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  • #16
    Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

    Originally posted by grapejelly View Post
    it's Think martial law, think no food on the shelves, think a bank "holiday".
    ...

    Their next step is to shut down the markets.
    Dont forget a shutdown of the internet. Who knows, next time we login on the internet we get http://www.dhs.gov/index.shtm

    "Preserving our freedoms" as they call it.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

      Originally posted by nitroglycol View Post
      This is all very well. What it doesn't explain, though, is why the US dollar is rising against other fiat currencies. The US is the worst debtor nation in the world; why should this be bullish for their currency?
      the USD is going up NOW because of margin calls, forced liquidation of massive leveraged stocks and bonds and paper commodities...all that is being sold for what...US dollars. That's why the USD demand is so high.

      At this point, Prechtor is right.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

        Originally posted by YoplaitLight View Post
        No demand for what? Gold, oil (or energy generally), water, or land?

        YL

        Good question.

        Those would be my thoughts on debt too. I am spending some time myself putting my thoughts together and trying to suss this situation out. Done some mammoth posts on propertypin.com

        I think we have a problem of the current system of "money-as-debt". There is less and less real wealth for the debt to chase. I mean haven't some developing countries like Brazil paid back all their money to the IMF?
        The US, UK, Ireland, Norway and Holland are tapped out. The money men need fresh meat to steal, I mean errr lend to.

        Could they create debt serfs out of the Chinese and Japanese? How about the Russians or India? The French and Germans would be a good target, but the Germans as I know them don't like to borrow too much even if the money is cheap. They like to gamble in the stock market though aka the dotcom boom. Would they buy into the 35 year no money down don't pay much today (but lose your house tomorrow) mortgage scam? They don't use credit cards. I'd say it wouldn't work. Not that Sarkozy isn't giving his best shot. He has convinced the ECB to lower rates and he tried to change the tax law on property in France in 2007 to get a bubble going... I mean fresh meat debt slaves for the money masters to rob.

        Money-as-debt is in trouble. Is it dead? What new system could replace it? Can they have money-as-a-lot-less-debt? How does that happen?
        Is fractional reserve banking broken? Is interest now an obsolete method of income? What is going to give? How deep is this really?

        CDSs
        What I am only beginning to understand are these insurance scams known as CDSs. I read an interesting post about it in the Guardian the other day.
        Another branch of the debt scam, but how does it fit in exactly? How did the Chinese money contribute to the American financial system? Could it have created such collosal mammoths like CDSs? Or would they have occurred anyway?

        http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...lobalrecession

        entering the second and more dangerous phase of this financial melt down. As corporations begin to go down the CDS and CDO's written on their debt will blow up.
        When they do, the holders lose massive amounts of money. They are losing often 90 cents in every dollar. Most of the institutions making these losses are also still highly leveraged. This means a small loss is enough to force them to have to raise more real cash to cover their losses and replace their capital holdings.
        To raise the cash they have to sell assets, call in debts or seek yet more help from the governments.
        Selling assets is depressing the value of those asset types on the market making all the other holders of that kind of asset a little bit poorer. Bringing them, in turn, a little closer to having to sell themselves.
        Calling in debts forces those from whom you call in the debts closer to bankruptcy. This is the situation with Gmac the finance arm of GM. It is virtually bankrupt and may file very soon. To stave that off, Gmac is forcing the GM dealers to whom it has loaned money to pay up. They are starting to go bust. They default on loans and round we go.
        Sovereign nations have been offering themselves as the backstop to every bad debt brought to them. If they don't stop NOW they will find their own debt, sovereign national debt, is down graded. This may happen to US national debt quite soon.
        Once that happens we are facing a Bond market dislocation.After that I won't be writing any more as there will be no point.
        This is NOT a liquidity crisis it is a Solvency crisis. The banks are insolvent. They know it. It is why they won't lend. The only lending they are doing is on the basis of the real cash the governments have injected. The governments have essentially created little banks inside the carcasses of the banks who are still poisoning the financial stream with all the worthless and toxic debt backed paper they refuse to admit is worthless.
        The banks and governments have refused to admit thee assets are worthless. Refused to force them out and to take the losses and begin to rebuild.
        All that is happening is the real worthlessness of the paper is leaking out slowly as one entity after another 9s poisoned and goes under. Basically the stuff is putrefying and leaking out.
        This isn't rocket science. Even though the bankers would like you to think it is.
        Imagine a group of men walking across an ice sheet. They are roped together for safety. Or as the financial world characterizes it - to spread the risk. Great in theory. But each man is carrying an anvil of debt. One man, lets call him Lehman, falls through. The ropes tighten, everybody stops still. No one can move. Lending stops.
        What they should do is collectively put down their anvils and let them slip down the hole Lehman made. Huge losses but the ice is safe, then hole doesn't widen. But none of them will do this. Each is convinced that one day their anvil of debt will turn to gold and they'll be rich once more. So they stand there slowly dragging each other towards the hole.
        As they get pulled closer together, their combined weight threatens to crash the entire ice sheet. The bad news is WE are all living on that sheet.



