A letter from the BOSS

[BrianL]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

Will you be my boss? ;)

Seriously, great post. This is what I wish I had the experience to express in this thread.

[xtronics]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

This country doesn't need employers like him, or the local cronies that send projects his way. Pork all the way. Happy early retirement.

You are assuming he built his on pork - not sure why?

Don't worry - the guys that know how to build and run real businesses are already leaving the country. There are opportunities in Asia and Brazil just as there were in New York after the 1890's. The folks that are left can try and tax and sue each other into prosperity.

[mcgurme]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

I'm also a business owner and serial entrepreneur. And since no other business owners have spoken up to take the other side of the letter writer's opinion, I thought I would do it.
...

Spot on. I am a small business owner, and I manage a research group at a University. If people want to experience red tape, try being at a state-run institution. The red-tape for my business is a fraction of that at the University.

And managing employees? Some people are ready for it, some are not. It is never easy. Uncle Sam has nothing to do with that.

The only "whining" I would do as a small business owner is this: large business receive nearly all the tax breaks and giveaways. They are not more efficient. They are just better at getting fat on government handouts.

[Uno]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

Well rather then work hard, I decided to invest $3,000 in the best GMAT training possible. Then I took the GMAT test twice and ended up with a 780.

Next, I applied to Wharton, Columbia, and Harvard. My father is friends with 2 high ranking republicans and so was able to get some strong referrences on my behalf.

After 2 years of drinking at Wharton and learning how money "really works" I landed a position 1/2 way up the pyramid at Goldman Sachs.

My first years I had to work at least 60 hours a week and only recieved a $450,000 bonus. It totatly sucked and so I almost quit.

Thankfully my father sat me down and recommended that I "contribute" 1/2 of my bonus to the local republican party.

Well to make a long story short, that put me on the right path and so I was CEO of Goldman Sachs within 10 years and close friends with a guy names George Bush.

Eventually I became the treasury secretary to help save the Republican party and blame the great depression we caused on the incoming liberals.

Well back too work, I have a ton of taxpayers money to "contribute" this week.

-Jon

[metalman]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

now that took thought and work. thanks. i'd work for any company you run.

[*T*]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

can't work. someone has to be in charge and accountable, else chaos. the greater the responsibility and accountability the greater the compensation.

that is the only way.

Does not saying this way is the only way imply a lack of imagination?

(Yes I am playing devil's advocate a little, before anyone takes me too seriously, but I want to explore different models than that which produces the ancient class conflict we see played out in miniature here).

[*T*]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

Sorry, you couldn't be more wrong. Private property is, in fact, at the core of any peaceful society.

It is actually the lack of private property that naturally leads to violence. If no one owns anything, then we can't be responsible for our own survival, and force is the only alternative.

Running a company as a democracy is a sure path to bankruptcy. The reality is that most people have no idea what it takes to run a successful company. And if ownership is equalized (socialized), then the motivation to excel or to innovate is destroyed.

Also, the actual implementation of socializing companies is really not "equal ownership." Inevitably, someone gets put in a position of authority -- a position that can rapidly devolve into handing out favors to those who offer the most in return, not unlike the US government.

By which I mean, ownership is the ability to assert denial of other's use of property, which is ultimately backed up by (state/legal/societal) force.

I don't agree re. accountability/ownership. Shared ownership doesn't have to mean shared decision making. The vikings used to elect a chief, who was then in charge and took decisions. Ultimately he was accountable to his people, but he had near absolute authority.

I don't see that a position of authority would be any more abused in one way than the other.

[flintlock]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

I'm a business owner and a lot of that letter rang true to me. Especially the part about employees not having a clue what went into building that business. The sacrifices involved. Most Americans will never understand it because they will never attempt to start their own business. I recall being told how one employee said to another " You mean he's making money off us?!" when a discussion came up about pricing on a job. People are self centered, but find it appalling when the business owner acts out of his own self interest. I'm no Ayn Rand follower, but this kind of talk is exactly what she was talking about. Of course, she takes it to the other extreme.

For some reason, people want everything to be white or black, with no gray in the middle, even though life is basically just a bunch of shades of gray. Labor vs business owners. Same thing.

I find when reading over postings on this forum, I take a lot more seriously the opinions of people with real world experience than the ideologists. Its pretty easy to tell the two apart.

[bpr]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

I'm also a business owner and serial entrepreneur. And since no other business owners have spoken up to take the other side of the letter writer's opinion, I thought I would do it.

Excellent post, thank you for the thoughtful and well thought out contribution.

You are assuming he built his on pork - not sure why?

Don't worry - the guys that know how to build and run real businesses are already leaving the country. There are opportunities in Asia and Brazil just as there were in New York after the 1890's. The folks that are left can try and tax and sue each other into prosperity.

A quick search on Wake Forest News shows that he butters both sides of his bread:

candidates for Wake Forest town board... Crowley and Associates’ engineer Michael Crowley gave both $250

And then makes excuses when his projects aren't completed on time:

When Rogers Road was first closed, Crowley and Stratford Developers estimated the work would take just a week, but rain has slowed down the process.
"What people don't understand is if it rains today and it's sunny tomorrow, it takes time for the site to dry out," Crowley said.

