GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

[ProdigyofZen]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/49b1654a-e...0779fd2ac.html

A direct quote from the article, this flys in the face of Itulip I believe!

"The bursting of bubbles causes credit contraction, the forced liquidation of assets, deflation and wealth destruction that may reach catastrophic proportions. In a deflationary environment, the weight of accumulated debt can sink the banking system and push the economy into depression. That is what needs to be prevented at all costs."

"It can be done – by creating money to offset the contraction of credit, recapitalising the banking system and writing off or down the accumulated debt in an orderly manner. They require radical and unorthodox policy measures. For best results, the three processes should be combined."

"Energy policy could also play an important role in counteracting both depression and deflation. The American consumer can no longer act as the motor of the global economy. Alternative energy and developments that produce energy savings could serve as a new motor, but only if the price of conventional fuels is kept high enough to justify investing in those activities. That would involve putting a floor under the price of fossil fuels by imposing a price on carbon emissions and import duties on oil to keep the domestic price above, say, $70 per barrel."

protectionism?

I cannot believe he is advocating this!!!! It is soooo crazy to read and listen to what Soros writes compared to his old partner Jim Rogers who says virtually the exact opposite of what he believes. Maybe that is why Rogers quit the Quantum fund in 1980 who knows?

Sorry Fred, i have to write fast do not have much time to put into this during the day. Does this satisfy you? I am sure Itulip does not advocate import tariffs etc... read the article

[FRED]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/49b1654a-e...0779fd2ac.html

A direct quote from the article, this flys in the face of Itulip I believe!

"The bursting of bubbles causes credit contraction, the forced liquidation of assets, deflation and wealth destruction that may reach catastrophic proportions. In a deflationary environment, the weight of accumulated debt can sink the banking system and push the economy into depression. That is what needs to be prevented at all costs."

"It can be done – by creating money to offset the contraction of credit, recapitalising the banking system and writing off or down the accumulated debt in an orderly manner. They require radical and unorthodox policy measures. For best results, the three processes should be combined."

I cannot believe he is advocating this!!!! It is soooo crazy to read and listen to what Soros writes compared to his old partner Jim Rogers who says virtually the exact opposite of what he believes. Maybe that is why Rogers quit the Quantum fund in 1980 who knows?

I'm confused. This is what iTulip has been saying for years.

[CanuckinTX]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

Seems to me that Soros is recommending the same thing as Dr. Michael Hudson did in his recent interview with EJ, ie. that the solution is to let them write down the bad assets.

You should read that interview - it's great and might answer a lot of your questions.

[ProdigyofZen]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

I didnt know Itulip was advocating the creation of money? printing money is what Itulip advocates?

[ProdigyofZen]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

what questions did I ask in that post aside from wondering why two guys who started a hedgefund together in 1970 split apart and have two different views of the market. One who advocates keynesian control and the other who advocates no fed reserve at all or CB and to let everything fail.

[Serge_Tomiko]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

I didnt know Itulip was advocating the creation of money? printing money is what Itulip advocates?

The folks on itulip merely predict how events will play out - not what is the best solution.

[FRED]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

I didnt know Itulip was advocating the creation of money? printing money is what Itulip advocates?

Unlike nearly every other site, we do not mix ideology with economic forecasting. It takes getting use to but our attitude is that it doesn't pay to impose our beliefs on the market and economy because, to be blunt, the market and economy don't care what we think it should do. We focus on understanding how the market and economy actually work, and what that means for the future.

We forecast monetary reflation and fiscal stimulus spending to follow the credit market bust and recession. We forecast that after a period of asset price deflation and commodity price disinflation, the monetary reflation and government spending will, in combination with a weakened dollar and supply shock, produce inflation later this year. This forecast has been adopted by others, which is the price of thought leadership.

If you are asking whether we approve of monetary reflation and fiscal stimulus, the answer is yes and no. We have a complicated answer, deserving of a book.

