BP, its a nightmare!

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

The Youtube clip description provides a link to the original CNN video located on CNN's web site. I suggest those who are confused about the video's authenticity contact CNN and ask them to respond.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2....lution.bp.html

As for those that want to start throwing around the "apologist" attack vectors, I suggest that you do a little research into the foundations of political correctness and sensitivity training, which originated in the Soviet Union and was further developed by US academia. These loaded terms are nothing more than psychological weapons meant to disarm question asking, and it's based in fear propagation and emotional intimidation and castration. The techniques have found their way in our public school system and it's use is repugnant.

[Starving Steve]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Mike: Is it too late to give BP back to Iran?

And from whom is America going to buy its oil from if BP goes bankrupt or pulls-out of US waters?

The first lesson of the coin shop is: "He who holds the gold sets its price."

BP holds the oil, and the Obama Administration is not going to dictate the terms of what oil is going to be worth.

The tort lawyers and the Sierra Club will just add to the price of what oil is going to command.

Why should a company like BP have to sacrafice to drill in US waters if it is crucified for doing so?

The Albertans have a slogan for how BP should deal with the EPA and Obama and that bunch: "Let the Eastern-bastards freeze in the dark!"

[warren_c]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

The Youtube clip description provides a link to the original CNN video located on CNN's web site. I suggest those who are confused about the video's authenticity contact CNN and ask them to respond.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2....lution.bp.html

As for those that want to start throwing around the "apologist" attack vectors, I suggest that you do a little research into the foundations of political correctness and sensitivity training, which originated in the Soviet Union and was further developed by US academia. These loaded terms are nothing more than psychological weapons meant to disarm question asking, and it's based in fear propagation and emotional intimidation and castration. The techniques have found their way in our public school system and it's use is repugnant.

The video proof of your conspiracy was shown to be merely a reflection of a door in a newsroom and now you want to bring in the Soviet Union, US academia, apologist attack vectors, political correctness, and the public school system. Talk about grasping for straws!!! :-)

I am just a simple guy on the internet examining the issues from both sides. I am seeing the crazy people on the environmental side of the issue panic and the crazy people on the side of big oil act desperate and try to blame the other side and obfuscate the issue. I want to separate the wheat from the chaff and see the facts as objectively as possible and conspiracy theories only muddy the water...

I would like you to point out at any point, any of the posts countering your video and on this subject that have used psychological weapons developed in the Soviet Union - lol... The only tools I have used are Occam's razor and some simple observations of the data presented..

The burden of proof is on you to prove that the oil gusher in the GOM is some vast conspiracy by environmentalists to further their agenda.

[warren_c]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Thanks, warren.

welcome pythonic cow

[gnk]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

The video proof of your conspiracy was shown to be merely a reflection of a door in a newsroom and now you want to bring in the Soviet Union, US academia, apologist attack vectors, political correctness, and the public school system. Talk about grasping for straws!!! :-)

I am just a simple guy on the internet examining the issues from both sides. I am seeing the crazy people on the environmental side of the issue panic and the crazy people on the side of big oil act desperate and try to blame the other side and obfuscate the issue. I want to separate the wheat from the chaff and see the facts as objectively as possible and conspiracy theories only muddy the water...

I would like you to point out at any point, any of the posts countering your video and on this subject that have used psychological weapons developed in the Soviet Union - lol... The only tools I have used are Occam's razor and some simple observations of the data presented..

The burden of proof is on you to prove that the oil gusher in the GOM is some vast conspiracy by environmentalists to further their agenda.

Good response Warren - I agree with you.

Upon a second viewing, and using my expert forensic abilities, I have determined that the image I see is Bigfoot walking through that door. Bigfoot, as many are aware, is an extreme enviro-whacko nutjob bent upon destroying industrial civilization as we know it. But honestly, can anyone blame him? Bigfoot is the original tree-hugger. He must be stopped.

Just jokes folks.

[warren_c]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

Good response Warren - I agree with you.

Upon a second viewing, and using my expert forensic abilities, I have determined that the image I see is Bigfoot walking through that door. Bigfoot, as many are aware, is an extreme enviro-whacko nutjob bent upon destroying industrial civilization as we know it. But honestly, can anyone blame him? Bigfoot is the original tree-hugger. He must be stopped.

Just jokes folks.

Thanks gnk.

