Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

[vt]

Free comes with strings attached:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...f65_story.html

[dcarrigg]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

VT, you wrote that title as if saddling a generation with $100,000 in non-dischargable bank debt for a public education is about something other than control...

[shiny!]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

VT, you wrote that title as if saddling a generation with $100,000 in non-dischargable bank debt for a public education is about something other than control...

Yep. Big E is getting nervous. If wages stay so low and taxes stay so high then I'm in favor of universal college tuition, since regular people can't afford it anymore. Seems like investing in our young people is one of the best ways to spend tax dollars. Way better than building another bomber or battleship. As long as the Dept of Ed doesn't try to micromanage curriculum like it has for K-12...

Bernie Sanders is making a lot of people nervous as reflected by the MSM. The other day i saw a headline proclaiming that Sanders wants illegals on Obamacare. When I read the article he was talking about letting them BUY insurance in the Obamacare marketplace. He made it clear that he didn't think illegals should receive health insurance subsidies. Now, I don't know why/how illegals are allowed to sign up for anything and not be deported, but since they're here I'd rather they be insured than not insured.

The headline's purpose was clearly intended to make people who are opposed to illegal aliens think that Sanders wants to coddle them at taxpayer expense.

[dcarrigg]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

Way better than building another bomber or battleship. As long as the Dept of Ed doesn't try to micromanage curriculum like it has for K-12...

Amen.

And that goes double for state Depts. of Ed. The whole lot of them think they can solve the world's problems by adding 20 more bubble tests per year and handing the keys to our property taxes over to to a bunch of consultants and bankers. Or as they call it, "A data-driven, school choice solution that disrupts traditional public education in our failing schools and replaces it with a synergistic and dynamic management approach."

PS everyone: When they say "compete in the 21st century," and you ask yourself "Compete against whom?" you'll find pretty quickly that the answer is "5 billion people in in the third world." And when you ask yourself, "Compete for what?" you'll find pretty quickly that the answer is, "For the right to be low-wage servants to multi-national billionaires." And once you've worked that out, you might find yourself asking, "Why?" And that's the type of question those bubble tests are not designed to encourage...

[vt]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

DC, I fully agree that $100K debt is control.

But the article from the liberal Washington Post prominently uses the word:

"If he becomes president, Sanders would spend an enormous amount of money: $3.27 trillion. At the very, very least. domestic agenda — making college, health care and child care more affordable — seek to capture these industries and convert them to run chiefly on federal money."

The article goes on to question Sander's contention that his policies will reduce expenses, and raises the real possibility they could make these sectors even more expensive and inefficient.

Shiny, this is not an anti immigration post. In fact this country needs more immigration as the population ages, many don't marry, and families have fewer children.

There are two problems :
Illegal immigration has overwhelmed the system and made it more difficult for the gradual melding of foreign populations into becoming Americans, while retaining and being proud of their heritage. Unexpected consequences are diseases by unfamiliar viruses; this doesn't appear as nearly bad as alarmists imagined, but there are public health protocols that were ignored.

More important is the we have actually discriminated against an overwhelming percentage of nationalities by favoring the illegal portion from south of the border.
What about those that have stood in line for up to a decade? What about the rule of law? Why are we favoring a group that makes up just 6% of the global population. Of course it's for political advantage.
Of course we do need a path to citizenship for those here, but not at the expense of those who have followed the rules. Illegals can become citizens over a 15 year period, but those from south of the border can also have a slightly higher quota as they are neighbors.
We do need to speed up legal immigration by taking a higher number, but also making the process more efficient.

[Woodsman]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

...When they say "compete in the 21st century," and you ask yourself "Compete against whom?" you'll find pretty quickly that the answer is "5 billion people in in the third world." And when you ask yourself, "Compete for what?" you'll find pretty quickly that the answer is, "For the right to be low-wage servants to multi-national billionaires." And once you've worked that out, you might find yourself asking, "Why?" And that's the type of question those bubble tests are not designed to encourage...

The Carlin Thesis remains firm.

[don]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

Real Education in America . . . .