        As I understand it, derivatives ly in an entirely artificial world, the only connection to reality would be the debt that it is based on. Is this right?
        Ahh, I've sort of answered the Chinese question there I think. Has Chinese money filtered down into mortgages or is it only government to government if you know what I mean? If it has, then the derivatives are based on creditors' oney to a large extent or not?

        The derivatives are imploding because people are too much in debt and can't pay with their "real wealth" making the banks insolvent as they can't cover such incredible leverage. Is this right?

        And, are the governments using treasuries to bail out the banks? Are they swapping CDS funny money with real money and then lending this out through their semi-nationalised banks? If so, they are putting the fictional derivative money directly into the real money economy. Surely that means one thing and one thing only: INFLATION.

        They need to get rid of the banks entirely and start again, do they not? If all banks doing the funny money lending (all US and European banks it seems) are insolvent, then a new conservative and prudent banking system backed by the government needs to take over. Will they back this money with something like gold, or just be prudent in their lending? It's all a bit confusing for me.


        The longer they try and keep the oldsystem alive, the greater the danger of hyperinflation and economic collapse. Surely.

        I need to draw a diagram so I can see how everything is connected. I'm trying to work out the role of the US military and its industrial complex as well. I'm sure it is very closely connected with the debt scam.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

          Originally posted by YoplaitLight View Post
          ...3. Therefore, betting on a currency is a fool's game, as it's a race to the bottom for who can devalue the fastest -- swiss francs, backed partially by gold, are arguably a better bet than others, but in the end, all fiat currencies are in a race to the bottom.
          This is a myth. The Swiss constitution was changed by referendum effective May 1, 2000 to remove the gold backing of the Swiss Franc. Around that same time the Swiss National Bank undertook a multi-year program to sell a significant portion of the nation's gold reserves.

          There's a number of recent threads on iTulip debating the merits of various currencies, including the Swiss Franc. Although I played the Franc against the US$ starting in Dec '06, I sold when the Franc hit my target of par with the US$ earlier this year. I am firmly of the view that the Franc is simply a Euro with a shinier coating. The Swiss simply cannot allow their currency to get too far out of line with its major trade block's currency. So going long the Swissie is now really not much different from going long the Euro. The Swissie continues to live off it's historic legacy as a safe haven. But the world has moved on, and so should investors.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

            Sorry about the underline. I'll try again.




            Originally posted by YoplaitLight View Post
            No demand for what? Gold, oil (or energy generally), water, or land?

            YL

            Good question.

            Those would be my thoughts on debt too. I am spending some time myself putting my thoughts together and trying to suss this situation out. Done some mammoth posts on propertypin.com

            I think we have a problem of the current system of "money-as-debt". There is less and less real wealth for the debt to chase. I mean haven't some developing countries like Brazil paid back all their money to the IMF?
            The US, UK, Ireland, Norway and Holland are tapped out. The money men need fresh meat to steal, I mean errr lend to.

