We had to burn the village to save it...

[swgprop]

We had to burn the village to save it

The title of this diary is a quote from the Vietnam era that sums up for many the arrogance and pointlessness of American aggression in Asia two generations ago. It keeps coming to mind each time I read President Bush’s (paraphrased) statement this week: We had to nationalise the banks “to preserve the free market.”

There is no free market when the government owns the actors and sets the terms of transactions. There is no village once it has been burned to the ground.

. . .


Perhaps someday we will hear a remorseful Mr Paulson or Mr Brown echo Robert McNamara, early architect and aggressive propagator of the Vietnam War: “We were wrong, terribly wrong.”

Well written entry by Londonbanker ..

http://londonbanker.blogspot.com/200...o-save-it.html

[GRG55]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

Well written entry by Londonbanker ..

http://londonbanker.blogspot.com/200...o-save-it.html

Couldn't have described it better than this...

"...And so in the US, UK and EU we have politicians appropriating more petrol to hand to the arsonists who started the conflagration which is consuming our economic and political fabric. The regulators whose forbearance is a root cause of the current conflagration are handing the arsonists fresh zippo lighters..."

[audrey_girl]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

or ...

They (the Romans) make it a desert and call it a peace.

Publius Cornelius Tacitus

[GRG55]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

or ...

They (the Romans) make it a desert and call it a peace.

Publius Cornelius Tacitus

An earlier version of this, perhaps? At least tilling salt into the soil left the villages standing...


B-36 Peacemaker
The Peacemaker was the first true intercontinental bomber.
The B-36 was the largest bomber in physical size that has ever gone into service with the USAF.

[metalman]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

An earlier version of this, perhaps? At least tilling salt into the soil left the villages standing...


B-36 Peacemaker
The Peacemaker was the first true intercontinental bomber.
The B-36 was the largest bomber in physical size that has ever gone into service with the USAF.

not one in 10mil can comprehend the scale of the destruction that has occurred. 100s of years of market development ruined. no shit. it won't be apparent for a year or two, but when it is it will hit folks like a b36 peacekeeper.

[Chris]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

METALMAN, I value your opinion highly and would like to know what you meant by that last comment. Would you care to expand?

[due_indigence]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

Yes Metalman, the conceptual carnage is huge. When America was leaned on during 9/11, it tossed its civil rights like a hot potato. Now we're showing the same impulsivity towards our financial system, arguably centuries in the making. Pain avoidance trumps character in both instances. We've devolved into a bunch of p*ssies who in Ben Franklin's stern glare would deserve neither liberty, security nor financial prowess.

Where went the men on Omaha Beach? Oh yeah, they died.

[xela]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

not one in 10mil can comprehend the scale of the destruction that has occurred. 100s of years of market development ruined. no shit. it won't be apparent for a year or two, but when it is it will hit folks like a b36 peacekeeper.

some 40 years I would understand.. but 100s, overdose of drama :cool:

[BiscayneSunrise]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

Allow me to jump in and piggy back on metalman's comment:

Libertarians and conservatives bemoan government intervention but the reality is that as a global superpower the US must have a robust industrial and monetary policy. Government leaders are like the monarchs of old in that they are mostly interested in using their countries economy to further their political goals.

What can start out as necessary intervention can morph into a really ugly unintended consequence. For instance, The Patriot Act and this superpower authority given to the Sec Treasury will be on the books for generations. Conservative politicians who loath giving the government that kind of power rationalize it by saying "we can trust "X" to be responsible. But they forget that good ol' trustworthy "X" won't always be there and that in the future the government may not be so benevolent in its' execution of various authorities.

So. The thing to understand is that we really don't have a market anymore, at least not in its truest sense of the word. I'm not sure what it is exactly but its not a market. Of course, some would say haven't had a free market
in some time. So to metalman's point much damage has been done and it remains to be seen what it looks like exactly and it remains to be seen if the free market humpty dumpty can ever be put back together, especially given big governments predilection for interference.

Both parties are guilty, of course. Democrats believe in the power of government intervention and are unabashed in saying so. Republicans like to say they don't pick winners preferring to leave that to the free market. That of course, is laughable. what Republicans really mean is that we don't want to help people they don't like. The tax code is rife with government picking winners. The takeaway being politicians (the monarchs of the modern era) really care about their own power and modifying peoples behavior and will use the economy to their own ends. They have always liked the smell of that blood but it wasn't always politically correct to be overt interventionists. Washington now has the keys to the kingdom and will likely enjoy it to the fullest extent possible.

