PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

[Slimprofits]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

The rhetorical arguments creep in too - such as reiterating how starchy Italian diet is after I point out that Italians despite this paradox to Roger's carbs thesis, remain some of the more slender people in the EU. I agree, this is a weakness on my part. I should learn to suffer the heavy patronizing more amicably.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3412743/

The Sicanian Mountains (or Sicani), bordered by Ficuzza wood in the North, Caltanissetta in the East, Salemi in the West and Agrigento to the South represent a very peculiar area where there is a high frequency of centenarians with respect to the Italian average [11,12]. The goal of this study was to characterize the dietary habits of centenarians residing around the Sicani mountains, in 5 villages, namely Giuliana, Bisacquino, Castronovo, Chiusa Scalafani, and Prizzi.

Their diet shows a low glycemic index because low of refined carbohydrate (no white bread, low amount of pasta, no sweeteners, sweet beverages, can food, frozen already prepared vegetables or dishes, cookies cakes or snacks). Furthermore, they have a good intake of olive and virgin olive oil from different cultivar namely: Nocellara of Belice, Biancolilla, Giarraffa and Ogliarola that seems to have important anti-oxidant properties (unpublished data).

[lektrode]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3412743/



Their diet shows a low glycemic index because low of refined carbohydrate (no white bread, low amount of pasta, no sweeteners, sweet beverages, can food, frozen already prepared vegetables or dishes, cookies cakes or snacks). Furthermore, they have a good intake of olive and virgin olive oil from different cultivar namely: Nocellara of Belice, Biancolilla, Giarraffa and Ogliarola that seems to have important anti-oxidant properties (unpublished data).

my SO swears by the low glycemic index diet - and the results are quite readily apparent - tho try as she might, i just cant get excited about quinoa, almond flour baked goods etc - altho coconut milk based 'ice cream' is quite acceptable and i've grown quite fond of the taste of almond milk

[ER59]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

"One of the more mysterious conditions afflicting low-carb Paleo dieters has been high serum cholesterol. ...
So we might take high LDL on Paleo as a possible sign of two things:
- A chronic state of glucose deficiency, leading to very low T3 levels and suppressed clearance of LDL particles by lipid transport pathways.
- Absence of infections or oxidative stress which would clear LDL particles by immune pathways.
The solution? Eat more carbs, and address any remaining cause of hypothyroidism, such as iodine or selenium deficiency. T3 levels should then rise and LDL levels return to normal."
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/categor...-carb-dangers/

[shiny!]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

"One of the more mysterious conditions afflicting low-carb Paleo dieters has been high serum cholesterol. ...
So we might take high LDL on Paleo as a possible sign of two things:
- A chronic state of glucose deficiency, leading to very low T3 levels and suppressed clearance of LDL particles by lipid transport pathways.
- Absence of infections or oxidative stress which would clear LDL particles by immune pathways.
The solution? Eat more carbs, and address any remaining cause of hypothyroidism, such as iodine or selenium deficiency. T3 levels should then rise and LDL levels return to normal."
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/categor...-carb-dangers/

Very interesting. I'm prone to hypothyroidism with T3 resistance and feel absolutely awful on low-carb diets. Now I know why.

[aaron]

Low Carb Diets, Key to Longevity?

How Calorie Restriction Influences Longevity: Protecting Cells from Damage Caused by Chronic Disease

Dec. 6, 2012 — Scientists at the Gladstone Institutes have identified a novel mechanism by which a type of low-carb, low-calorie diet -- called a "ketogenic diet" -- could delay the effects of aging. This fundamental discovery reveals how such a diet could slow the aging process and may one day allow scientists to better treat or prevent age-related diseases, including heart disease, Alzheimer's disease and many forms of cancer.

