German aircrash, what do we now know............

[Mega]

Well Alex Jones & co can SHUT up ref the Pent-a-gon attack, there was VERY little left of this plane after it hit the ground. Unless Alex is going to claim:- False flag/Alien/new World order..........etc.

Mike

[shiny!]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

Well Alex Jones & co can SHUT up ref the Pent-a-gon attack, there was VERY little left of this plane after it hit the ground. Unless Alex is going to claim:- False flag/Alien/new World order..........etc.

Mike

He probably will. Never let a good crisis go to waste...
But I don't believe anyone anymore. I don't believe the people who say it was a random act of depression (evidence to support this position can be planted). I don't believe the people who say it was a conspiracy, an assassination of someone important on the plane (they have their agenda$, too). All I know is it happened.

[vt]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

Technology exists to control plane from ground:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...se-use-it.html

[GRG55]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

Technology exists to control plane from ground:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...se-use-it.html

Sure the "technology" exists. Hell, the US military vaporizes people in the Middle East with frightening efficiency using aircraft with pilots sitting at a console thousands of miles back home. But there's a big difference between flying a drone with missiles and the responsibility of remotely controlling, from the ground, aircraft with hundreds of people on board.

If you would like a good example of where the intersection of airborne technology and ground based human decision-making resulted in horrifically fatal results, look up and read the accident report about the 2002 collision between DHL Flight 611 and Bashkirian Airlines Flight 2937. Both aircraft were equipped with functioning ACAS (airborne collision avoidance system, more commonly called TCAS in the USA) and were under Zurich (Switzerland) air traffic control. This was the first ever mid-air collision between two ACAS equipped airplanes.

You will not ever catch me knowingly getting on board an airplane that can be physically controlled from the ground. I don't have confidence in every pilot of every airplane I have ever flown on, but I have more confidence in all of them than any ground based "pilot" or software programmer purporting to be able to safely guide aircraft 100% of the time.

Just as an aside, DHL Flight 611 originated at the firm's large base in the Kingdom of Bahrain. The co-pilot, Brant Campioni, was a Canadian who grew up near where I did, and learned to fly at one of the same airports I did. When we first moved to the Persian Gulf my wife helped organize a Canadian expatriate social group. Brant and his wife Deneen, who were resident in Bahrain, attended the fledgling group's first pub night. After being introduced, Brant and I spent a good part of the evening reminiscing about home and doing some "hangar flying". He died in the accident just a few weeks later.

[Mega]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

GRG55
Very sorry to hear about your friend, as i hear it the DHL crew flew an un-fly-able plane a good distance. I seem to recall the traffic control-er Bloke told them to dive, the TCAS said climb.........TCAS was right sadly the crew did what they were told by traffic?

I think one of the Russian kids Dad came to "discuss" the matter with him later...........
Mike

[GRG55]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

GRG55
Very sorry to hear about your friend, as i hear it the DHL crew flew an un-fly-able plane a good distance. I seem to recall the traffic control-er Bloke told them to dive, the TCAS said climb.........TCAS was right sadly the crew did what they were told by traffic?

I think one of the Russian kids Dad came to "discuss" the matter with him later...........
Mike

As with most accidents a series of events conspire and converge to create the end result. The air traffic controller was only one factor in this instance.

Automation in aviation is wonderful. But when it is working it requires that we humans suspend any disbelief in it and trust it absolutely. And when it fails, as it inevitably will from time to time (e.g. AF 447), it requires skilled, competent human intervention. The Garmin GPS navigator in my airplane is coupled to the autopilot. If it is flying the approach I have to trust it, especially difficult to accept when the airplane is descending in the clouds and the airport is not yet visible. The alternative is to disable it and hand fly the approach.

The quality of media coverage of aircraft accidents is generally deplorable (sensationalism wins out over factual content every time); the coverage of this Germanwings incident is setting all time new low standards imo.

[don]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

Thanks for the clear thinking.

[GRG55]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

Thanks for the clear thinking.

There's a perverse, black irony that seems to be escaping the media coverage of this tragedy don.

