Buchanan on Trump

[lakedaemonian]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

I'm not so sure Trump's bigoted braggadocio is different in anything but degree than what one hears among white folks when they're feeling safe and comfy among their people.

Before DT ever stepped into the ring, we've heard talk like this at the office, at the gym, the tavern, the barber shop, you name it. Trump's easy, breezy white supremacy is hardly remarkable.

This white supremacist frame organizing and rationalizing the ideas, emotions, and inclination to discriminate is so common among American whites that it's practically the air we breathe. Other than the fact that it's being uttered by a presidential candidate (in lieu of code words like "law and order" or "welfare queen"), there's nothing particularly astonishing about it.

Folks who evidence this sort of thinking are generally as far removed from the Aryan Nation/KKK sort as Trump is from the person who cleans his toilets. While they lack the consciousness of the racist, their attitudes, actions and utterances are fundamental to the advancement of the white supremacist project.

And this is what makes this POV so insidious, because while remaining generally invisible to white people who hold it, it is instrumental in distorting the allocation of resources that nurtures the ubiquitous, persistent and ever-growing disparities in economic, health, and social indicators between black and white.



If I had a dollar for every time a group of nice, hard working, family-oriented middle class white guys let loose with this stuff I might start to rival Trump's net worth.

Take another gander at the kind, Jesus-loving folks in my sig. Not a racist among them.

Gee Woody...tell us what you really think.

A few points worth mentioning that you intentionally forgot:

The racism that you point out is not unique to centre right(or further) growing white trash and declining white middle class American hillbillies.

There's plenty of that to go around with the Louis Farrakhan's, Jesse Jackson's, and Al Sharpton's of the world.

While they may not own the world, they certainly pander to fears(both real and imagined) and profit from divisiveness.

I'm guessing you were saving that for your next post perhaps?

Perhaps including an international view of progressive non-racist Europe? Where the guilt of 70 year old mortal sins and/or guilt of relative wealth is clearly and inarguably towards cultural terraforming and suicide.

Perhaps include African kumbaya cohabitation like Tutsi vs Hutu? Or Shona vs Matabele people?

Maybe Indian vs Pakistani nuclear fuelled hatred?

I've got photos of Hazara vs Pashtun genocide sites, those are interesting.

Sunni vs Shia is front page for the next decade, how about that?

Or is your venom exclusively first world problem self-inflicting?

-----

Trump is a real life cartoon caricature.

A potentially dangerous one. Like a cartoon of Reagan drawn by Edvard Munch.

But I think you do your fellow countrymen and women a serious disservice.

Like many Lefties, you assume you're the better of those on the other end of the spectrum.

As if they can't think for themselves or understand the many, many shortcomings of Trump.

Of all the horrible shortcomings of Trump, he's probably the least owned by special interests.

Wisdom of Crowds also applies to underinformed centre right voters.

At least against the Clinton/Bush/Daly/Cuomo Political Dynasty.

-----

The world is a very dangerous place and growing more dangerous by the day.

Both cliches, but both true.

Especially with the US in a smaller, slower geopolitical retrenchment akin to the USSR collapse.

Voids are being created. And voids will be chaotically and malignantly filled.

Your pacifism had its heyday for about 5 minutes in the 90's.

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What you call exclusively white guilt, code word racism from a safe space, I prefer to use historical pattern recongition.

Possibly something akin to all the many Gorbachev-hating, Soviet strength loving Russians who strangely support Putin with such overwhelming numbers, despite declining economic indicators.

Anything for strength.

Pakistanis "eating grass" to match India's geopolitical nuclear penis measuring competition.

It's about strength, or more specifically, the public perception of strength.

If you want to pull racism into it, then certainly you can find equal fault with micro level Jewish intermarriage and business network preference?

Wealthy white folks are a macro network.

Personally, I would expand my definition to include like minded and educated folks(including legal immigrants especially) who think the Constitution is not an obsolete document written by white privilege, but the compass bearing of awesomeness.

Just a bigger tribe, with bigger weapons, and some genuine diversity.....but shitloads more Jewish guilt.

That's humanity. And only the most wealthy and successful of tribes can afford to feel guilty, but never for long.

-----

Pacifism and excessive guilt are probably not a good combo.

Let go of some of that guilt Woody.

"Let it go, let it gooooooooooooooo!"

[Thailandnotes]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

http://radioopensource.org/empire-to-empire/

ain't no guilt in this dicussion

[Woodsman]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Gee Woody...tell us what you really think...