I don't know this fellow and can only compare him to the types that get local contracts in my area, and I have no respect for them as businessmen or as citizens. It's a stereotype and a gross generalization, but it's frequently correct. I did a quick search and it confirmed my suspicions: anyone complaining that his quarterly tax burden is over a quarter of a million dollars likely receives most of his revenue from taxes.

I'm sorry for the flippant response, esp. after reading some of the thoughtful and well-reasoned arguments laid out here.

[occdude]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

To my former employee:

You sound as if I made no contribution to society by the services I actually rendered to society. After all doesn't everyone enjoy the widgets I produce, so much so, they're willing to take their static wages and purchase my products freely without compunction? Doesn't that unto itself gather any credit for making society just that much better?

Now I understand the roads need to be built, dams need to be damned, people need to be educated etc. But when was it last you saw a congress man with a hard hat that wasn't making a speech? You think that is the person best ordained to allocate these resources that are going to shape society. How about you Mr. Employee? Can't you put down the remote for a minute, re-allocate that money you had earmarked for a new plasma and build a school yourself, maybe one that would educate our students above third world status? One that was affordable and efficient? Maybe you could eat the Ramen for a while as you wait years for a belated return and struggle against economic, government and market conditions all designed to denie you one .

Not me though, I'am tired of trying to convince a society that I have real value and provide real wealth and that IAM the best person to allocate those resources.

Well gotta go, lots to do. People down here actually LIKE me and what I'am doing (providing jobs, capital and skills).

Your low life EX-boss.

[Sharky]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

I'm also a business owner and serial entrepreneur. And since no other business owners have spoken up to take the other side of the letter writer's opinion, I thought I would do it.

You've described what most US businesspeople should know in order to function in society. But you've also missed the key points in the OP:

1. Government laws and taxation are largely arbitrary, are trending in the wrong direction, and can quickly consume what would otherwise be a healthy business. They add little or no value (and often have an impact the exact reverse of what was intended). Both employers and employees suffer for the benefit of various special interests.

2. Employees have developed a sense of entitlement. Most don't understand or respect the value that their employers bring to the table, and they feel they have a right to a job and benefits, regardless of their performance. BTW, I'm the first to admit that this attitude is the fault of employers themselves.

The issue is not how to get along or plan or manage. Anyone who runs a business figures those things out fast or they don't survive. It's that the process of getting along takes away from innovating, from growing a business, from adding more jobs and higher pay and better benefits for their employees -- and at some point, many employers (myself included) eventually say that no amount of compensation is worth the stress, and go on to do other things.

[occdude]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

I'm a business owner and a lot of that letter rang true to me. Especially the part about employees not having a clue what went into building that business. The sacrifices involved. Most Americans will never understand it because they will never attempt to start their own business. I recall being told how one employee said to another " You mean he's making money off us?!" when a discussion came up about pricing on a job. People are self centered, but find it appalling when the business owner acts out of his own self interest. I'm no Ayn Rand follower, but this kind of talk is exactly what she was talking about. Of course, she takes it to the other extreme.

For some reason, people want everything to be white or black, with no gray in the middle, even though life is basically just a bunch of shades of gray. Labor vs business owners. Same thing.

I find when reading over postings on this forum, I take a lot more seriously the opinions of people with real world experience than the ideologists. Its pretty easy to tell the two apart.

flintlock

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Flintlock, part of the problem with business owners are they don't go out of their way to inform the employess of what actually does go into a business. I've been on both sides of the fence so I know that a little explaination and actual demonstration goes a long way with making an impression. Too many business owners are stoic and suffer in silence. Being confronted with some idiot who wasn't aware of the fact I need to make money off of them my reply would be "of course I need to make money off of you or else we wouldn't be having this conversation and in fact my desire to make money off of you is good for you in that you draw your paycheck from that point."


Business people, the wealthy (the ones who earned it and not fleeced it) need to be straight and confrontational with poor people. Teach them the RIGHT way, not the "you poor little person" way. Tell them the hours, the expense, the sacrifice. Offer to mentor the motivated ones. Dont let poor people, employees or anyone else have a false concept of what it takes to succeed otherwise I guarrantee you, you'll be VERY sorry you did.

[BrianL]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

I'd also suggest that employees aren't generally paid to understand the buisness side of... the buisness. They are paid to produce something for the buisness. Understanding the owners past sacrifices are largely irrelevant unless they somehow impact the contract between the employer and the employee.

If the lack of understanding comes in the form of criticism (why are you paid more than I am?/you have it easy/etc), it is a personnel issue to be dealt with just like any other. Ideally the employee can either be educated, the issue set aside as tangential to the job or the employees responsibilities can be elevated (as they may be looking for more responsibility). If it is a reoccuring problem, dismiss the employee just you would with any other disciplinary issue.