---

As the aging population continues to grow, age-related illnesses have become increasingly common. Already in the United States, nearly one in six people are over the age of 65. Heart disease continues to be the nation's number one killer, with cancer and Alzheimer's close behind. Such diseases place tremendous strain on patients, families and our healthcare system. But now, researchers in the laboratory of Gladstone Senior Investigator Eric Verdin, MD, have identified the role that a chemical compound in the human body plays in the aging process -- and which may be key to new therapies for treating or preventing a variety of age-related diseases.
In the latest issue of the journal Science, available online December 6, Dr. Verdin and his team examined the role of the compound β-hydroxybutyrate (βOHB), a so-called "ketone body" that is produced during a prolonged low-calorie or ketogenic diet. While ketone bodies such as βOHB can be toxic when present at very high concentrations in people with diseases such as Type I diabetes, Dr. Verdin and colleagues found that at lower concentrations, βOHB helps protect cells from "oxidative stress" -- which occurs as certain molecules build to toxic levels in the body and contributes to the aging process.
"Over the years, studies have found that restricting calories slows aging and increases longevity -- however the mechanism of this effect has remained elusive" Dr. Verdin said. Dr. Verdin, the paper's senior author, directs the Center for HIV & Aging at Gladstone and is also a professor at the University of California, San Francisco, with which Gladstone is affiliated. "Here, we find that βOHB -- the body's major source of energy during exercise or fasting -- blocks a class of enzymes that would otherwise promote oxidative stress, thus protecting cells from aging."
Oxidative stress occurs as cells use oxygen to produce energy, but this activity also releases other potentially toxic molecules, known as free radicals. As cells age, they become less effective in clearing these free radicals -- leading to cell damage, oxidative stress and the effects of aging.
However, Dr. Verdin and his team found that βOHB might actually help delay this process. In a series of laboratory experiments -- first in human cells in a dish and then in tissues taken from mice -- the team monitored the biochemical changes that occur when βOHB is administered during a chronic calorie-restricted diet. The researchers found that calorie restriction spurs βOHB production, which blocked the activity of a class of enzymes called histone deacetylases, or HDACs.
Normally HDACs keep a pair of genes, called Foxo3a and Mt2, switched off. But increased levels of βOHB block the HDACs from doing so, which by default activates the two genes. Once activated, these genes kick-start a process that helps cells resist oxidative stress. This discovery not only identifies a novel signaling role for βOHB, but it could also represent a way to slow the detrimental effects of aging in all cells of the body.
"This breakthrough also greatly advances our understanding of the underlying mechanism behind HDACs, which had already been known to be involved in aging and neurological disease," said Gladstone Investigator Katerina Akassoglou, PhD, an expert in neurological diseases and one of the paper's co-authors. "The findings could be relevant for a wide range of neurological conditions, such as Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, autism and traumatic brain injury -- diseases that afflict millions and for which there are few treatment options."
"Identifying βOHB as a link between caloric restriction and protection from oxidative stress opens up a variety of new avenues to researchers for combating disease," said Tadahiro Shimazu, a Gladstone postdoctoral fellow and the paper's lead author. "In the future, we will continue to explore the role of βOHB -- especially how it affects the body's other organs, such as the heart or brain -- to confirm whether the compound's protective effects can be applied throughout the body."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1206142025.htm

I am doing a ketosis type diet right now. I take in very few carbs. I have already lost 25 pounds without hunger, but I have quite a bit of moodiness and it is difficult to sleep unless I eat more during the day. It is nice to see I may even live longer!

FYI: Went to the dentist yesterday. My teeth are probably in the best shape they have been for years. Gingivitis has improved noticeably. No cavities.
My knees stopped hurting and my back pain has been getting better as well.
My skin has improved.

My plan is to lose about 10 more pounds and then slowly add vegetables and very limited fruit until I get to a more balanced diet.

[Ellen Z]

Re: Low Carb Diets, Key to Longevity?

My plan is to lose about 10 more pounds and then slowly add vegetables and very limited fruit until I get to a more balanced diet.

