts have made really poor decisions in the past about so-called "pollutants" in the environment like taconite-tailings in Lake Superior, like CO2, and like crude oil?

Dr. Chu: why is crude oil a pollutant? Says who? You? Show us your studies. Why do I even have to ask for transparency here?

Those who control the creation of our reality get to decide what is a pollutant. We're just supposed to think and act within those frames of orientation, as established by so-called experts, like Dr. Chu. Stepping outside these frames is simply not allowed, and those that do are negatively labeled and thus, marginalized.

Keep us the good question asking, Steve.