Lol --- Actually is that building 7 of the WTC being detonated in the background of the live stream recorded from CNN ? hahaha

Disclaimer:: Not making light of the events on September 11th... but the conspiracy theories about what happened that day.

[gnk]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

The Youtube clip description provides a link to the original CNN video located on CNN's web site. I suggest those who are confused about the video's authenticity contact CNN and ask them to respond.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2....lution.bp.html

As for those that want to start throwing around the "apologist" attack vectors, I suggest that you do a little research into the foundations of political correctness and sensitivity training, which originated in the Soviet Union and was further developed by US academia. These loaded terms are nothing more than psychological weapons meant to disarm question asking, and it's based in fear propagation and emotional intimidation and castration. The techniques have found their way in our public school system and it's use is repugnant.

No need to contact CNN. Play the video, and freeze it at exactly 27 seconds in.

Look at the black bands top and bottom of the video. There is no video image on those bands- they frame the video. Yet the door's reflection extends down into the black band on the bottom. Thus, the image you see is not part of the video feed, but a reflection onto the entire glass screen.

[reggie]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

The video proof of your conspiracy was shown to be merely a reflection of a door in a newsroom and now you want to bring in the Soviet Union, US academia, apologist attack vectors, political correctness, and the public school system. Talk about grasping for straws!!! :-)

I was responding to your assertion that someone who posts a video with a door reflection is somehow both a "conspiracy theorist" and a "BP apologist," as stated in your post (quoted below). These are attack vectors and meant to stifle inquiry.

So, now discussion focuses on a conspiracy theory -- instead of the actual disaster. A not so clever misdirection tactic being used by BP apologists...

I am just a simple guy on the internet examining the issues from both sides. I am seeing the crazy people on the environmental side of the issue panic and the crazy people on the side of big oil act desperate and try to blame the other side and obfuscate the issue. I want to separate the wheat from the chaff and see the facts as objectively as possible and conspiracy theories only muddy the water...

I applaud the fact that you want to simply "separate the wheat from the chaff", but there's no need to attack others with empty labels such as "conspiracy theorists, BP apologist, or crazy people".

I would like you to point out at any point, any of the posts countering your video and on this subject that have used psychological weapons developed in the Soviet Union - lol... The only tools I have used are Occam's razor and some simple observations of the data presented..

Word are powerful symbols. And the fact of the matter is that the use of these sorts of load symbols was in fact developed in the Soviet Union. Sorry you're unaware of the history. May I suggest you do some research on the development of "Sensitivity Training", as this will enlighten you on the tactics that you have employed. Further, may I also refer you to Jean Baudrillard's "The System of Objects" for exploration of the importance of symbols in human psychology and in society.

The burden of proof is on you to prove that the oil gusher in the GOM is some vast conspiracy by environmentalists to further their agenda.

Tell me, have you traveled to 5,000ft beneath the sea surface to see the oil gusher for yourself? What part of the Gulf Coast have you traveled to, or what part of the Gulf have you sailed recently. You're relying on controlled imagery for your assessments, and that imagery requires you to trust 3rd party sources. I would guess that you're assumptions have not been validated with any 1st person inputs.

"It is precisely when it appears most truthful, most faithful and most in conformity to reality that the image is most diabolical -- and our technical images, whether they be from photography, cinema or television, are in the overwhelming majority more 'figurative', 'realist', than all the images from the past cultures. It is in its resemblance, not only analogical but technological, that the image is most immoral and perverse."

Quote from the essay "The Evil Demon of Images" by Jean Baudrillard.
http://www.dgp.toronto.edu/~stam/suo...udrillard.html

By the way, after having frozen the images in the video, I can also now see that it is a reflection in a computer monitor. Further, one can actually see the plastic housing of the computer monitor at the very bottom of the image. It's surprising to me that CNN would not simply tap directly in to the video feed. But thanks to those here that pointed out this interpretation, as I missed that upon my initial viewing of this video.

[touchring]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

And from whom is America going to buy its oil from if BP goes bankrupt or pulls-out of US waters?

The first lesson of the coin shop is: "He who holds the gold sets its price."

BP holds the oil, and the Obama Administration is not going to dictate the terms of what oil is going to be worth.

The tort lawyers and the Sierra Club will just add to the price of what oil is going to command.

Why should a company like BP have to sacrafice to drill in US waters if it is crucified for doing so?

The Albertans have a slogan for how BP should deal with the EPA and Obama and that bunch: "Let the Eastern-bastards freeze in the dark!"