The book "Atkins for Life" has very good charts of different classes of food, as you slowly broaden your diet. There's a chart showing which vegetables to eat regularly, which in moderation, which sparingly. It has similar charts for nuts, for beans, for fruit, etc.

[ER59]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

"The researchers found that carnitine was not dangerous by itself. Instead, the problem arose when it was metabolized by bacteria in the intestines and ended up as TMAO in the blood."

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/08/he...anted=all&_r=0

[Prazak]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

RogerMexico, have you looked into the claims made on behalf of the so-called Superstarch in the Generation Ucan athletic performance products -- and vigorously supported by Peter Attia?

[doom&gloom]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

So I sorta went Paleo over the last few months. Commenst in color below...

I was hoping to start this new thread later on, with a more fleshed-out version of my thesis, but due to the interest in the topic, I'll get it started with a reader's digest version so those unfamiliar know what we are talking about.

I enthusiastically welcome serious commentary, questions and criticism.

Those who are vegetarians for ethical or religious reasons, or who believe in a "macrobiotic" diet as a political plank, will probably not be persuaded.

PaNu - A modified paleolithic diet that can improve your health by duplicating the evolutionary metabolic milieu.

How do you do it?

I have patients that that don't care about the details, they just want to to cut to the chase about what to do. Here is the heirarchical list I give them. I tell them to go as far down the list as they can in whatever time frame they can manage. I tell them the further along the list they stop, the healthier they will be. There is no counting, measuring, or weighing. They are not required to purchase anything specific from me or anyone else. There are no special supplements, drugs or testing required. I have yet to charge anyone a penny for this advice. I already make a good living as a practicing radiologist and private investor, so I have zero financial incentive in this.

1 Eliminate sugar (including fruit juices and sports drinks) and all flour

CHECK! Except I have yet to eliminate Diet Coke. We all have our weaknesses...

2 Start eating proper fats - animal fats and monounsaturated fats like olive oil - substituting fat calories for carb calories. Drink whole milk or half and half instead of skim.

Check! -- except eliminated almost all dairy (occasional cheese)

3 Eliminate grains

Double Check! Don't miss any of them. And heck, I ama grain farmer no less!

4 Eliminate grain and seed derived oils (cooking oils) Cook with butter, coconut oil, olive oil or animal fats.

Check!

5 Get daily midday sun or take 1-2000 iu vit D daily

Hard to do in the PacNW, but will up my D. Heard 5000 is a better level.

6 Intermittent fasting and infrequent meals (2 meals a day is best)

Eat three meals a day, snack in between. Large (around 10-12hour) gap between last food and breakfast.

7 Fruit is just a snickers bar from a tree. Stick with berries and avoid watermelon which is pure fructose. Eat in moderation.

Pretty much check. Occasional pear or banana. Love berries so no need to convince me to eat them, and they are low cal as well!

8 Eliminate legumes

Double check!

9 Adjust your 6s and 3s. Grass fed beef or bison avoids excess O-6 fatty acids and are better than supplementing with 0-3 supplements.

Fail. I eat whatever quality cut meat is on sale at the grocery, be it beef, chicken, pork (love pork loin), whatever...

10 Proper exercise - emphasizing cross-fit or interval training over long aerobic sessions

I row (on a C2 rower) 7-10k meters a night roughly 5 nights a week. I walk an hour EVERY night with the neighbors and the dogs. On the C2, I have broken into the 5000m) 51st percentile in my age group after only three semi-serious months of rowing and no serious training plan. Most sessions are long aerobic (5k = 24 mins). My body is too beat up to do cross fit, but the rower is by far the finest machine ever invented to work your body in one place.

11 Eliminate milk (if you are sensitive to it, move this up the list)

Check! It was hard, but I did it.

12 Eliminate other dairy including cheese- (now you are "orthodox paleolithic")

Fail. Probably have about 3-4 oz a week. Just like the taste of it too much and have no adverse reactions to it.