After the horrific events of 9/11 there was much media sponsored, public pressure for "the government to do something" to protect pilots from their passengers. So the FAA and its counterparts all over the world mandated highly secure cockpit doors. This latest accident is a consequence of that decision.

Now the media are baying equally loudly that "the government needs to do something" to protect the passengers from their pilots...

[Master Shake]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

There's a perverse, black irony that seems to be escaping the media coverage of this tragedy don.

After the horrific events of 9/11 there was much media sponsored, public pressure for "the government to do something" to protect pilots from their passengers. So the FAA and its counterparts all over the world mandated highly secure cockpit doors. This latest accident is a consequence of that decision.

Now the media are baying equally loudly that "the government needs to do something" to protect the passengers from their pilots...

US protocol of never leaving the pilot alone would seem to be an easy fix.

[don]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

There's a perverse, black irony that seems to be escaping the media coverage of this tragedy don.

After the horrific events of 9/11 there was much media sponsored, public pressure for "the government to do something" to protect pilots from their passengers. So the FAA and its counterparts all over the world mandated highly secure cockpit doors. This latest accident is a consequence of that decision.

Now the media are baying equally loudly that "the government needs to do something" to protect the passengers from their pilots...

Ergo, passengers and pilots should fly on separate airplanes . . .

(just in jest)

[GRG55]

Re: German aircrash, what do we now know............

US protocol of never leaving the pilot alone would seem to be an easy fix.

Yep, that flight attendant locked up front with an armed FFDO pilot having a bad day should make everyone back in steerage feel much safer.

This is a problem that does not have a simple (or simplistic) solution. In fact it may not have any absolutely preventative solution at all. Just as there is no easy solution to deal with postal workers spraying bullets around the sorting room, or preventing another Sandy Hook/Virginia Tech/Columbine/Red Lake.


I see our spineless politicians up here have bowed to media pressure and kneejerk imposed the same "feel good fix":

Canadian airlines told to have 2 people in the cockpit

Order comes after Germanwings incident in which co-pilot apparently locked out pilot and crashed plane

CBC News Posted: Mar 26, 2015 12:43 PM ET Last Updated: Mar 27, 2015 1:06 AM ET

Canadian airlines have been ordered to maintain two crew in the cockpit at all times, effective immediately, federal Transport Minister Lisa Raitt announced today.

"Currently, there is not the requirement to have two members in the [cockpit]," Raitt told reporters. "After this order, there will be a requirement to have two members."

"It could be a flight attendant. It could be a customer service person," she said...

[Polish_Silver]

Two Solutions?

Solution A: The pilot does not leave the cockpit until one flight attendant is there, to make sure the copilot does not go bonkers.

Solution B: have a communication post (cell phone? ) outside the cockpit, so that emergency communication can be established with Ground control. In emergencies, ground control can over ride the cockpit. It is not the question whether ground controlled airplanes are better than normal pilots. It is the question whether ground control offers better safety than pilots who are acting crazy.

The Enterprise had auxiliary control, right?

[Mega]

Re: Two Solutions?

No CHANCE !
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ot-toilet.html



The "Mega" solution:-

Capt runs down the plane, finds the hottest female gets her to strip in front of the Door (watch by the co-pilot via CCTV).
Get him to "Think" about things........get his Mum to talk to him.......or the Capt should have tried the "Bomb-20" chat?

[Polish_Silver]

Mega and CTU

No CHANCE !
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ot-toilet.html



The "Mega" solution:-

Capt runs down the plane, finds the hottest female gets her to strip in front of the Door (watch by the co-pilot via CCTV).
Get him to "Think" about things........get his Mum to talk to him.......or the Capt should have tried the "Bomb-20" chat?

I think the strip technique should be used to get information from terrorist prisoners. Think of the possibilities: offering cosher beef vs nothing vs pork, all served by the Twin Peaks waitress.


You could even incentivize the girl: the more info she gets, the more $$ in her bank account.

[Mega]

Re: Mega and CTU

Hmmmmm thinking about it i think they needed Sammel L Jackson on the job........

Or May Be Winston................