For four weeks this spring, a young woman from India on a temporary visa sat elbow to elbow with an American accountant in a snug cubicle at the headquarters of Toys “R” Us here. The woman, an employee of a giant outsourcing company in India hired by Toys “R” Us, studied and recorded the accountant’s every keystroke, taking screen shots of her computer and detailed notes on how she issued payments for toys sold in the company’s megastores.

“She just pulled up a chair in front of my computer,” said the accountant, 49, who had worked for the company for more than 15 years. “She shadowed me everywhere, even to the ladies’ room.”

By late June, eight workers from the outsourcing company, Tata Consultancy Services, or TCS, had produced intricate manuals for the jobs of 67 people, mainly in accounting. They then returned to India to train TCS workers to take over and perform those jobs there. The Toys “R” Us employees in New Jersey, many of whom had been at the company more than a decade, were laid off.

the Toys “R” Us layoffs — and others underway now at the New York Life Insurance Company and other businesses — are examples of how global outsourcing companies are using temporary visas to bring in foreign workers who do not have exceptional skills — according to interviews with a dozen current or former employees of Toys “R” Us and New York Life — to help ship out jobs, mainly to India.

These former employees described their experience training foreigners to do their work so it could be moved to India. They would speak only on the condition that their names not be published, saying they feared losing severance payments or hurting their chances of finding new jobs.

In most cases when American workers lost jobs, the positions have been in technology, with employers arguing there are shortages of Americans with the most advanced skills. But in recent years, many jobs that American workers lost have been in accounting and back-office administration — although there is no shortage of Americans qualified to do that kind of work.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/30/us/toys-r-us-brings-temporary-foreign-workers-to-us-to-move-jobs-overseas.html?action=click&contentCollection=U.S.&module=RelatedCoverage&region=Marginalia&pgtype=article

[lektrode]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

The Carlin Thesis remains firm.

yep...

The Media-Opoly: Cancelled, From Saturday Night, It's Conspiracy Theory Rock

A day after we ran "Meet Your "Independent" Media, America", in which we showed how prime time entertainment like 60 Minutes is strategically and voluntarily "planted" with propaganda trolls and "concerns" thus crushing any "unbiased" credibility mainstream US media may have, we dug into the archives to bring you "Conspiracy Theory Rock."
This cartoon created by SNL cartoonist Robert Smigel in 1998 ran once in a "TV Funhouse" segment, and has been since removed from all subsequent airings of the Saturday Night Live episodes. As a reminder, 90% of US media is currently controlled by 6 corporations: General Electric, News Corp., Disney, Viacom, Time Warner and CBS...


... whose shareholders vastly overlap.

Michaels claimed the edit was done because it "wasn’t funny."

Well, it's funny now because for once the propaganda facade of the mainstream media cracked from within, and the result was this critique of corporate media ownership, including then NBC’s ownership by General Electric/Westinghouse, and how only the stuff the owners deem appropriate is distributed for general consumption.

We doubt the current parent of NBC (and CNBC), Comcast, would play it either.

[dcarrigg]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

DC, I fully agree that $100K debt is control.

But the article from the liberal Washington Post prominently uses the word:

"If he becomes president, Sanders would spend an enormous amount of money: $3.27 trillion. At the very, very least. domestic agenda — making college, health care and child care more affordable — seek to capture these industries and convert them to run chiefly on federal money."

The article goes on to question Sander's contention that his policies will reduce expenses, and raises the real possibility they could make these sectors even more expensive and inefficient.

Shiny, this is not an anti immigration post. In fact this country needs more immigration as the population ages, many don't marry, and families have fewer children.

There are two problems :
Illegal immigration has overwhelmed the system and made it more difficult for the gradual melding of foreign populations into becoming Americans, while retaining and being proud of their heritage. Unexpected consequences are diseases by unfamiliar viruses; this doesn't appear as nearly bad as alarmists imagined, but there are public health protocols that were ignored.