If you can do step 1, that is about 50% of the benefit and alone a huge improvement on the standard american diet (SAD) By about step 6 you are at about 75% , by step 9 about 80% and at 10 you are at 99% for most people.

Here is the skeleton of the theory:

Insulin is a phylogenetically old hormone. It is a biological messenger that in excess, is metabolically saying the following to your tissue and organs: Go ahead and store energy, and go ahead and mature, reproduce and die. Excess insulin in humans is linked to diabetes, alzheimer dementia, metabolic syndrome, obesity, coronary disease and cancer.

We did not evolve under conditions of insulin excess. Food was intermittently available and not superabundant like today. Scarcity and famine were frequent everywhere until recently in evolutionary time. Preferred foods were available year round and dense in calories and nutrients. Animal products, including organs and bone marrow of mammals, fish, and invertebrates (insects) were the staples, supplemented by edible plants (not grains) until the dawn of agriculture. Fruit was seasonal and not yet bred for maximum sweetness. Food was eaten less frequently, had lower carbs than the typical american diet which is about 60%, and was supplemented by often involuntary periods of intermittent fasting and lower calories overall.

We are not adapted to chronic hyperinsulinemia.

We are also not adapted to eating grass seeds, to which we have been exposed for only about 10,000 years. They contain molecules that are specifically designed to discourage consumption, as well as other problematic chemicals.

The diet is not about eating like a caveman, or killing your own food. It is solely about duplicating what I believe are the key elements of the internal hormonal metabolic milieu that we evolved under from especially less than 1 million years ago to about 10,000 years ago. It is not about eating specific things, it is about not eating specific things.

Calorie restriction is a severe, uncomfortable way to have low insulin levels and if calorie restricted (starving) your insulin levels can be reasonable even if your carb percentage is high. However, with calorie restriciton you can get muscle wasting, fatigue and weakened immune function. In animal models, calorie restriction increases longevity substantially. Remember the metaphorical message of insulin? It says, increase your metabolic rate and then die. This message is attenuated by having low insulin levels.

Is there another way to live in a world of abundant food without being hungry all the time, yet avoiding the risk of immune dysfunction associated with eating grass seeds that cannot even be eaten without mechanical processing and cooking ?

Yes, you can work your way down the list.

Other things I have done since the end of June:

1) joined www.loseit.com (free) to track calories
2) pretty much tossed out eating starches (occasional jalapeno potato chips but rare) and rice
3) eat more veggies, though not significantly. did find they taste MUCH better when you have eliminated sugar from your diet.

End result:

Well, I weaned my way into some of your list, and slowly lost some weight prior to 'going paleo', but from my high I am down a whopping 50lbs (since around April). From when I got more serious about diet and calorie tracking, I am down 38 lbs. In fact, I am now a decade plus 'lighter' and feel a whole lot better, though I never felt horrible even at morbidly obese size. In 11 more pounds I will be in the Plain Jane "overweight" category. I will probably never leave that area as I neither like the way I look or feel when I get beyond a certain weight range.

This has NOT been hard. Occasionally I get hungry, but not significantly so. My macros have me most days eating around 90-115g of carbs, none of which are simple sugars.

"Going paleo" is the best thing I have ever done for my health I believe. I feel sorry I ever adopted the USDA guidelines about 'eat more carbs and healthy grains' and the old mantra about 'fat makes you fat'. No, grains make you fat, and fat keeps you thin. Imagine that!

A few resource I would recommend to others:

The book "It begins with food" for a Whole30 plan of eating. I di not do this, but if you don't know where to start, tis is the blueprint.
The book "Practical Paleo" as a recipe cook book and educational tome all in one.
The podcast "Underground Wellness" on iTunes or search Google for the site
The podcast "Livin' la Vida Low-carb" also on iTunes or on the net

I could list a lot more, but these are great resources to begin with...