China will acquire BP, and in time the oil will be taken off the market, shipped directly to China for their own use - it won't even be for sale.

[warren_c]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

I was responding to your assertion that someone who posts a video with a door reflection is somehow both a "conspiracy theorist" and a "BP apologist," as stated in your post (quoted below). These are attack vectors and meant to stifle inquiry.

What was your purpose for introducing that video to this thread? I am not trying to stifle you or your viewpoint. I really want to know honestly what is the purpose of introducing something tinged with conspiracy in this thread? What knowledge has it added to the the discussion about what is happening in the GOM?

I applaud the fact that you want to simply "separate the wheat from the chaff", but there's no need to attack others with empty labels such as "conspiracy theorists, BP apologist, or crazy people".

Ok, ok. Doth protest too much. I had no idea you would take those words so personally. Those are just words in the english language that I thought most described your agenda and your purpose for posting that video and the 2 real estate brokers? tourist industry pr people? (sic) videos near the beginning of the thread. I could be wrong though. I have humility.. What was your motive for posting those videos and the video tinged with conspiracy?

Was it questioning the status quo view point on what is going on in the GOM or was it to create an alternate narrative of the events in the GOM? I am really curious.. Please enlighten me..

Word are powerful symbols. And the fact of the matter is that the use of these sorts of load symbols was in fact developed in the Soviet Union. Sorry you're unaware of the history. May I suggest you do some research on the development of "Sensitivity Training", as this will enlighten you on the tactics that you have employed. Further, may I also refer you to Jean Baudrillard's "The System of Objects" for exploration of the importance of symbols in human psychology and in society.

I know that words are powerful symbols. Whatever the case is ... I think your introduction of Baudrillard and the use of loaded symbolic language used as psychological warfare by the Soviet Union into this debate is nothing but a straw man that you are creating to argue against, instead of addressing the reality of the the oil gusher in the GOM. I will definitely study loaded symbols and their use by the Soviets in psychological warfare, the history of "sensitivity training" and I will check out the Baudrillard book. Thanks for prompting me to go down that route of inquiry.

FWIW- I am not trained nor educated in the use of symbolic objects for the manipulation of minds . But I am curious about that subject ... however off topic it is in this discussion of the events in the GOM and BP's standing as a going concern in the future. ( I have considered buying BP stock recently)

I am just an average dude who is trying to find accurate information that is not filled with hyperbole and has more depth than the MSM offers about what it going on in the GOM. I saw your posts and thought they were unusual compared to what I usually read on Itulip. I trust most of the people on this site for good, factual information that is not tainted very much by confirmation bias. Your posts stood out from the usual fare that I read here.

Tell me, have you traveled to 5,000ft beneath the sea surface to see the oil gusher for yourself? What part of the Gulf Coast have you traveled to, or what part of the Gulf have you sailed recently. You're relying on controlled imagery for your assessments, and that imagery requires you to trust 3rd party sources. I would guess that you're assumptions have not been validated with any 1st person inputs.

No, I have not been to the GOM recently nor to the location of the gusher 5000 ft beneath the gulf. Have you?

Please allow me to remind you that the ROV feeds recording what is going on, from the site of the gusher are provided by BP.

Are they working in tandem with the environmentalists to paint a bad picture of what is going on in the GOM to further the agenda of the environmentalists and "sensitivity trainers" ?

Have you talked to any one personally from the Gulf of Mexico?

And are you implying that the images and video from the Gulf are all faked by the MSM and TPTB to further some nefarious alternative energy / environmentalist agenda?

By the way, after having frozen the images in the video, I can also now see that it is a reflection in a computer monitor. Further, one can actually see the plastic housing of the computer monitor at the very bottom of the image. It's surprising to me that CNN would not simply tap directly in to the video feed. But thanks to those here that pointed out this interpretation, as I missed that upon my initial viewing of this video.

I am glad that you can see that. Why CNN is not tapping directly into the feed is a good question. But maybe they are doing it this way because the feeds are the intellectual property of BP?
tutalooo reggie!

[touchring]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

I am glad that you can see that. Why CNN is not tapping directly into the feed is a good question. But maybe they are doing it this way because the feeds are the intellectual property of BP?
tutalooo reggie!

I took a quick look at that feed, it looks fake, firstly i can't see the pipe that connects to the Enterprise. Secondly, is crude light brown in color?

