GM's Wagoner gone

[Scott4139]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/gm_wagoner

Last of the Big Three CEOs. The GM culture has to change and he's simply a product of it. This needs to be only the beginning.

[plinko]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

While I've been against the GM bailouts period for sometime (It's caused me to be fairly depressed over my decisions in life to work for small businesses/startups), It is nice to see Obama finally growing a pair when it comes to restructuring GM.

[Spartacus]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

this was on the radio a couple minutes ago

A Canadian union guy thought it's a misdirection and a mistake, claiming

"Wagoner's a car guy. Until him they had tons of accountants, which Wagoner is not ..."

The Canadian auto unions split from the US unions 20 years ago, so I presume this guy has a good distance to see things from. If anything, the instant I heard the radio announcer say they were interviewing a union guy about the Wagoner firing, I got ready for some anti-managment rhetoric.

[walenk]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

Basic spin is Obama pushes Waggoner out. I don't think that's bullish. That's commissar numero uno in action kinda story.
Damn, these are interesting times.

[pwcmba]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

Now, can we get some bankster heads rolling too? Firings, prosecutions, regulation and restructuring are the road to recovery.

[Judas]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

Hopefully the new GSE version of GM will work out better than Fannie and Freddie.

[Glenn Black]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

Wagoner came up through GM's marketing Dept. He invented Red tag sales, same as employee pricing, cash back, and all the other snake oil sales gimmicks. Make the cars, then we'll dump them in the market with GMAC financing, make it up on sales volume and interest payments on the loans.

Bye bye Tricky Ricky

[c1ue]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

I don't know anything about Wagoner, but it seems odd to me that Wagoner is getting the boot for taking $10B (give or take) of the government's money, but the CEOs of Citigroup, BofA, JPMorgan, Wells, etc etc are all safe despite taking multiples of that.

As Fred mentioned previously - the PC CEOs must jump through hoops and be ritually sacrificed whilst the FIRE CEOs merely get the tongue lashing (and a bigger pile of government money)

[GRG55]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

I don't know anything about Wagoner, but it seems odd to me that Wagoner is getting the boot for taking $10B (give or take) of the government's money, but the CEOs of Citigroup, BofA, JPMorgan, Wells, etc etc are all safe despite taking multiples of that.

As Fred mentioned previously - the PC CEOs must jump through hoops and be ritually sacrificed whilst the FIRE CEOs merely get the tongue lashing (and a bigger pile of government money)

Did any of you listen to Captain Change's address to the public?

President Obama is a skilled politician, you have to give him that. It's one tough profession, and he's a Grand Master of the game.

He manages to come across as the "friend of the worker" at the same time as he shoves Wagoner over the edge...because Rick didn't show enough brutality and cut enough workers from the payroll to pass the White House's business plan peer review. They may have been able to save AIG's retention bonuses, but there is no possible way the Prez is going to get tagged with the responsibility of saving those GM jobs. Ya gotta love it...:rolleyes:

btw: I am rooting for a successful marriage of Chrysler and Fiat. I wanna be among the first to order a Hemi-powered Punto or Panda.

[cbr]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

you have got to be kidding me... since when does the government dictate to a private board of directors who should run the show.

how absurd is it that the FIRE industry leaders who are pulling the puppet strings are not subject to the same treatment despite radically worse culpability, mismanagement, and responsibility for our problems. Hell, the FIRE industry and Labor are damn near the sole cause of the auto industries' problems.

guess what: ask anyone who truly knows cars and how they perform over time or under heavy use and the fact is that GM and Chrysler's products are actually the BEST in their respective classes. Sure, perhaps GM overbanked on certain markets, but that fuel price cookjob was an artificial FIRE creation anyway, and that is what hurt the US auto industry. The only thing Wagoner had wrong was trying to JOIN the FIRE industry in their finance group. They didnt want him in their club.

[GRG55]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

you have got to be kidding me... since when does the government dictate to a private board of directors who should run the show.

how absurd is it that the FIRE industry leaders who are pulling the puppet strings are not subject to the same treatment despite radically worse culpability, mismanagement, and responsibility for our problems. Hell, the FIRE industry and Labor are damn near the sole cause of the auto industries' problems.

guess what: ask anyone who truly knows cars and how they perform over time or under heavy use and the fact is that GM and Chrysler's products are actually the BEST in their respective classes. Sure, perhaps GM overbanked on certain markets, but that fuel price cookjob was an artificial FIRE creation anyway, and that is what hurt the US auto industry. The only thing Wagoner had wrong was trying to JOIN the FIRE industry in their finance group. They didnt want him in their club.

You are surprised? The FIRE economy interests are fully in charge...

US autos task force rejects GM, Chrysler plans
Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:32am EDT

WASHINGTON, March 30 (Reuters) ...The announcement by the White House autos panel headed by former investment banker Steve Rattner marked a stunning reversal for management at both automakers and for GM investors and creditors who had bet on a softer line.

