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Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

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  • Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

    Long-term treasuries have shot up, causing the 30-year bond yield to plunge to 3.7% today. This seems to be a massive flight to safety following the deflationary news this week combined with the implosion of the auto industry along with the rest of the stock market. Yields are now at historic lows, implying an expectation of very (unrealistically) low long-term inflation. What are the markets thinking?

    How much farther can the long bond yields drop? Japan has somehow produced large amounts of government debt with very low long-term bond yields--it seems like the markets are almost anticipating the US to go that route. Could the US follow? What kinds of policy decisions would indicate that the US is headed that direction?

    The Obama administration is, of course, looking to avoid a deflationary spiral or a situation like Japan in the 90's. What is the most likely course of action for them to get us back on an inflationary path, and how soon will the strategy begin to work?

    For long-term bonds, we have some competing factors which I don't fully understand. On the one hand, we have rumors that as part of a quantitative easing strategy the Fed will buy large quantities of long-term bonds. On the other hand, we have had large issuance of bonds to finance deficit spending, and it seems like there should be continuing large increases in the supply of long-term bonds due to near-certain large government stimulus packages next year. Certain money supply numbers have been skyrocketing, yet banks are hoarding cash.

    In a worldwide slowdown, how long can the US continue to find buyers for large issuances of long-term debt? How does it make sense for the Fed to buy long-term debt while at the same time the US issues debt to pay for stimulus?

    Doesn't the government want to induce inflation very soon? Is it really that hard for the government to do it? Birds do it, bees do it, and Zimbabwe does it, after all.

  • #2
    Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

    Originally posted by brendan View Post
    Doesn't the government want to induce inflation very soon? Is it really that hard for the government to do it? Birds do it, bees do it, and Zimbabwe does it, after all.
    I think they will be able to do it. What we need to wait is for the deleveraging to "stop" when that happens look for the dollar to crash faster than it went up, imo...

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    • #3
      Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

      I bought 2 year US treasury Notes today for a client - they have a yield to maturity of .95 of 1%

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      • #4
        Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

        Originally posted by brendan View Post
        Long-term treasuries have shot up, causing the 30-year bond yield to plunge to 3.7% today. This seems to be a massive flight to safety following the deflationary news this week combined with the implosion of the auto industry along with the rest of the stock market. Yields are now at historic lows, implying an expectation of very (unrealistically) low long-term inflation. What are the markets thinking?

        How much farther can the long bond yields drop? Japan has somehow produced large amounts of government debt with very low long-term bond yields--it seems like the markets are almost anticipating the US to go that route. Could the US follow? What kinds of policy decisions would indicate that the US is headed that direction?

        The Obama administration is, of course, looking to avoid a deflationary spiral or a situation like Japan in the 90's. What is the most likely course of action for them to get us back on an inflationary path, and how soon will the strategy begin to work?

        For long-term bonds, we have some competing factors which I don't fully understand. On the one hand, we have rumors that as part of a quantitative easing strategy the Fed will buy large quantities of long-term bonds. On the other hand, we have had large issuance of bonds to finance deficit spending, and it seems like there should be continuing large increases in the supply of long-term bonds due to near-certain large government stimulus packages next year. Certain money supply numbers have been skyrocketing, yet banks are hoarding cash.

        In a worldwide slowdown, how long can the US continue to find buyers for large issuances of long-term debt? How does it make sense for the Fed to buy long-term debt while at the same time the US issues debt to pay for stimulus?

        Doesn't the government want to induce inflation very soon? Is it really that hard for the government to do it? Birds do it, bees do it, and Zimbabwe does it, after all.
        Getting off a deflationary spiral is trivial. Just throw money out of helicopters.

        The reason japan didn't do it has nothing to do with the fact that they didn't want to, but rather, they wanted to ensure that they did the right thing for their society.

        The key isn't avoiding deflation. The key is stimulating your economy without ****ing it up.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

          Originally posted by blazespinnaker View Post
          Getting off a deflationary spiral is trivial. Just throw money out of helicopters.

          The reason japan didn't do it has nothing to do with the fact that they didn't want to, but rather, they wanted to ensure that they did the right thing for their society.

          The key isn't avoiding deflation. The key is stimulating your economy without ****ing it up.
          I'd love to see the helicopters start up, but it's hard to tell whether that's happening yet or not. I assume that regarding Japan you mean that it was best for them to avoid any inflation because they're a net creditor? If so, are economists wrong to consider Japan's long period of deflation/very low inflation to be a problem for them?

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          • #6
            Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

            Originally posted by brendan View Post
            I'd love to see the helicopters start up, but it's hard to tell whether that's happening yet or not. I assume that regarding Japan you mean that it was best for them to avoid any inflation because they're a net creditor? If so, are economists wrong to consider Japan's long period of deflation/very low inflation to be a problem for them?
            Economists considered it a problem, but it certainly wasn't a big problem. Their unemployment rate peaked out at 5.3% or so.

            http://indexmundi.com/japan/unemployment_rate.html

            Not exactly great depression material..

            Now in the US, prolonged deflation will probably result in large unemployment. Something Ben will want to, and can easily avoid. The problem is doing it in such a way that we don't end up with stagflation / a run on the dollar.

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            • #7
              Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

              Originally posted by blazespinnaker View Post
              Now in the US, prolonged deflation will probably result in large unemployment. Something Ben will want to, and can easily avoid. The problem is doing it in such a way that we don't end up with stagflation / a run on the dollar.
              Any thoughts on the next anti-deflation move? So far it seems that the Fed hasn't been able to get money to move.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Meteoric rise in long-term treasuries

                Originally posted by tsetsefly View Post
                I think they will be able to do it. What we need to wait is for the deleveraging to "stop" when that happens look for the dollar to crash faster than it went up, imo...

                whats going to stop it? Wages have to go up to stop it. How's that going to happen? I'm not saying it can't, but how?

                Comment

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