[vinoveri]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

not one in 10mil can comprehend the scale of the destruction that has occurred. 100s of years of market development ruined. no shit. it won't be apparent for a year or two, but when it is it will hit folks like a b36 peacekeeper.

What does that 1 in 10mil do now? That's a quandary. There's no way to know what's going to happen, what's going up or what's going down, since the gov is in everything and can change the rules on the fly. How's one to acquire or preserve wealth or better yet security?

1. Tune out (pretend like nothing's happened)? Just pile back into equities and invest for the longterm b/c the government makes the markets now and as long as everyone's 401ks are going up, the population is satisfied to continue in its servile wage treadmill. This is what the majority will do I predict, and this is why there will be no effective change for a long time.

2. Drop out. 3 acres and a cow.

3. Act. As GK Chesterton said, you must love something (even if it is unlovable) in order to make it lovable (again). Can we see that the thing we love has become grotesque even through its "freedom and justice" facade (the picture of Dorian Gray comes to mind). Is the light of liberty going to be extinguished or can libertarians, for all their individualism, band together to save it.

[xela]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

This would require you to be kept in a constant state of some sort of disbelief about what is going on, no?
Thats why I said overdose of drama.. though can't quite comprehend it all myself yet (and it is just out of a personal desire to do so, not professional).
Truly interesting times, thanks for your reply.

[BiscayneSunrise]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

This would require you to be kept in a constant state of some sort of disbelief about what is going on, no?
Thats why I said overdose of drama.. though can't quite comprehend it all myself yet (and it is just out of a personal desire to do so, not professional).
Truly interesting times, thanks for your reply.

A constant state of disbelief? An interesting point. The best way to make decisions is to be as steely eyed as possible and adjust to new realities as quickly as possible. Being eternally cynical just for the sake of being cynical is a bad way to go though life. Skeptical yes, cynical, no.

Having said that, the problem we have now is a serious weakening of the public's trust in the system. Perhaps that is why Obama has been so successful. As Bill Clinton pointed out during the primaries, Obama represents nothing but a promise. So if people disbelieve in reality, then at the same time, they will believe in a fantasy.

[GRG55]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

A constant state of disbelief? An interesting point. The best way to make decisions is to be as steely eyed as possible and adjust to new realities as quickly as possible. Being eternally cynical just for the sake of being cynical is a bad way to go though life. Skeptical yes, cynical, no.

Having said that, the problem we have now is a serious weakening of the public's trust in the system. Perhaps that is why Obama has been so successful. As Bill Clinton pointed out during the primaries, Obama represents nothing but a promise. So if people disbelieve in reality, then at the same time, they will believe in a fantasy.

Aren't all "democratic" election campaigns, everywhere, an exercise in selling the fantasy that the voters can have whatever they demand? And "cost-free" at that?

[xela]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

A constant state of disbelief? An interesting point. The best way to make decisions is to be as steely eyed as possible and adjust to new realities as quickly as possible. Being eternally cynical just for the sake of being cynical is a bad way to go though life. Skeptical yes, cynical, no.

Having said that, the problem we have now is a serious weakening of the public's trust in the system. Perhaps that is why Obama has been so successful. As Bill Clinton pointed out during the primaries, Obama represents nothing but a promise. So if people disbelieve in reality, then at the same time, they will believe in a fantasy.

For the record: I try not to be cynical. ;)
But realities sure change quick :eek:

[Supercilious]

Re: We had to burn the village to save it...

Libertarians and conservatives bemoan government intervention but the reality is that as a global superpower the US must have a robust industrial and monetary policy.

A true libertarian believes that United States of America should have nothing to do with the concept of "global superpower"

“Free commerce with all nations; entangling alliances with none; and little or no diplomatic establishment”

Do you really believe the Average Joe has any benefit from the "global superpower" status of US ? Well... besides the benefit of being allowed to die fighting imperial wars in remote and exotic places like Vietnam, Beirut, Iraq, Afghanistan etc. ;)

The "global superpower" status is a benefit only for the financial elite and allows them to use the state as a tool for promotion of financial neo-colonialism.

IMHO, only when the desire to be a global superpower is rejected by the People, can the USA have a sound and robust industrial monetary policy. Until then is just a giant scam for the benefit of a few and free market capitalism is replaced with a terrible masquerade.