            Could they create debt serfs out of the Chinese and Japanese? How about the Russians or India? The French and Germans would be a good target, but the Germans as I know them don't like to borrow too much even if the money is cheap. They like to gamble in the stock market though aka the dotcom boom. Would they buy into the 35 year no money down don't pay much today (but lose your house tomorrow) mortgage scam? They don't use credit cards. I'd say it wouldn't work. Not that Sarkozy isn't giving his best shot. He has convinced the ECB to lower rates and he tried to change the tax law on property in France in 2007 to get a bubble going... I mean fresh meat debt slaves for the money masters to rob.

            Money-as-debt is in trouble. Is it dead? What new system could replace it? Can they have money-as-a-lot-less-debt? How does that happen?
            Is fractional reserve banking broken? Is interest now an obsolete method of income? What is going to give? How deep is this really?

            CDSs
            What I am only beginning to understand are these insurance scams known as CDSs. I read an interesting post about it in the Guardian the other day.
            Another branch of the debt scam, but how does it fit in exactly? How did the Chinese money contribute to the American financial system? Could it have created such collosal mammoths like CDSs? Or would they have occurred anyway?

            http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...lobalrecession

            "We are entering the second and more dangerous phase of this financial melt down. As corporations begin to go down the CDS and CDO's written on their debt will blow up.
            When they do, the holders lose massive amounts of money. They are losing often 90 cents in every dollar. Most of the institutions making these losses are also still highly leveraged. This means a small loss is enough to force them to have to raise more real cash to cover their losses and replace their capital holdings.
            To raise the cash they have to sell assets, call in debts or seek yet more help from the governments.
            Selling assets is depressing the value of those asset types on the market making all the other holders of that kind of asset a little bit poorer. Bringing them, in turn, a little closer to having to sell themselves.
            Calling in debts forces those from whom you call in the debts closer to bankruptcy. This is the situation with Gmac the finance arm of GM. It is virtually bankrupt and may file very soon. To stave that off, Gmac is forcing the GM dealers to whom it has loaned money to pay up. They are starting to go bust. They default on loans and round we go.
            Sovereign nations have been offering themselves as the backstop to every bad debt brought to them. If they don't stop NOW they will find their own debt, sovereign national debt, is down graded. This may happen to US national debt quite soon.
            Once that happens we are facing a Bond market dislocation.After that I won't be writing any more as there will be no point.
            This is NOT a liquidity crisis it is a Solvency crisis. The banks are insolvent. They know it. It is why they won't lend. The only lending they are doing is on the basis of the real cash the governments have injected. The governments have essentially created little banks inside the carcasses of the banks who are still poisoning the financial stream with all the worthless and toxic debt backed paper they refuse to admit is worthless.
            The banks and governments have refused to admit thee assets are worthless. Refused to force them out and to take the losses and begin to rebuild.
            All that is happening is the real worthlessness of the paper is leaking out slowly as one entity after another 9s poisoned and goes under. Basically the stuff is putrefying and leaking out.
            This isn't rocket science. Even though the bankers would like you to think it is.
            Imagine a group of men walking across an ice sheet. They are roped together for safety. Or as the financial world characterizes it - to spread the risk. Great in theory. But each man is carrying an anvil of debt. One man, lets call him Lehman, falls through. The ropes tighten, everybody stops still. No one can move. Lending stops.
            What they should do is collectively put down their anvils and let them slip down the hole Lehman made. Huge losses but the ice is safe, then hole doesn't widen. But none of them will do this. Each is convinced that one day their anvil of debt will turn to gold and they'll be rich once more. So they stand there slowly dragging each other towards the hole.
            As they get pulled closer together, their combined weight threatens to crash the entire ice sheet. The bad news is WE are all living on that sheet."


            As I understand it, derivatives ly in an entirely artificial world, the only connection to reality would be the debt that it is based on. Is this right?
            Ahh, I've sort of answered the Chinese question there I think. Has Chinese money filtered down into mortgages or is it only government to government if you know what I mean? If it has, then the derivatives are based on creditors' oney to a large extent or not?