[ProdigyofZen]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

Fred, I get that you try to take idealogies out of the market and just predict what is going to happen. I totally understand that. I was just saying I didn't think any of the owners here at itulip advocate printing money. Yes, i know that is what they will do but in my opinion I do not think that they should be doing it.

I would have to disagree with Soros on his points. I get everything you forecast and expect, I have been reading this site for 6 months now. You must be clear when you state " i am confused I thought that was what itulip had been advocating for years' when you say advocating you make it seem like that is what Itulip thinks the govnt should do, not just what itulip "thinks" the govnt will do. 2 different concepts.

I believe EJ wrote an article advocating for Obama to be elected president. That kinda is mixing idealogy with forecasts. ......

[ProdigyofZen]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

I think we just got confused on both ends. Should be all clear now.

[CanuckinTX]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

what questions did I ask in that post aside from wondering why two guys who started a hedgefund together in 1970 split apart and have two different views of the market. One who advocates keynesian control and the other who advocates no fed reserve at all or CB and to let everything fail.

I was also referring to your question in another post where you thought iTulip needed to respond to this article. While you didn't post any specific questions I figured you had some since you were having trouble reconciling what Soros said and the iTulip position.

[FRED]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

Fred, I get that you try to take idealogies out of the market and just predict what is going to happen. I totally understand that. I was just saying I didn't think any of the owners here at itulip advocate printing money. Yes, i know that is what they will do but in my opinion I do not think that they should be doing it.

I would have to disagree with Soros on his points. I get everything you forecast and expect, I have been reading this site for 6 months now. You must be clear when you state " i am confused I thought that was what itulip had been advocating for years' when you say advocating you make it seem like that is what Itulip thinks the govnt should do, not just what itulip "thinks" the govnt will do. 2 different concepts.

I believe EJ wrote an article advocating for Obama to be elected president. That kinda is mixing idealogy with forecasts. ......

That was an endorsement of a candidate, not an election forecast

Seriously, an example of a mix of ideology of forecasting is "Gold is money so buy gold."

"Governments tend to deflate debt against commodities, so buy gold" is a forecast.

[strittmatter]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

I'm confused. This is what iTulip has been saying for years.

While reading that piece yesterday, I had the "Soros been reading itulip?" thought bubble.

Thanks for the thread.

[phirang]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

Fred, I for one appreciate Itulip sticking to forecastin' and omitting useless editorials.

[D-Mack]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

"Energy policy could also play an important role in counteracting both depression and deflation. The American consumer can no longer act as the motor of the global economy. Alternative energy and developments that produce energy savings could serve as a new motor, but only if the price of conventional fuels is kept high enough to justify investing in those activities. That would involve putting a floor under the price of fossil fuels by imposing a price on carbon emissions and import duties on oil to keep the domestic price above, say, $70 per barrel."

He himself admitted it's speculation

George Soros: rocketing oil price is a bubble

...

"Speculation... is increasingly affecting the price," he said. "The price has this parabolic shape which is characteristic of bubbles," he said.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/n...-a-bubble.html

So he is advocating a carbon tax and duties to profit from it, instead of other methods of manipulation?

Prime Minister Vladimir Putin’s speech at the opening ceremony of the World Economic Forum

...

Every one of us realises that sharp and unpredictable fluctuations of energy prices are a colossal destabilising factor in the global economy. Today’s landslide fall of prices will lead to a growth in the consumption of resources.

On the one hand, investments in energy saving and alternative sources of energy will be curtailed. On the other, less money will be invested in oil production, which will result in its inevitable downturn. Which, in the final analysis, will escalate into another fit of uncontrolled price growth and a new crisis.

It is necessary to return to a balanced price based on an equilibrium between supply and demand, to strip pricing of a speculative element generated by many derivative financial instruments.

http://www.weforum.org/pdf/AM_2009/O...dimirPutin.pdf

[ProdigyofZen]

Re: GEORGE SOROS on FT times ARTICLE!! 1/29

well of course but endorsing a candidate means you think their ideas would be better than the opposite candidate or candidates....