Don't I always?

You know, it occurred to me how curious that on the weekend of our Martin Luther King holiday, you'd toss out the government tested and approved bogieman Farrakhan, Jackson, and Sharpton.

I never really understood how if King and Shabazz got the COINTEL treatment how those Three Stooges were able to thrive and profit, what with them being such an existential threat and all. I batted around a couple of ideas, but this chump is stumped.

Because you're right. The Three Stooges, all they talk about is divisiveness and exclusivity, whereas Martin and Malcom (post-Haj) kept going on about unity and common cause. Only the unity guys got the gun and the division guys got the keys to their kingdoms. Funny how that worked out? One of those many accidents of history, no doubt.

But as I read further something unexpected came over me, as if suddenly bathed in light. It's my white guilt! Could it be that simple?

Oh, I just want to take my shoes off and run through a pile of C notes. I want to order a magnum of White Gold, break the bottle, and stiff the waiter. Maybe evict one my tenants, just for the sheer joy of it.

Thank you Lake. If not for your conditioning and indoctrination, where I would I be? Quick now before I lose this warm feeling. Tell me how I can become a fear-gripped, warmongering martinet and get in touch with my inner fascist, too.

Do I have to become an intelligence officer or would something like a police auxiliary do?

Anything for strength.

[lakedaemonian]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Don't I always?

You know, it occurred to me how curious that on the weekend of our Martin Luther King holiday, you'd toss out the government tested and approved bogieman Farrakhan, Jackson, and Sharpton.

I never really understood how if King and Shabazz got the COINTEL treatment how those Three Stooges were able to thrive and profit, what with them being such an existential threat and all. I batted around a couple of ideas, but this chump is stumped.

Because you're right. The Three Stooges, all they talk about is divisiveness and exclusivity, whereas Martin and Malcom (post-Haj) kept going on about unity and common cause. Only the unity guys got the gun and the division guys got the keys to their kingdoms. Funny how that worked out? One of those many accidents of history, no doubt.

But as I read further something unexpected came over me, as if suddenly bathed in light. It's my white guilt! Could it be that simple?

Oh, I just want to take my shoes off and run through a pile of C notes. I want to order a magnum of White Gold, break the bottle, and stiff the waiter. Maybe evict one my tenants, just for the sheer joy of it.

Thank you Lake. If not for your conditioning and indoctrination, where I would I be? Quick now before I lose this warm feeling. Tell me how I can become a fear-gripped, warmongering martinet and get in touch with my inner fascist, too.

Do I have to become an intelligence officer or would something like a police auxiliary do?

Anything for strength.

Correct.

That's what the Everyman/woman from the centre to the right around the world seems to consistently demand once past imperial apogee.

No need to order the magnum of white gold, it just automatically shows up on the white privilege bus:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=l_LeJfn_qW0

Continue embracing your self hatred "guilt privilege" as long as you can continue to afford to. Most of the world can't afford the time or money to feel guilty. So it is genuinely a privilege.

I wonder what Freud would say about the castration/emasculation anxiety of middle class/aged white males with high relative global wealth or the self hatred complex of the mirror image middle class/aged white males with high relative global wealth if he were alive today?

Two sides to the same coin?

And then there's the rabbit hole of whether it's hatred of self or hatred of the reflection in the mirror, or both? WAY over my head and WAY beyond what I've ever learned in university.

The only difference I see to that mirror image is the fact that the societal/macro castration/emasculation anxiety can exist and persist in poverty(Pakistan "eating grass" for nuclear penis parity with India) as well as in wealth.

Whereas guilt seems to starve when one is starving, and all too often replaced by genocide.

Psychoanalysis may hold true from individual/tactical up thru societal/strategic-geopolitical.

Except the poverty/genocide wealth/guilt deviation.

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We are all voluntary and/or involuntary members of overlapping networks/tribes of varying strength with both earned and unearned benefits and liabilities.

Personally, I think we are far too removed from genuine and immediate hardship & fear to see the endless procession of minority networks that held power and naively assumed a rainbow filled transition and future.

[Master Shake]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Here're some more white supremacist Trump supporters.