Here's the Enterprise ROV feed -
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_inte...ise_ROV_2.html

All the shoutings by Matt Simmons didn't work, so let's try a video? lol

[warren_c]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

I took a quick look at that feed, it looks fake, firstly i can't see the pipe that connects to the Enterprise. Secondly, is crude light brown in color?

Here's the Enterprise ROV feed -
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_inte...ise_ROV_2.html

All the shoutings by Matt Simmons didn't work, so let's try a video? lol

I think that the video in question was recorded before BP placed the LMRP? cap? on the riser? ( I am not sure what the technical terminology is for this stuff is). The feed that most of the MSM networks seem to be running is from SKANDI ROV 1 or 2:
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_inte...andi_ROV1.html

http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_inte...ise_ROV_2.html

Don't get me started on Matt Simmons... lol .. That guy is probably shorting BP or he may have lost his damn mind!!

I found something interesting concerning the Soviet's usage of a nuclear devices to kill gas wells at the The Oil Drum recently though:
http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6616#comment-653641

...Excerpt from Science & Global Security, 1998, Volume7, pp. 1-117

Urtabulak

On December 1,1963, while drilling gas Well No. 11 in the Urtabulak gas field in Southern Uzbekistan about 80 km southeast of Bukhara, control of the well was lost at a depth of 2,450 m. This resulted in the loss of more than 12 million m3 of gas per day through an 8-inch casing, enough gas to supply the needs of a large city, such as St. Petersburg. Formation pressures were about 270-300 atmospheres.

Over the next three years, many attempts were made using a variety of techniques to cap the well at the surface or to reduce the flow and extinguish the flames. However, because the bottom 1,000 m of the casing had not yet been cemented, such attempts led to diversion of the gas into nearby wells and to serious personnel safety problems because of the high H2S content of the gas. Underground attempts were hampered by the fact that the location of the lower portion of the hole had not been logged at the time control was lost.

Finally, in the fall of 1966, a decision was made to attempt closing the well with the use of a nuclear explosive. It was believed that a nuclear explosion would squeeze close any hole located within 25-50 m of the explosion, depending on the yield. Two 44.5-cm (13.5 in) diameter slant wells, Holes No. 1c and 2c, were drilled simultaneously. They were aimed to come as close as possible to Hole No. 11 at a depth of about 1,500 m in the middle of a 200-m-thick clay zone. This depth was considered sufficient to contain the 300-atmosphere pressure in the gas formation below. A number of acoustic and electromagnetic techniques were used to estimate the distance between Hole No 11 and inclined explosive emplacement hole at 1,450 m. The final estimate for the closest distance between Hole No. 11 and Hole No. 1c was 35 +/- 10 m.

The location for the explosive in Hole 1c was cooled to bring it down to a temperature the explosive could withstand. A special 30-kt nuclear explosive developed by the Arzamas nuclear weapons laboratory for this event was emplaced in Hole 1c and stemmed. It was detonated on September 30, 1966. Twenty-three seconds later the flame went out, and the well was sealed. ....

The rest of the report is on the comment linked to on The Oil Drum. In short the idea of using a nuclear device to kill the well, even when taking into account the Soviet's "success" in using them is dubious at best and outright insane at worst.

[touchring]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

So that video was taken after they cut the kinked pipe but before they attached the cap over it? But what's the purpose of showing an old video? Matt Simmons is short a couple hundred thousand or more BP shares.

I think that the video in question was recorded before BP placed the LMRP? cap? on the riser? ( I am not sure what the technical terminology is for this stuff is). The feed that most of the MSM networks seem to be running is from SKANDI ROV 1 or 2:
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_inte...andi_ROV1.html

[Chris Coles]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

The problem as I see it with a nuclear bomb is the effects upon the sea bed under 5,000 feet of water, rather than the possibility of success in sealing the leak.

[GRG55]

Re: BP, its a nightmare!

China will acquire BP, and in time the oil will be taken off the market, shipped directly to China for their own use - it won't even be for sale.

When the next BP disaster happens and the new Chinese CEO and Chairman get called to testify in Washington, will they even bother expressing any concern for the "small people", and if so will they be any more believable than Tony Hayward and Carl-Henric Svanberg?

There's not an oil company out there that knows how to do effective public relations, but I must admit after watching the BP executive's recent performance they make Lloyd Blankfein look like a PR genius.