Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

    well, well, well.... didnt think it was even possible...

    but FOR ONCE (and maybe even the first and last time) i actually agree with (most) of what
    the (liberal) oracle of lower manhattan has to say:

    (5) Years of Tragic Waste


    By PAUL KRUGMAN

    Published: September 5, 2013

    In a few days, we’ll reach the fifth anniversary of the fall of Lehman Brothers — the moment when a recession, which was bad enough, turned into something much scarier. Suddenly, we were looking at the real possibility of economic catastrophe.


    And the catastrophe came.


    Wait, you say, what catastrophe? Weren’t people warning about a second Great Depression? And that didn’t happen, did it? Yes, they were, and no, it didn’t — although the Greeks, the Spaniards, and others might not agree about that second point. The important thing, however, is to realize that there are degrees of disaster, that you can have an immense failure of economic policy that falls short of producing total collapse. And the failure of policy these past five years has, in fact, been immense.


    Some of that immensity can be measured in dollars and cents. Reasonable measures of the “output gap” over the past five years — the difference between the value of goods and services America could and should have produced and what it actually produced — run well over $2 trillion. That’s trillions of dollars of pure waste, which we will never get back.


    Behind that financial waste lies an even more tragic waste of human potential. Before the financial crisis, 63 percent of adult Americans were employed; that number quickly plunged to less than 59 percent, and there it remains.


    How did that happen? It wasn’t a mass outbreak of laziness, and right-wing claims that jobless Americans aren’t trying hard enough to find work because they’re living high on food stamps and unemployment benefits should be treated with the contempt they deserve. A bit of the decline in employment can be attributed to an aging population, but the rest reflects, as I said, an immense failure of economic policy.


    Set aside the politics for a moment, and ask what the past five years would have looked like if the U.S. government had actually been able and willing to do what textbook macroeconomics says it should have done — namely, make a big enough push for job creation to offset the effects of the financial crunch and the housing bust, postponing fiscal austerity and tax increases until the private sector was ready to take up the slack. I’ve done a back-of-the-envelope calculation of what such a program would have entailed: It would have been about three times as big as the stimulus we actually got, and would have been much more focused on spending rather than tax cuts.


    Would such a policy have worked? All the evidence of the past five years says yes. The Obama stimulus, inadequate as it was, stopped the economy’s plunge in 2009. Europe’s experiment in anti-stimulus — the harsh spending cuts imposed on debtor nations — didn’t produce the promised surge in private-sector confidence. Instead, it produced severe economic contraction, just as textbook economics predicted. Government spending on job creation would, indeed, have created jobs.


    But wouldn’t the kind of spending program I’m suggesting have meant more debt? Yes — according to my rough calculation, at this point federal debt held by the public would have been about $1 trillion more than it actually is. But alarmist warnings about the dangers of modestly higher debt have proved false. Meanwhile, the economy would also have been stronger, so that the ratio of debt to G.D.P. — the usual measure of a country’s fiscal position — would have been only a few points higher. Does anyone seriously think that this difference would have provoked a fiscal crisis?


    And, on the other side of the ledger, we would be a richer nation, with a brighter future — not a nation where millions of discouraged Americans have probably dropped permanently out of the labor force, where millions of young Americans have probably seen their lifetime career prospects permanently damaged, where cuts in public investment have inflicted long-term damage on our infrastructure and our educational system.


    Look, I know that as a political matter an adequate job-creation program was never a real possibility. And it’s not just the politicians who fell short: Many economists, instead of pointing the way toward a solution of the jobs crisis, became part of the problem, fueling exaggerated fears of inflation and debt.


    Still, I think it’s important to realize how badly policy failed and continues to fail. Right now, Washington seems divided between Republicans who denounce any kind of government action — who insist that all the policies and programs that mitigated the crisis actually made it worse — and Obama loyalists who insist that they did a great job because the world didn’t totally melt down.


    Obviously, the Obama people are less wrong than the Republicans. But, by any objective standard, U.S. economic policy since Lehman has been an astonishing,horrifying failure.

    and - obviously - he just cant help himself...
    (not that the other side of the aisle has been any better...)