[astonas]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Jim Rickards Sez

"Hillary is toast, she will be getting nicked for her crimes"
"Joe Biden will be asked to step in".............& he win

Don't forget that Clinton has a lock on almost all of the "superdelegates" so celebrating her demise may be premature. She doesn't have to win even half the delegates at stake to be nominated, and Sanders would have to win by more than half (327 extra delegates!) to get on the ticket. It's an incredibly stupid system, but it is the one that both the Democratic and Republican Parties have employed, in the interest of maintaining establishment control of their parties. (They use slightly different rules this time around, but given the Republican numbers, and the possibility for a brokered RNC convention, they could still play a similar role.)

In this case, both Trump and Sanders (and perhaps also Cruz?) should expect to be hit hard by such systemic disadvantages, if any opening for that is left at all.

However, if by some twist Hillary DOES wind up "toast," then Sanders is the only real contender for Democrats left. I don't know when Rickards made his call, but at this point the filing deadline has passed for many state primaries. This was written in mid-Dec.:

The problem for Romney is the deadline has already passed in about 21 states to get on the ballot. He would only be able to run in those states as a write-in candidate. New York Magazine analyzed the chances of Joe Biden similarly entering the Democratic primary late, and noted that a candidate entering the race in mid-January will have “forfeited 2,232 delegates, or about the number needed to become the nominee.” If Romney entered the race at the beginning of January, he would be slightly better off, but would still miss running in almost half the states.

(I really don't think even O'Malley is imagining himself bumping Clinton, at this point. He can't even get 10 seconds. And his polls are just as bad. I suspect he's going for VP now. Not too bad a choice, considering the ages involved, but I suspect Sanders would rather have Warren, and Clinton would rather pick a governor of a swing state, to optimize general election probabilities.)

I can't even begin to speculate on possible Republican VP choices, I'd say there's just way too much still up in the air on that side to make even an educated guess.

[astonas]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

"Outsider" now simply means "does not sound like a professional politician."

I'm pretty close to your position on this one, dcarrigg, but with a slightly different twist:

I'd say in this case, they use "outsider" to mean that their party establishment (DNC/RNC) wishes someone else would win. Trump is obvious. But Cruz is apparently also hated by just about all of his colleagues, Republicans as much as Democrats. Sanders is hated for threatening Clinton's coronation. ("It's her turn!") And thereby also making it harder for her to win the general, thus messing with the DNC's chance to follow the first black president with the first woman president.

It's still not a great definition of "outsider" as far as the average person's welfare is concerned, but I think it reflects the way the party establishments think of elections as their game to play, rather than something that is supposed to reflect the preferences of voters.

And I do think that's at least part of why the "outsiders" Sanders, Trump, and Cruz are all doing better than expected. People don't like the sense of disenfranchizement that comes with party favorites being handed elections, whether it be through super-delegates, superPACs, or dynastic succession. It really pushes up those stubborn "unfavorable" ratings, and is a far bigger burden in this election than ever before.

That's why I think Cruz's ties to Goldman are coming out now. His opponents know that it is his claim to be outside the system that gives him support, with all but the most fervent evangelicals (those he picked up when Carson self-imploded). If the bank ties are enough to make him drop even a little, he's probably finished. If he can rationalize them well enough, he might even bump Trump. The real question though is which candidate gets to pick up the remaining voters when one of those two bubbles pops. That's the one (likely Bush or Rubio, but conceivably also Christie or even Kasich) that will suddenly get a flood of establishment money, now waiting on the sidelines while it works out who to support to take back the party from the populists.

Only then can the Republican's one-on-one "establishment vs. outsider" competition get started in earnest. And we know which way the money will flow on that one.

[Woodsman]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Lawd have mercy! Not exactly neutral commentators or representative of any meaningful cohort of likely black voters, but whatevs.

Trump spotted "Diamond and Silk," the boisterous YouTube stars from North Carolina who had become occasional campaign surrogates on TV and at rallies. They'd introduced him by asking the Mississippi audience to vote in the March 8 primary, slightly misstating the need to switch party registration (there is no party registration in the state), but delighting the crowd of 15,000. Midway through his speech, after discussing how he felt surrounded by "love," Trump brought them back.

"This time, we're going to have real change!" said Lynette "Diamond" Hardaway — the kind of jibe that a black woman could tell a largely white crowd with a bit more aplomb than Trump.

"Aren't they great?" Trump asked the crowd.

Trump rallies thousands in Mississippi with anger at media, Iran deal

And how many other black or minority faces not on the payroll do you image came out in Raleigh or Biloxi? Does it at all concern you that Trump is so tone deaf here that he thinks hiring a modern day minstrel troupe as blackwash will "do the trick?"

