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when the fed pauses, then cuts

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  • when the fed pauses, then cuts

    from contraryinvestor.com;



    In June of 2000, the Fed went “on hold” with their monetary tightening of the prior period. And as you can perhaps make out in the chart, as the Fed pause went into effect, the S&P rallied. Clearly the thought at the time, as we believe is the case today, was that monetary policy reigned supreme. It could cure all economic and market maladies. Unfortunately that was not to be the case as corporate capital spending literally fell off of a cliff, corporate earnings were negatively influenced, and these factors took the real economy into what was ultimately to be a mild recesionary interlude. So here we stand today with the Fed now on pause in terms of further rate hikes. Here we stand with the equity markets having now rallied back from their summertime lows, as they did off of their springtime lows in 2000. And here we stand today facing what we believe will be a slowdown in consumer spending ahead, as opposed to capital spending slowing in late 2000 through 2002. Are we looking at a conceptual “rhyme”? Are investors once again assuming interest rates cure all ills as opposed to looking at the components of consumer and capital spending demand and the influence of that demand on corporate earnings? From our vantage point, it sure seems the markets are much more reactive to anything related to forward interest rates as opposed to the trajectory of forward earnings driven by consumer and business demand.

    A few last comments and we’ll move on. You know that virtually everything we commented on up to this point has to do with real economic fundamentals. If indeed the US economy slows ahead based on our expectation of a slowdown in consumer spending, we’re convinced the Fed will panic. They have no other tricks up their sleeves. If indeed this comes to pass, you can bet your last dollar that liquidity will once again be force fed into the system. You may have seen that just last week the Fed did two coupon passes in one day, followed up by a very substantial two week temporary open market liquidity injection. Although we don’t want to sound like we’re talking out of both sides of our mouth, Fed liquidity is the big wildcard we need to remember to respect. If indeed the Fed creates yet another liquidity mushroom cloud somewhere ahead, we need to once again “follow the money”. Personally, although we need to remember that our personal opinions are for show and not dough, we believe the market is wrong to expect ever ascending double-digit corporate earnings growth in a slowing consumer environment. Additionally, we also believe the market is incorrect to attribute omniscience to a group of human beings called the FOMC. Could it be that current equity market action is indeed anticipating a Fed panic attack somewhere in the next six to twelve months whereby excess liquidity created by the very same finds its way into equities solely as a default choice (given that the residential real estate cycle is spent)? We need to remain open to this possibility, especially in terms of risk management activities. We’re convinced that at some point credit and liquidity creation will no longer be able to save the macro economic day, so to speak, but that doesn't mean the Fed won’t die trying.
    Last edited by jk; September 23, 2006, 12:36 PM.

  • #2
    Re: when the fed pauses, then cuts

    I hope that this is a suckers rally, I am certainly betting that it is, but I think we need to be careful about underestimating people's abilities to learn from the (relatively recent) past.

    The dot com bust is still fresh, as well as the fed cuts. There is a possibility that everyone is right here (bulls and bears), and the only thing we all differ on is timing.

    What do I mean by that? The bulls are right that the market is going to go up from here, and the bears were right to be extremely pessimistic, and that the dip we recently saw was the bottom.

    There is also a possibility that inflation is paying a role in this that is still underappreciated. Money growth could still be massive, while costs are being kept low due to globalisation. In such a case, stocks can run for quite a while yet, at least until globalisation is reigned in or stops undewriting american consumption.

    Betting that the chinese are going to float the yuan and stop helping out american dad is a tough bet to make. Or, rather, betting WHEN they're going to do that is a tough bet to make. And who knows what else will be along when they finally do that.

    The market can stay irrational much longer than you can remain solvent...
    Last edited by blazespinnaker; September 23, 2006, 01:19 PM.

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    • #3
      Re: when the fed pauses, then cuts

      Missed this on the first pass

      Could it be that current equity market action is indeed anticipating a Fed panic attack somewhere in the next six to twelve months whereby excess liquidity created by the very same finds its way into equities solely as a default choice (given that the residential real estate cycle is spent)? We need to remain open to this possibility, especially in terms of risk management activities. We’re convinced that at some point credit and liquidity creation will no longer be able to save the macro economic day, so to speak, but that doesn't mean the Fed won’t die trying.
      My take on this is that he believes in explosive money growth and what we're seeing now is an attempt to protect against inflation.