  • #2
    Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

    But, by any objective standard, U.S. economic policy since Lehman has been an astonishing, horrifying failure.




    can you f**king believe how good its been

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

      Originally posted by don View Post


      can you f**king believe how good its been
      Exactly. "Crazy like a fox" is my new catchphrase.

      Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

        can you f**king believe how good its been
        uh huh... bet they (them 2 esp) can hardly wait to celebrate the upcoming 5th Anniversary
        i'm pretty sure that The Big Party will have Quite The Guest List for the VIP seats

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

          Give poor Eric a break! In three years he needs a job, and where else do former administration officials have to go except Wall Street?

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

            Originally posted by don View Post


            can you f**king believe how good its been
            Not gonna lie, Dimon is looks like a boss in this shot


            Comment


            • #7
              Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

              Originally posted by vt View Post
              Give poor Eric a break! In three years he needs a job, and where else do former administration officials have to go except Wall Street?
              oh hey! - yer right, sorry to be so.... uncompassionately conservative...

              but, from what eye hear, theres soon to be a bunch of pretty good paying jobs in his local area....

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

                apparently its starting to sink in...

                when even the(ir) most ardent supporters in the media are wondering...

                Who Do You Trust?

                By MAUREEN DOWD

                Published: September 10, 2013

                WASHINGTON — Vladimir Putin, who keeps Edward Snowden on a leash and lets members of a riotous girl band rot in jail, has thrown President Obama a lifeline.

                The Russian president had coldly brushed back Obama on Snowden and Syria, and only last week called John Kerry a liar.

                Now, when it is clear Obama can’t convince Congress, the American public, his own wife, the world, Liz Cheney or even Donald “Shock and Awe” Rumsfeld to bomb Syria — just a teensy-weensy bit — Pooty-Poot (as W. called him) rides, shirtless, to the rescue, offering him a face-saving way out? If it were a movie, we’d know it was a trick. We can’t trust the soulless Putin — his Botox has given the former K.G.B. officer even more of a poker face — or the heartless Bashar al-Assad. By Tuesday, Putin the Peacemaker was already setting conditions.

                Just as Obama and Kerry — with assists from Hillary and some senators — were huffing and puffing that it was their military threat that led to the breakthrough, Putin moved to neuter them, saying they’d have to drop their military threat before any deal could proceed. The administration’s saber-rattling felt more like knees rattling. Oh, for the good old days when Obama was leading from behind. Now these guys are leading by slip-of-the-tongue.

                Amateur hour started when Obama dithered on Syria and failed to explain the stakes there. It escalated last August with a slip by the methodical wordsmith about “a red line for us”which the president and Kerry later tried to blur as the world’s red line, except the world was averting its eyes.

                (well...if ya cant baffle em with 'brilliance', ya can always try to buffalo em with BS, eh?...)

                Obama’s flip-flopping, ambivalent leadership led him to the exact place he never wanted to be: unilateral instead of unified. Once again, as with gun control and other issues, he had not done the groundwork necessary to line up support. The bumbling approach climaxed with two off-the-cuff remarks by Kerry, hitting a rough patch in the role of a lifetime, during a London press conference Monday; he offered to forgo an attack if Assad turned over “every single bit of his chemical weapons to the international community” and promised, if they did strike, that it would be an “unbelievably small” effort.

                A State Department spokeswoman walked back Kerry’s first slip, but once the White House realized it was the only emergency exit sign around, Kerry walked back the walking back, claiming at a Congressional hearing Tuesday that he did not “misspeak.”

                The president countered Kerry’s second slip with NBC’s Savannah Guthrie Monday night, declaring that “The U.S. does not do pinpricks,” which Kerry parroted at the hearing Tuesday, declaring that “We don’t do pinpricks.” For good measure, Obama, in his address to the nation Tuesday night, made sure the world knew: “The United States military doesn’t do pinpricks.”

                Where the mindlessly certain W. adopted a fig leaf of diplomacy to use force in Iraq, the mindfully uncertain Obama is adopting a fig leaf of force to use diplomacy in Syria.