            The derivatives are imploding because people are too much in debt and can't pay with their "real wealth" making the banks insolvent as they can't cover such incredible leverage. Is this right?

            And, are the governments using treasuries to bail out the banks? Are they swapping CDS funny money with real money and then lending this out through their semi-nationalised banks? If so, they are putting the fictional derivative money directly into the real money economy. Surely that means one thing and one thing only: INFLATION.

            They need to get rid of the banks entirely and start again, do they not? If all banks doing the funny money lending (all US and European banks it seems) are insolvent, then a new conservative and prudent banking system backed by the government needs to take over. Will they back this money with something like gold, or just be prudent in their lending? It's all a bit confusing for me.


            The longer they try and keep the oldsystem alive, the greater the danger of hyperinflation and economic collapse. Surely.

            I need to draw a diagram so I can see how everything is connected. I'm trying to work out the role of the US military and its industrial complex as well. I'm sure it is very closely connected with the debt scam.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

              Originally posted by $#* View Post
              Nope. Quite predictable actually. Get a good tinfoil hat and you will have no surprises anymore....
              No real need for the shiny headgear actually . Just a recognition that, much like Hollywood's physically impossible special effects, the world now, more than ever, revolves around a series of rapidly changing myths.

              Today, for example, "everyone" has decided that we are in a global deflation...even though we aren't. "Everyone" has decided that we have a massive physical oil glut...even though we don't. "Everyone" thinks the US Dollar is the soundest currency on the planet...even though it isn't. Earlier this year a number of nations restricted rice and grain exports believing in the myth that the world was about to enter a permanent shortage...even though it wasn't.

              One does not need to adopt $#*'s organized conspiracy New World Order thesis to accept his/her oft repeated observation that "things are often not [never?] as they may appear". It matters not that I am a confirmed inflationist and my portfolio is positioned that way since the halcyon days of the tech bubble [partially hedged with a large Yen and Singapore $ long]. If the rest of the world thinks we are in deflation, then deflation is what the markets will reflect, non?

              At the beginning of this week I broke my "I am not a trader" rule and took a small short gold position [as an additional short term hedge for my inflation positioned portfolio]. My simple minded thesis [much cruder than $#*'s elegantly crafted stuff ;)] is that the world at large will continue to believe there is no reason to hold gold as long as the US Dollar is in demand. Further, Central Banks hold gold, in part, to hedge against their universally large US Dollar reserves positions. Now when I look around the world I see country after country desperately trying to defend their currencies, and rapidly depleting their foreign reserves in the process. What do they do next? Sell some of their gold perhaps? After all, with no immediate danger of needing a US Dollar hedge, why hold as much of the yellow metal.
              Last edited by GRG55; October 24, 2008, 08:37 AM.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

                Originally posted by nitroglycol View Post
                This is all very well. What it doesn't explain, though, is why the US dollar is rising against other fiat currencies. The US is the worst debtor nation in the world; why should this be bullish for their currency?

                I have a guess as to why, though I'd like the input of folks more knowledgeable than I. Consider an analogy -- you have cancer, and a better than even chance of being dead in a year. Does it therefore make sense to bet money on being dead in a year? No, because you won't be around to collect. So you bet on surviving, even if the odds against you, because if you lose the bet it won't matter.

                Similarly, to bet on the collapse of the US dollar is to bet on the collapse of the entire international financial system. Of course, something new will arise in its place, but from the point of view of a participant in the system, such a collapse is a huge catastrophe, and winning a bet on it happening won't be much comfort.

                Indeed, there's another factor at play as well -- bets for or against the system tend to be self-fulfilling, so it makes even more sense for those who have a vested interest in the system to bet in its favour.

                Does this make sense?

                Your very smart and very observant, it makes perfect sense.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: The dollar is rocking right now!

                  Originally posted by labasta View Post
                  Sorry about the underline. I'll try again.
                  You know you can go back and edit, or even delete, your old posts?

                  Comment

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