"We have unfortunately concluded that neither plan submitted by either company represents viability and therefore does not warrant the substantial additional investments that they requested," said a senior administration official, who asked not to be named...

...GM CEO Rick Wagoner, who met on Friday with the task force, was forced out on Sunday at the request of Rattner, an official said...

The ONLY thing that surprised me is that Rattner didn't come from Goldman...:rolleyes:

[rj1]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/gm_wagoner

Last of the Big Three CEOs. The GM culture has to change and he's simply a product of it. This needs to be only the beginning.

I agree. It's been ruined by the accountants and financially-minded for 40 years. Time to put the engineers that actually understand cars in charge.


Nothing good will come from this action. GM and Chrysler are going to declare bankruptcy and what that'll do is be to the heavy detriment of the people in society that actually work for a living (or had worked for a living). Obama demanding heavily from the automakers and not the banks is essentially declaring class war on the middle-class to the benefit of the rich. I can't be convinced otherwise. We can't have the small people taking the money from the rich that need it. And society will suffer as a result because these companies and their tentacles are not only in Detroit, they're national. And when some of those tentacles go down, they're going to bring down a lot of stuff with it that will only be seen after the fact. Everyone has an opinion on the car industry, but very few actually know what the hell goes on in making and selling a car.

If you think the carmakers and banks should get money, fine.
If you think neither the carmakers nor the banks should get money, fine.
If you think the banks should get money and the carmakers should not, you have no morals.

[GRG55]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

I agree. It's been ruined by the accountants and financially-minded for 40 years. Time to put the engineers that actually understand cars in charge.


Nothing good will come from this action. GM and Chrysler are going to declare bankruptcy and what that'll do is be to the heavy detriment of the people in society that actually work for a living (or had worked for a living). Obama demanding heavily from the automakers and not the banks is essentially declaring class war on the middle-class to the benefit of the rich. I can't be convinced otherwise. We can't have the small people taking the money from the rich that need it. And society will suffer as a result because these companies and their tentacles are not only in Detroit, they're national. And when some of those tentacles go down, they're going to bring down a lot of stuff with it that will only be seen after the fact. Everyone has an opinion on the car industry, but very few actually know what the hell goes on in making and selling a car.

If you think the carmakers and banks should get money, fine.
If you think neither the carmakers nor the banks should get money, fine.
If you think the banks should get money and the carmakers should not, you have no morals.

After watching Captain Teleprompter earlier today, I started to wonder whether this is going to be the "Lehman Brothers" event for the Production Economy?

[GRG55]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

After watching Captain Teleprompter earlier today, I started to wonder whether this is going to be the "Lehman Brothers" event for the Production Economy?

Looking more likely...

GM Said to Be Warned Obama Won’t Make Debt Payment

April 1 (Bloomberg) -- General Motors Corp.’s 60-day deadline to restructure is unlikely to be extended because the U.S. won’t repay $1 billion in convertible notes maturing June 1, according to a person with knowledge of the discussions...

...GM Chief Executive Officer Fritz Henderson yesterday said that June 1 was the final deadline for completing the debt restructuring and that the automaker may enter bankruptcy sooner if it’s clear an agreement out of court isn’t possible...

...Obama gave GM 60 days to come up with deeper cost and debt reductions than the carmaker proposed in its plan submitted in February. GM is trying to prove it’s viable, a U.S. requirement to keep $13.4 billion in federal loans. The president believes a quick, negotiated bankruptcy is the most likely way for GM to restructure and become a competitive automaker, according to people familiar with the matter...

So the President is now a business work-out expert?

A "quick, negotiated bankruptcy" for General Motors? It might be "negotiated", but I seriously doubt there will be anything quick about a GM bankruptcy. More likely a long, drawn out global mess, where the lawyers get rich...

[cjppjc]

Re: GM's Wagoner gone

Looking more likely...

GM Said to Be Warned Obama Won’t Make Debt Payment

April 1 (Bloomberg) -- General Motors Corp.’s 60-day deadline to restructure is unlikely to be extended because the U.S. won’t repay $1 billion in convertible notes maturing June 1, according to a person with knowledge of the discussions...

...GM Chief Executive Officer Fritz Henderson yesterday said that June 1 was the final deadline for completing the debt restructuring and that the automaker may enter bankruptcy sooner if it’s clear an agreement out of court isn’t possible...

...Obama gave GM 60 days to come up with deeper cost and debt reductions than the carmaker proposed in its plan submitted in February. GM is trying to prove it’s viable, a U.S. requirement to keep $13.4 billion in federal loans. The president believes a quick, negotiated bankruptcy is the most likely way for GM to restructure and become a competitive automaker, according to people familiar with the matter...

So the President is now a business work-out expert?

A "quick, negotiated bankruptcy" for General Motors? It might be "negotiated", but I seriously doubt there will be anything quick about a GM bankruptcy. More likely a long, drawn out global mess, where the lawyers get rich...

I think the car companies will be like the airlines. Entering and exiting bankruptcy many times. Think Chapter 22,33,44