                Even as Democrats tiptoed away from the red line, eager to kick the can of Sarin down the road, their own harsh rhetoric haunted them. Kerry compared Assad to Hitler last week, and Harry Reid evoked ”Nazi death camps” on the Senate floor Monday.

                Again, an echo of the misbegotten Iraq. Making his hyperbolic case for war, W. was huffy with Germans on a visit in 2002, irritated that they did not seem to grasp the horror of “a dictator who gassed his own people,” as he put it to a Berlin reporter.

                Obama cried over the children of Newtown. He is stricken, as he said in his address Tuesday, by “images of children writhing in pain and going still on a cold hospital floor” from “poison gas.” He thought — or thought he thought — that avenging the gassing was the right thing to do. But W., once more haunting his successor’s presidency, drained credibility, coffers and compassion.

                While most Americans shudder at the news that 400 children have been killed by a monster, they recoil at the Middle East now; they’ve had it with Shiites vs. Sunnis, with Alawites and all the ancient hatreds. Kerry can bluster that “we’re not waiting for long” for Assad to cough up the weapons, but it will be hard for him to back it up, given that a new NBC/Wall Street Journal poll indicates that Joe Sixpack is now a peacenik; in 2005, 60 percent of Republicans agreed with W. that America should foster democracy in the world; now only 19 percent of Republicans believe it.

                W., Dick Cheney and Rumsfeld launched a social engineering scheme to change the mind-set in the Middle East about democracy and the mind-set at home about the post-Vietnam reluctance to be muscular about imposing our values through war. They did manage to drastically change the mind-set in the Middle East and at home, but in the opposite way than they intended.

                In a crouch after 9/11, the country was happy to punish an Arab villain, even the wrong one. That mass delusion, plus the economic vertigo, has sent Americans into a permanent crouch. And that’s too bad.
                and whats really too bad - esp for someone like myself who's not had much reason - before now - to agree with this one and her brand of continuous-cliche op/eds - is that, after all the ink that was spilled tween 2002-3 and 2008 - other than the fact that those who couldnt come up with any 'justification' whatsoever to take out saddam - and now say its 'too bad' that we (us J6P's anyway) WONT even try to justify a 'moral' reasonto start yet another multi-billion dollar exercise in futility ?? - even when the liberal propaganda machine wants us to believe - by inference & name dropping - that this is all somehow 'inherited' -

                and just whom is all of a sudden the liar...

                thats whats REALLY just too damn bad.

                for her and their bunch of supporters...
                Last edited by lektrode; September 12, 2013, 05:22 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

                  Dowd is not very accepting of the idea that W.'s dummy mask was an effective way to handle opposition. It is perfectly true, however, that America has no heart for unnecessary wars. Defense of self and others...sure, if the others are not the relatives of the bad guys...and we're sick of the mindless religiousity in the Middle East. 9/11 was an eye-opener, and we were just as amazed as outraged that anyone would blow up civilians just to make a point, even Islamic Terrorists.

                  Oh, gee...wasn't Obama just trying to make a point with Syria?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

                    Ouch.

                    When a liberal columnist uses flip-flopper on a Democrat president - that can't be good. That's the kind of language normally reserved for use by dem wascally Republicans.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??

                      Originally posted by Forrest View Post
                      Dowd is not very accepting of the idea that W.'s dummy mask was an effective way to handle opposition. It is perfectly true, however, that America has no heart for unnecessary wars. Defense of self and others...sure, if the others are not the relatives of the bad guys...and we're sick of the mindless religiousity in the Middle East. 9/11 was an eye-opener, and we were just as amazed as outraged that anyone would blow up civilians just to make a point, even Islamic Terrorists.

                      ...
                      Amazed and outraged? Really?

                      Just imagine how amazed and outraged the Islamic Terrorists were in the early morning hours of January 17, 1991.



                      United States Department of Defense definition of Collateral Damage, the then new Pentagon phrase for blowing up civilians:

                      "Unintentional or incidental injury or damage to persons or objects that would not be lawful military targets in the circumstances ruling at the time. Such damage is not unlawful so long as it is not excessive in light of the overall military advantage anticipated from the attack."

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: the 'Honeymoon' = officially OVER??



                        please, pledge today . . .

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X