Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

[rj1]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

LOL. I seem to recall reading that Cayne was playing golf and bridge as Bear's two hedge funds blew up last year. Apparently there's nothing to worry about when you know the Federal cavalry will ride to the rescue...

Bear Stearn's Cayne Was Playing Bridge in Detroit, WSJ Says

By Nicholas Larkin

March 15 (Bloomberg) -- Bear Stearns Cos. Chairman James ``Jimmy'' Cayne was playing in the North American Bridge Championship in Detroit over the past two days, the Wall Street Journal reported.

Cayne and a partner were placed fourth in a pair's event on March 13, the newspaper reported yesterday, citing the American Contract Bridge League's Web site.

The event took place while Bear Stearns Chief Executive Officer Alan Schwartz held a series of conference calls with company directors to discuss a cash pledge from the Federal Reserve and JPMorgan Chase & Co., the Journal said, citing unnamed ``insiders'' and people familiar with the matter. Cayne participated in at least some of the discussions, the newspaper said.

Cayne was playing the game yesterday as the investment bank's shares plunged, according to an unnamed attendee, the Journal reported, adding that Cayne declined a request to comment.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...efer=worldwide

They had a blurb on his stock holding in Bear Stearns on CNBC Friday. His stock was originally worth $1 billion last year, and was worth $200 million on Friday. Tomorrow, after J.P. Morgan gives $2/share, it will be worth $14 million.

A loss of $986 million. I think I would be beyond sick.

[Jim Nickerson]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

They had a blurb on his stock holding in Bear Stearns on CNBC Friday. His stock was originally worth $1 billion last year, and was worth $200 million on Friday. Tomorrow, after J.P. Morgan gives $2/share, it will be worth $14 million.

A loss of $986 million. I think I would be beyond sick.

If the truth were knowable, I would bet that what you wrote is not the truth. Those dudes don't lose money, it is ordinary people who lose money. Actually if the guy ended up being worth 2bonar he'd still be guilty of stealing.

[Mega]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

May you live in in-testing times
Mike

[rj1]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

May you live in in-testing times
Mike

Most of the common folk that live in interesting times wind up dead, Mike.

And I can't speak for you, but last I checked, I'm common folk.

Look, if you took steps to take care of yourself and profit because you saw this coming, good for you. I had my 401(k) wrapped up in normal stocks which I couldn't move, but as a hedge to just try and make up some of the loss I got some gold last September. A lot of people are going to be hurt in this. I'm not saying don't try to profit, or not even to not make a bag of popcorn as you're watching, but don't treat this as some great day. It's not, it's sad, even if predictable.

Dollar is now down to 96 yen as of right now.

[kelton56]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

They had a blurb on his stock holding in Bear Stearns on CNBC Friday. His stock was originally worth $1 billion last year, and was worth $200 million on Friday. Tomorrow, after J.P. Morgan gives $2/share, it will be worth $14 million.

A loss of $986 million. I think I would be beyond sick.

That was one expensive bridge tournament...

[FRED]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

That was one expensive bridge tournament...

But what if, um, that's also true of Lehman and others?

[Jim Nickerson]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

Most of the common folk that live in interesting times wind up dead, Mike.

And I can't speak for you, but last I checked, I'm common folk.

Look, if you took steps to take care of yourself and profit because you saw this coming, good for you. I had my 401(k) wrapped up in normal stocks which I couldn't move, but as a hedge to just try and make up some of the loss I got some gold last September. A lot of people are going to be hurt in this. I'm not saying don't try to profit, or not even to not make a bag of popcorn as you're watching, but don't treat this as some great day. It's not, it's sad, even if predictable.

Dollar is now down to 96 yen as of right now.

I think what may approach realism is to look back at the last decade or more and all the shit that was actually happening and perceived as a wild, woolly, extreme-sports-type-thrill was actually what it was and that is shit. That was sad. Whatever we might get next, if we are lucky enough for the FOMC to fail, hopefully will be painful enough so that it will not to be forgotten in the next 3 generations. That will be good in the truest sense of good. The sooner this crap is behind whatever generations ends up standing, will be the start of whatever good is still out there for North Americans.

[rj1]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

I think what may approach realism is to look back at the last decade or more and all the shit that was actually happening and perceived as a wild, woolly, extreme-sports-type-thrill was actually what it was and that is shit. That was sad. Whatever we might get next, if we are lucky enough for the FOMC to fail, hopefully will be painful enough so that it will not to be forgotten in the next 3 generations. That will be good in the truest sense of good. The sooner this crap is behind whatever generations ends up standing, will be the start of whatever good is still out there for North Americans.

Look, the actions of the government in the 1920s and such were sad, however, the actions of the government in the 1920s hurt a lot of people that were not at fault for why the Depression began to start with. You need to realize that the economy is and always will be a kind of medieval war, where the offenders start the war, buy themselves out of conscription, and go watch the ne'er-do-wells fight and die so the offenders could resolve their argument.

The people that were responsible for these dumb idiot mortgage loans at Bear Stearns are not going to be in the poor line, they took care of themselves, as any person would do. It's the rest of us that pay for this.

So again, take actions to profit from this because that is how the market works, but don't treat this as if everyone that is getting their life savings raped deserves it.

And history is circular. So I imagine this would happen again in the next 3 generations. Why? Cause that's human nature. There will always be swindlers, there will always be wars, there will always be genocides, there will always be plagues, there will always be crooks in suits trying to take your money through nefarious means. Just accept it.

