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Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

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  • Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril



    Pier E-2, (at right) which contains the found fractured anchor rods, as CalTrans conducts a boat tour of the impacted areas of new eastern section of the Bay Bridge on Wednesday Mar. 27, 2013, in Oakland, Ca. Caltrans disclosed that more than a third of the 96 rods used to seismically strengthen the span near Yerba Buena Island had snapped when workers tightened the nuts used to hold them in place.



    Pier E-2 of the eastern section of the new Bay Bridge contains the 32 anchor rods that fractured when tightened in March, triggering the ensuing investigation of other bolts and rods.


    More than 600 high-strength rods and bolts used to secure seismic equipment on the new eastern span of the Bay Bridge are harder than the level at which a Caltrans expert says they are vulnerable to cracking, newly released test results show.

    The results are a key factor in Caltrans' upcoming decision about what to do with more than 2,000 high-strength, galvanized steel rods and bolts on the bridge. The tests were ordered after 32 rods cracked when workers tightened them on the span in March.

    The scheduled Sept. 3 opening for the $6.4 billion bridge hinges on Caltrans' verdict. If the span can't be finished by then, transportation officials say, it could be several additional months before conditions are right for a new opening date.

    The problem with hard steel that has been galvanized - dipped in molten zinc, an antirust measure - is that it is susceptible to being invaded by hydrogen. That can lead to cracking.

    Hundreds of hard rods

    The hardness question arose after the 32 rods on seismic stability structuresfailed. Caltrans said it wasn't sure how hard its other steel fasteners were, and ordered an audit of records and field testing of hundreds of rods.

    The data that the agency released this week show that 544 rods anchoring other seismic-stability structures and load-distributing bearings average 35 on a hardness scale developed by the American Society for Testing and Materials.

    Another 96 rods used inside the seismic bearings average 36, based on preinstallation quality-control tests, Caltrans said. The rods can't be field checked because they are not accessible on the new bridge.

    Above safety level

    Those levels are above the at-risk hardness threshold of 34 set by John Fisher, a renowned civil engineer and bridge specialist and one of three members of Caltrans' panel of independent bridge experts. Rods that hard can be invaded by hydrogen if they are placed under high stress, Fisher told The Chronicle.

    Caltrans ordinarily would not have used such hard rods, but made an exception to its own rules for the eastern span. Officials have never thoroughly explained the reason.

    Fisher, who said Caltrans' call to use the galvanized rods was "not well-thought through," said Thursday that he would await the results of corrosion-simulation tests on the rods before deciding whether to urge the agency to replace those with a hardness level of 34 or greater.

    "I think we ought to wait and see what the results of the tests are," Fisher said. "I don't see a great risk in doing that."
    The tests, he said, will "give you an idea as to whether they are susceptible to the environment."

    No more cracks

    Fisher also noted that no additional cracked bolts have been discovered since the 32 failed in March.

    The corrosion-simulation tests involve dunking the rods in tanks filled with salt water and progressively raising the tension on them over 25 days. The idea is to simulate 10 years' worth of exposure to a marine environment rich in hydrogen.
    Caltrans expects to have the results by late July.

    Brian Maroney, the chief engineer on the bridge project, has said replacing hundreds of bolts would be "one alternative" if Caltrans concludes they are excessively vulnerable to corrosion. "We might do that," he said in an interview last month.

    If Caltrans has to replace hundreds of bolts, it could add months to what has already been a decadelong construction project.

    Bridge options

    Steve Heminger, executive director of the Metropolitan Transportation Commission and a member of a bridge oversight panel, said that, depending on corrosion-test findings, many of the rods may ultimately be deemed "acceptable" as is. Others could be replaced after the bridge is open.

    Caltrans spokesman Andrew Gordon said Fisher has told Caltrans that any rod with a hardness above 34 is suspect and therefore, "You need to dig deeper and investigate more and consider tension levels and other testing data.

    "We are following that advice," Gordon said. "We haven't made any decisions. There is ongoing testing and investigation into these additional bolts. Once we have the results of that, we will seek the counsel of the seismic peer review panel, as we have throughout this process."

    Jaxon Van Derbeken is a San Francisco Chronicle staff writer. E-mail: jvanderbeken@sfchronicle.com


  • #2
    Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

    Time to go back and re-read another thread that don started about the bridge. There's lots of good stuff in the iTulip archives.

    http://www.itulip.com/forums/showthr...and-the-Bridge

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

      Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
      Time to go back and re-read another thread that don started about the bridge. There's lots of good stuff in the iTulip archives.

      http://www.itulip.com/forums/showthr...and-the-Bridge
      Were the rods that cracked made in China?

      Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

        In the end, like everything in life, it all comes down to the nuts and bolts of the situation.

        My older son, who was going to pursue Minimg Engineering, got accepted to a very good non-mining engineering school and chose that route instead. Everyone enters in Gen'l Eng, but I am thinking a good mmajor might be Civil as so much of our infrastructure is decaying and will have to be replaced.