And doesn't it feel the least bit "icky" to associate yourself with this, Shakes, or don't you like music either?

[vt]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Polls do show Trump getting some black support but the amount varies by poll source:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-black-voters/

Trump met with 100 black ministers but did not receive their endorsement.

[lakedaemonian]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Polls do show Trump getting some black support but the amount varies by poll source:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-black-voters/

Trump met with 100 black ministers but did not receive their endorsement.

I think Trump will do OK with the black and centre-right legal Hispanic vote against Hillary.

Where I think Trump may have irreparably doomed himself is the big female vote slice in the middle.

The huge ramp up from the left of new feminism and gender inequity spilling well and truly into mindshare in the middle makes a candidate who so openly patronises women at times with a long history of model trophy wives is political poison.

Trump(patronising trophy wife collector) getting the female vote against Hillary will be harder than Romney(the physical epitome of "The Man") getting the urban poor black vote in Chicago.

And the female vote in the middle is much bigger than the relatively small urban black vote.

[Woodsman]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

The late far-right nationalist writer Sam Francis wrote the script for Donald Trump’s campaign 20 years ago, for Pat Buchanan, but Buchanan was too much a Republican Party man to follow it:

To simplify Francis' theory: There are a number of Americans who are losers from a process of economic globalization that enriches a transnational global elite. These Middle Americans see jobs disappearing to Asia and increased competition from immigrants. Most of them feel threatened by cultural liberalism, at least the type that sees Middle Americans as loathsome white bigots. But they are also threatened by conservatives who would take away their Medicare, hand their Social Security earnings to fund-managers in Connecticut, and cut off their unemployment too.

How an obscure adviser to Pat Buchanan predicted the wild Trump campaign in 1996

[Master Shake]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

I think Trump will do OK with the black and centre-right legal Hispanic vote against Hillary.

Where I think Trump may have irreparably doomed himself is the big female vote slice in the middle.

The huge ramp up from the left of new feminism and gender inequity spilling well and truly into mindshare in the middle makes a candidate who so openly patronises women at times with a long history of model trophy wives is political poison.

Trump(patronising trophy wife collector) getting the female vote against Hillary will be harder than Romney(the physical epitome of "The Man") getting the urban poor black vote in Chicago.

And the female vote in the middle is much bigger than the relatively small urban black vote.

Hillary is not going to be able to hide from being labeled an enabler for a rapist this go round.

Plus, I dont recall any of Trump's exes dissing him, and he has two successful and well-spoken daughters who are being kept in the wings.

Scott Adams is predicting a Trump landslide if he runs against Hillary.

[Ellen Z]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Trump is simply not careful--and whether it's by design or by accident you can be the judge--in making the distinction you are trying to make. He often drops sentences where "Mexicans" are the noun the verb is something negative....

I'm not trying to trash Trump. I'm [not] trying to paint him with any label. I'm just trying to explain why there's no way in hell Hispanics don't come out against him, and why there has been an anti-Trump wave pulsing through the Catholic Church in America that I don't think Trump necessarily has even realized yet...

And now, as you predicted back in January, Hispanics are waiting on long lines to vote against Trump.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/08/upshot/this-time-there-really-is-a-hispanic-voter-surge.html

But the surge is real, and it’s big. It could be enough to overcome Mr. Trump’s strength among white-working class voters in the swing states of Florida and Nevada. If it does, it will almost certainly win her the election.

In Florida, voters who indicated they were Hispanic on their voter registration form represent more than 15 percent of the early vote. In 2012, Hispanic voters were just 12 percent of the final electorate....

The numbers are striking in part because of the sheer magnitude of the early vote so far.

[lektrode]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

i waited in a yuuuuge line last night, over an hour:45mins, longest i have EVER seen
anywhere i've ever voted (which has been quite a few states actually)

and judging by the overall results?

would say that NOTHING we've heard out of the LAMERSTREAM MEDIA and their BS 'polls'
was even remotely true.

just like most of what they've told us the past 8 years.

&BTW - some of the funniest results were in nevada,
where only clark county/los wages voted for the hillamonster,
suggesting that only where criminals and .gov corruption is prevalent
like say, chicago, manhattan, DC, were they 'with her'.

and even most of NY state/counties voted against her!

and if that isn't REPUDIATION i simply can not imagine what would be...

[JDC]

Re: Buchanan on Trump

Another fun fact is the Las Vegas Review-Journal was the first major newspaper to endorse Donald Trump in the General Election