I understand that employers would like the respect of their employees for the past suffering and current burden, but frankly that isn't what you are paying employees to do. Hopefully most will be rational, if not empathetic.

On the up side for employers, employees may be competing for jobs much more aggressively in the near future...

[doom&gloom]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

Flintlock, part of the problem with business owners are they don't go out of their way to inform the employess of what actually does go into a business. I've been on both sides of the fence so I know that a little explaination and actual demonstration goes a long way with making an impression. Too many business owners are stoic and suffer in silence. Being confronted with some idiot who wasn't aware of the fact I need to make money off of them my reply would be "of course I need to make money off of you or else we wouldn't be having this conversation and in fact my desire to make money off of you is good for you in that you draw your paycheck from that point."


Business people, the wealthy (the ones who earned it and not fleeced it) need to be straight and confrontational with poor people. Teach them the RIGHT way, not the "you poor little person" way. Tell them the hours, the expense, the sacrifice. Offer to mentor the motivated ones. Dont let poor people, employees or anyone else have a false concept of what it takes to succeed otherwise I guarrantee you, you'll be VERY sorry you did.

It makes no difference what you tell employees -- like everyone else their
minds are already all made up as to what is right and wrong, etc. When I
started in business as an employee, my boss made big bucks, but was not
all that nice to his employees. Some of us producers got paid well, but we
knew it was never on a scale of what he made 'off us'. We heard the
occasional story of his sacrifices, but they fell on deaf ears. We had not
walked in his shoes.

My employees were well paid, as was I. We worked 4.5 day workweeks
so everyone had an extra 4 hours off every week to do whatever. Healthcare
I provided was the most expensive plan I could get with the
very best benefits possible. I know people appreciated THOSE things, but
they could never appreciate the times I stayed up for 2-3 days straight
with a few hours sleep to resolve system issues, or the efforts that went
into building the company in the early years. Certainly they could not
appreciate that I worked for 18 months with NO paycheck, and that my
total earnings after two years were less thean working the counter at
McDonald's for that amount of time.

My big 'payday' years didn't come till year 5, and by that time many of the
original people who worked for me had moved on to what they thought
ere greener pastures. During the dot.bomb heyday I lost a lot of good
people to the lure of less pay and fab stock options. None of it ever
panned out for them.

By the time I sold, my oldest employees were at the roughly 10 year mark,
thus around long enough to have known only the 'good times', and to
never have seen the tough early years when I took my wife's paychecks
to fund the payroll. And that group numbered all of 2 people.

Employees will only believe what they choose to believe -- just like
politics.

[nicmakaveli]

Re: A letter from the BOSS

It makes no difference what you tell employees -- like everyone else their
minds are already all made up as to what is right and wrong, etc. When I
started in business as an employee, my boss made big bucks, but was not
all that nice to his employees. Some of us producers got paid well, but we
knew it was never on a scale of what he made 'off us'. We heard the
occasional story of his sacrifices, but they fell on deaf ears. We had not
walked in his shoes.

My big 'payday' years didn't come till year 5, and by that time many of the
original people who worked for me had moved on to what they thought
ere greener pastures. During the dot.bomb heyday I lost a lot of good
people to the lure of less pay and fab stock options. None of it ever
panned out for them.

By the time I sold, my oldest employees were at the roughly 10 year mark,
thus around long enough to have known only the 'good times', and to
never have seen the tough early years when I took my wife's paychecks
to fund the payroll. And that group numbered all of 2 people.

Employees will only believe what they choose to believe -- just like
politics.

I've been an itulip reader for sometime, though just a member recently.
In most of the threads I can only read and I guess understanding the questions, theories and explanations take up most of my time.

I have a small business, I don't pay a whole lot of tax, the percentage is probably not even enough to make it worth mentioning.
This is because here in China, you can buy receipts from service, advertising, and other companies for a little extra to what they will have to pay in tax.
Then, if you know the right tax-collector you can get up to 45% discount on your tax.
It's a beautiful place, and though there is some social limits your freedom I don't think it can get any better for a business owner than here.
Anyhow, I digress to far.

After reading some posts here, I think business owners, especially those that built in themselves are being a bit misunderstood.
Like Doom&Gloom
I can relate to many lines of the letter.
I haven't taken a day off since 3 years, I have not a lot of time to do much else than work and enterprising.

Sometimes I think of leaving it, just to itself, it would still return a good living to me in any country.
But being a broker in my brokerage I provide about 30% of our revenues.
I stay because my employees (who get a good share) have wifes and children.
My Partners, the cleaning company, the plumbers, contractors and furniture stores have families that depend on our business.
I can't leave it behind, and retire, because of them.
I don't think employees realize what their employer sometimes sacrifices for their pay check, for their job.
I'm lucky to have motivated people, but sadly, also over here, the sense of entitlement is growing among the workforce in china.

Obviously, a healthy life and security is what a wealthy country should provide for their citizens, but to do so, should it punish the people who leave the security behind and work their a** off to improve the life and environment of their society?