More important is the we have actually discriminated against an overwhelming percentage of nationalities by favoring the illegal portion from south of the border.
What about those that have stood in line for up to a decade? What about the rule of law? Why are we favoring a group that makes up just 6% of the global population. Of course it's for political advantage.
Of course we do need a path to citizenship for those here, but not at the expense of those who have followed the rules. Illegals can become citizens over a 15 year period, but those from south of the border can also have a slightly higher quota as they are neighbors.
We do need to speed up legal immigration by taking a higher number, but also making the process more efficient.

VT, illegal immigrants didn't put central air, leather couches, and tempurpedic lounge chairs in every lobby. Nor did it build 16 new ten million dollar alumni centers for schmoozing. Nor did it make this map come true:




30 years ago, football and basketball coaches and college presidents and deans and chancellors and med school plastic surgeons didn't out-earn governors...

[vt]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

But DC successful actors and TV news anchors also make more than college presidents, med school professors, and governors.

"But Bissinger’s biggest concern seems to be the students who suffer as a result of expensive, coffer-draining football teams. Yes, the same students who are awake at the break of dawn to paint their faces and scream themselves hoarse each Saturday. Those same students who identify themselves daily as Buckeyes, Bruins or Bulldogs. The very same students who may have chosen their schools based on college football allegiances, and who enjoy their fandom as a lifestyle rather than an occasional source of weekend entertainment. Fortunately, college football has also been a valuable source of revenue for their academic experiences.

Successful football programs inject millions into their universities’ academic programs. Athletic departments not only cover the costs of student-athlete scholarships, but they often contribute to non-athletic scholarship funds. Alabama’s athletic department, for instance, contributed $3.5 million to the school’s non-athletic scholarship fund last year as part of a $6.5 million contribution package for university programming. Even far less profitable programs like Iowa and Oregon State have been central to academic initiatives. Iowa Athletics contributed $9 million to a new Campus Recreation and Wellness Center, and Oregon State’s athletic department spent $7 million to open the school’s Academic Success Center. Both are available to all university students.

What’s more, college football games are an invaluable source of revenue for local businesses. Some teams generate more than $5 million per home game for local hotels and restaurants. It’s fair to argue that local businesses are not the responsibility of university athletic departments, but those businesses, which also serve and often employ university students, stand to suffer significant losses if college football were to be banned.

Bissinger also takes umbrage with the many alumni “who absurdly judge the quality of their alma mater based on the quality of the football team,” but that doesn’t change the fact that those same alumni donate hundreds of millions of dollars each year to academic programs. Some even put their lives on the line. Athletic departments also rely on the annual contributions that are tied to luxury seating and season ticket options for home football games. Removing college football would completely eliminate that wealthy revenue stream."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmi...elp-academics/

But the problem is much bigger than discussions of college football and basketball, as you will see in the next post.

[vt]

Re: Sander's Tuition Free College Is Also About Control

DC, A major reason for that $100,000 loan bill is that college costs are way ahead of inflation:

"Since 1982 a typical family income increased by 147%, more than inflation but significantly behind the huge increase in college costs. College costs have been rising roughly at a rate of 7% per year for decades. Since 1985, the overall consumer price index has risen 115% while the college education inflation rate has risen nearly 500%. According to Gordon Wadsworth, author of The College Trap, “…if the cost of college tuition was $10,000 in 1986, it would now cost the same student over $21,500 if education had increased as much as the average inflation rate but instead education is $59,800 or over 2 ˝ times the inflation rate.” Blunting these increases is a rise in federal student aid including tax credits and deductions. And nearly two thirds of undergraduates now receive some sort of grant aid and student loan borrowing is on the upswing. But loans must be paid back so the pain of payment is only delayed."

When you compound higher cost each year for 30 years you find it's soon out of control:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/steveodl...s-are-soaring/

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/...-tuition-grown


But it's not just college. We are not doing as well as other nations in student performance:


http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-w...eading-science

And K-12 spending has also grown far faster than inflation:

http://www.better-ed.org/blog/tunnel...chool-spending


http://coles.kennesaw.edu/coles-over...is%20Worse.pdf


It seems the more we spend the less return get. And liberals are always calling for more spending?