[Jim Nickerson]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

Look, the actions of the government in the 1920s and such were sad, however, the actions of the government in the 1920s hurt a lot of people that were not at fault for why the Depression began to start with. You need to realize that the economy is and always will be a kind of medieval war, where the offenders start the war, buy themselves out of conscription, and go watch the ne'er-do-wells fight and die so the offenders could resolve their argument.

The people that were responsible for these dumb idiot mortgage loans at Bear Stearns are not going to be in the poor line, they took care of themselves, as any person would do. It's the rest of us that pay for this.

So again, take actions to profit from this because that is how the market works, but don't treat this as if everyone that is getting their life savings raped deserves it.

Who is to say those that lose their hides don't deserve it? In this society it is not easy to find people who are doggedly devoted to looking after themselves, people who know to trust only themselves with their money because others cannot be trusted, people who are not truly sheeple. Sheeple get slaugthed or sheared. In my opinion this country and those supposedly responsible for rearing reliable, educated, children willing to work hard to succeed is failing because we, and damned I hate to include myself in this morass but I have been there, are expecting someone to step in and save our asses.

It isn't going to ever get better until it gets a lot worse. Those that can't stand it can move, commit suicide, or start stealing from others. There hopefully is no easy way out of this.

[goldisliberty]

Re: Bear Is Gone...

Those of us who are long & strong with gold and silver should be humble, agreed. When we're at $ 3,500 AU and over $125 AG, the "interesting times," will indeed be dangerous times. Who knows if there will indeed be "blood in the streets."

Once confidence is replaced by suspicion and fear, the bids will evaporate on the paper of dozens of Planet Wall Street's firms.

Lehman is likely next to go.

Goldman Sachs is rumored tonight to be about to announce a $ 3Bln loss on derivatives Tuesday, 03/18/08. JPMorgan reports Tuesday also; Morgan Stanley reports on Wednesday. Let's just say the fixed-income markets are taking bar shots of Maalox and Pepto with both fists.

Citi and Merrill are still not out of the woods, not by a long shot.

Bear Stears had 14,153 employees. Tonight, Sunday, their NYC HQ on Madison Avenue has a higher value than the firm. What was once $ 170/share dropped to 0.01176 of that valuation. How many BSC employees got Christmas bonuses of stock on which they paid income taxes (probably around 65-57/share) and they're now wiped out.

Looks like their greed (over-leveraging positions based upon fraudulent mortgages) proved their un-doing.

So, like Yeats' fire and water in the same vessel, I'm both glad and sad that my PMs are soaring.

PPT will circle the wagons on Monday and try to put a bid under all the fear and loathing.

Just like in 1896, 1932 and 1980, we're headed to DOW:GOLD ratio of 1:1, certainly under 2 ozt AU to buy the DJIA. AU:AG likely well under 30.

This is not the end of the world. It is the re-pricing of the world. And sadly for many of us it is the end of the dollar as the world's senior reserve currency.

It is a humbling experience indeed. The bullet was fired August 15, 1971. That closing-the-gold-window bullet is now, like in the slowest slow-motion movie of all time, finally hitting a vital organ.

Who knows how high WTIC (crude oil) or wheat are headed?

A true commercial signal failure looms in the NYMEX gold and silver pits and this year we're likely to see the London Fix come more than $100 higher...with NY having to go limit-up for days just to catch up.

Finally, with the Yen trading around 96 to a dollar, that carry trade will be history. The AUD/USD cross will be a new carry...and the Swissie is right now trading at 1.0286!

SO, any color but green (USD). Asian traders tonight are now liking:
Swissie, Yen, Gold and Oil.

My fellow i-Tulipers: yeah, I'm getting fat on these breath-taking market moves, but I'm not getting cocky. There will be breath-taking volatility for everyone.

For those of you who are good poker players, watch Ben Bernanke this week (and Hank Paulson). I'm experiencing sensory overload from all their "tells."

Best of luck to us all. Keep your families close and your precious metals closer. We are truly living through history.

[Tulpen]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

Holy SHIT! (sorry Eric,but)
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...tOI&refer=home
Mike

I wonder if Moodys downgrades Bear Stearn from an AAA to an AA ;)

[GRG55]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

But what if, um, that's also true of Lehman and others?

Exactly. To paraphrase Jim Sinclair...those who are long gold will rejoice if it gets to $2000; and then the rejoicing will end when one realizes why gold is at $2000.

What I found especially rich are the reports that many Bear Stearns employees are pissed that the Fed didn't bail out the firm sooner (and save their jobs, stock options, bonuses and their butts, I presume). What are these people thinking?

[Jim Nickerson]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

Exactly. To paraphrase Jim Sinclair...those who are long gold will rejoice if it gets to $2000; and then the rejoicing will end when one realizes why gold is at $2000.

What I found especially rich are the reports that many Bear Stearns employees are pissed that the Fed didn't bail out the firm sooner (and save their jobs, stock options, bonuses and their butts, I presume). What are these people thinking?

I heard Jimmy Rogers on Bloomberg radio this AM say, that by preventing BSC from going bankrupt, JPM saved the bonuses. If bankrupt someone would have to give the bonuses back. I don't if that is correct or not.

[jk]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

I wonder if Moodys downgrades Bear Stearn from an AAA to an AA ;)

from reuters

17Mar08 RTRS-UBS CUTS BEAR STEARNS PRICE TARGET TO $2 FROM $94; HAS NEUTRAL RATING......


helpful analyst there.

[Tulpen]

Re: Bear Is Toast!!!!!!!!

from reuters

17Mar08 RTRS-UBS CUTS BEAR STEARNS PRICE TARGET TO $2 FROM $94; HAS NEUTRAL RATING......


helpful analyst there.

He earned his bonus.