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      • #4
        Re: when the fed pauses, then cuts

        Originally posted by blazespinnaker
        I hope that this is a suckers rally, I am certainly betting that it is, but I think we need to be careful about underestimating people's abilities to learn from the (relatively recent) past.
        i think you are overestimating people's abilities to learn from the (relatively recent) past.

        Originally posted by blazespinnaker
        The dot com bust is still fresh, as well as the fed cuts. There is a possibility that everyone is right here (bulls and bears), and the only thing we all differ on is timing.

        What do I mean by that? The bulls are right that the market is going to go up from here, and the bears were right to be extremely pessimistic, and that the dip we recently saw was the bottom.
        david fuller, at fullermoney.com, is a smart guy and he thinks we've already seen the bottom. other folks i read are of the other persuasion. it could be that the market, having faked out the bears with the recent rally, will now fake out the bulls by plunging. i think i need to be prepared to deal with either outcome, hoping my gains will outweigh my losses under either scenario. risk management is where it's at.

        Originally posted by blazespinnaker
        There is also a possibility that inflation is paying a role in this that is still underappreciated. Money growth could still be massive, while costs are being kept low due to globalisation. In such a case, stocks can run for quite a while yet, at least until globalisation is reigned in or stops undewriting american consumption.
        contraryinvestor.com discussed the possiblity of newly pumped liquidity heading into the equity markets for lack of good alternatives. if so, i wonder which equity markets would be favored - here or abroad? and wouldn't some of it head back into commodities?

        my own thought is that new liquidity would first hit the bond market. in fact maybe it already has. "You may have seen that just last week the Fed did two coupon passes in one day, followed up by a very substantial two week temporary open market liquidity injection." is it coincidence that bonds did so well this week? i'm skeptical that significantly lower rates would re-inflate the housing bubble, but it sure could ease the landing. that would soften the slowdown or recession ahead, but i doubt avoid it altogether.

        u.s. rates dropping will probably hit the dollar vis a vis the euro. the big question then is whether the chinese and/or japanese allow their currencies to rise in a significant way. come to think of it, they could move into the dollar/euro spread and allow the yen and yuan to rise against the dollar while simultaneously ease against the euro. that seems plausible to me. [anyone have any thoughts pro or con this scenario?]
        Last edited by jk; September 23, 2006, 02:14 PM.

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        • #5
          Re: when the fed pauses, then cuts

          Originally posted by jk
          i think you are overestimating people's abilities to learn from the (relatively recent) past.
          Not at all, I am betting this is a suckers rally, but I always wonder a lot if perhaps the market knows more than I do.

          I think people who talk about it being a suckers rally without thinking about how efficient markets can really be (and damn, they can be efficient) is doing a big disservice to themselves.

          david fuller, at fullermoney.com, is a smart guy and he thinks we've already seen the bottom. other folks i read are of the other persuasion. it could be that the market, having faked out the bears with the recent rally, will now fake out the bulls by plunging. i think i need to be prepared to deal with either outcome, hoping my gains will outweigh my losses under either scenario. risk management is where it's at.
          Betting against the market is always a dangerous proposition. It's rigged so that the house always loses, if you know what I mean.

          I think a better way of looking at it is that the market is going to go up for sure, but will it go up the fastest? I think there is a possibility here is that the market is merely a bad choice among terrible choices.

          contraryinvestor.com discussed the possiblity of newly pumped liquidity heading into the equity markets for lack of good alternatives. if so, i wonder which equity markets would be favored - here or abroad? and wouldn't some of it head back into commodities?

          my own thought is that new liquidity would first hit the bond market. in fact maybe it already has. "You may have seen that just last week the Fed did two coupon passes in one day, followed up by a very substantial two week temporary open market liquidity injection." is it coincidence that bonds did so well this week? i'm skeptical that significantly lower rates would re-inflate the housing bubble, but it sure could ease the landing. that would soften the slowdown or recession ahead, but i doubt avoid it altogether.
          Actually, lowering rates could hurt the housing market as people put off decisions to wait and see how far lower the market will go before locking in.

          And, yeah, the bond rally could definitely have been the fed buying up bonds at a temporary accelerated rate. What's up with that? Is there an election coming up soon or something?

          u.s. rates dropping will probably hit the dollar vis a vis the euro. the big question then is whether the chinese and/or japanese allow their currencies to rise in a significant way. come to think of it, they could move into the dollar/euro spread and allow the yen and yuan to rise against the dollar while simultaneously ease against the euro. that seems plausible to me. [anyone have any thoughts pro or con this scenario?]
          Yeah,

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