If more of the US ate this way we would sell a lot less statins and have a lot less obesity and healthcare issues.

[swgprop]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

Someone posted to this thread a couple of days ago referencing Peter Attia:

Visiting his site led me to NuSI.

Founded by Attia and Gary Taubes (author of Good Calories, Bad Calories) it seems that NuSI has the potential to be a great source of nutritional/dietary information.

From their website:

The Problem:

Americans have been working harder than ever to eat well and be healthy, but it’s not working. We keep getting fatter and diabetes rates are skyrocketing. One possible explanation is that we’re getting the wrong advice. Official dietary guidelines are not based on rigorous science. They may be contributing to the problem and doing far more harm than good.

Why NuSI

NuSI is unencumbered by bureaucracy or by an obligation to do anything other than find the truth. We can move quickly and efficiently to execute a novel plan: harness the talents of the best scientists in the field and channel their skills into one concerted effort to generate reliable knowledge, once and for all, on the nature of a healthy diet. The time is now.

The Strategy:

NuSI is changing the rules of the game. We build teams of multidisciplinary researchers from independent universities and institutions, and we make it possible for them to do targeted, cutting-edge experiments that will directly address the key questions of obesity and health. We then communicate the results to all audiences. Everyone deserves the truth.

[Slimprofits]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-0...udy-finds.html

The analysis of 72 previous studies showed insufficient support for nutritional recommendations by groups such as the American Heart Association that advocate high consumption of polyunsaturated fats like omega-3 and omega-6, which is found in corn and sunflower oils, as well as some nuts and seeds.

Researchers in yesterday’s report analyzed 72 studies that looked at more than 600,000 patients from 18 countries. Of those, 40 involved initially healthy people, 10 recruited people with elevated cardiovascular risk factors and 22 recruited people with cardiovascular disease.

In 17 studies of more than 75,000 patients, they found no evidence that supplementation with omega-3 fatty acids can reduce heart disease risk, Chowdhury said.

The analysis supported current guidelines restricting consumption of foods high in trans fats. The study didn’t find evidence that saturated fats pose a heart risk, Chowdhury said.

The last sentence should be the headline - should be the lead story on every news broadcast, IMO. In an ideal world, perhaps the only headline reported by any news entity for the entire day.

[Polish_Silver]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-0...udy-finds.html The last sentence should be the headline - should be the lead story on every news broadcast, IMO. In an ideal world, perhaps the only headline reported by any news entity for the entire day.

Along those lines, peanuts and treenuts have been found to reduce heart disease. I don't know what kind of fat they have, but it is not trans fat. Bring on the whole milk!

[Slimprofits]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

Along those lines, peanuts and treenuts have been found to reduce heart disease. I don't know what kind of fat they have, but it is not trans fat. Bring on the whole milk!

No it is not, naturally occurring trans fats are found in small amounts in cattle and sheep. The real problem, not surprisingly, is with non-naturally occurring trans fats.

[vt]

Re: PaNu - The paleolithic nutrition argument clinic

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-devotees.html

[Polish_Silver]

What's wrong with mice ?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-devotees.html

The idea of a "Paleo" diet is the diet that humans ate before the agricultural revolution, ie the diet we adapted to for 1-2 million years of hunter gathering.

It is not an optimum diet for mice because mice are not hunter gatherers. It is not clear that a "paleo diet" would be high fat, since wild animals are relatively lean, with some exceptions such as moose in the fall or the heads of salmon.

The article did not say what sort of fat the mice were eating. There is some evidence that the fat in "free range grass fed" animal is more healthy for you than the fat in a "factory farm grain fed" animal.

A paleo diet would probably include fruit, berries, some seeds, so it would not necessarily be "low carb".

Since when were mice cooking food before eating it, which is what humans have been doing for at least 1 million years?

Is the study really claiming that the food of the last 100 years (sugar, flour, etc) is more healthy than what humans were eating in the previous 1 million years?