        Any thoughts out there?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

          Originally posted by doom&gloom View Post
          In the end, like everything in life, it all comes down to the nuts and bolts of the situation.

          My older son, who was going to pursue Minimg Engineering, got accepted to a very good non-mining engineering school and chose that route instead. Everyone enters in Gen'l Eng, but I am thinking a good mmajor might be Civil as so much of our infrastructure is decaying and will have to be replaced.

          Any thoughts out there?
          I don't think it matters a great deal which department within the faculty of engineering he decides to study, as long as he's passionate about what he's learning.

          I started out with a Mechanical Engineering degree and ended up in petroleum, and now involved with some commercial aspects of a hard rock mine for the moment. Lot's of geophysicists started out with electrical engineering degrees. Chemical engineering is a good entry into refining and a whole host of other processing systems and materials technology opportunities. Civil engineers have equally diverse opportunities available to them, but the on trap I have seem some of my Civil peers fall into is that an overdependence on infrastructure consulting jobs means an overdependence on the government investment funding cycle...which can be notoriously volatile...but then so are commodity prices which is where I spent my career :-)

          Overall what engineering school will give him is a grounding in the applied sciences coupled with better reasoning and other problem solving skills. These can be applied throughout one's life in many diverse areas.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

            Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
            Overall what engineering school will give him is a grounding in the applied sciences coupled with better reasoning and other problem solving skills. These can be applied throughout one's life in many diverse areas.
            This is why I enjoy having conversations with engineers. If I'm wrong about something or just plain ignorant I want to be corrected and enlightened, and I prefer to be persuaded by logic rather than emotions. Engineers are trained to think in constructive ways. Hey! That would make a great bumper sticker.

            Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

              Originally posted by shiny! View Post
              This is why I enjoy having conversations with engineers. If I'm wrong about something or just plain ignorant I want to be corrected and enlightened, and I prefer to be persuaded by logic rather than emotions. Engineers are trained to think in constructive ways. Hey! That would make a great bumper sticker.
              Programmers do it one bit at a time.

              yow...ages since I heard that one. :-)

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

                Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
                I don't think it matters a great deal which department within the faculty of engineering he decides to study, as long as he's passionate about what he's learning.

                I started out with a Mechanical Engineering degree and ended up in petroleum, and now involved with some commercial aspects of a hard rock mine for the moment. Lot's of geophysicists started out with electrical engineering degrees. Chemical engineering is a good entry into refining and a whole host of other processing systems and materials technology opportunities. Civil engineers have equally diverse opportunities available to them, but the on trap I have seem some of my Civil peers fall into is that an overdependence on infrastructure consulting jobs means an overdependence on the government investment funding cycle...which can be notoriously volatile...but then so are commodity prices which is where I spent my career :-)

                Overall what engineering school will give him is a grounding in the applied sciences coupled with better reasoning and other problem solving skills. These can be applied throughout one's life in many diverse areas.
                I work at an engineering consulting firm filled with civil engineers with specialties across the spectrum; I will echo GRG55's thoughts on the funding cycle (and the cycle doesn't look great right now, lot's of municipal and state gov't looking to cut costs, and it SCARES me to consider the economic scenarios that EJ lays out for the next decade and how it could impact our business) and add this.

                Very passionate engineers will find work and opportunity, no matter what their background. But with a very tight job market it means that he'll need either great hands-on experience during the summers or great grades in order to help open doors and find post-college employment.

                The engineering curriculum is tough and he will need to aim for A's and only get a handful of B's, cummulative averages less than 2.8 look bad these days. I say this as a hiring manager who does not receive resumes with cums less than 3.2 as they are all prescreened by HR.

                Finding the right jobs during summers is even tougher, and if he can't find work at an engineering firm or in the public sector doing engineering type work, at a minimum, he should reach out to departments of interest at school and get involved with a research project by junior year. It seems like many if not most schools have some sort of research projects as part of the curriculum but depending on what one does, it is an opportunity to stand out.

                My own suggestions to my son who is entering college this coming fall is to diversify his education. He is going to University of Maryland to pursue biochemical, or is it biomedical, or chemical, well, he's still a high school senior, he'll figure it out, but the secondary training in his case will be to also learn sufficient programming skills so that he will be capable in that area as well.

                Many of the technical gurus at our company have an undergraduate degree in one area and masters or doctorate degrees in a different area of science or engineering that compliments their undergraduate foundation.
                Last edited by wayiwalk; June 03, 2013, 09:03 AM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

                  Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
                  I don't think it matters a great deal which department within the faculty of engineering he decides to study, as long as he's passionate about what he's learning.

                  I started out with a Mechanical Engineering degree and ended up in petroleum, and now involved with some commercial aspects of a hard rock mine for the moment. Lot's of geophysicists started out with electrical engineering degrees. Chemical engineering is a good entry into refining and a whole host of other processing systems and materials technology opportunities. Civil engineers have equally diverse opportunities available to them, but the on trap I have seem some of my Civil peers fall into is that an overdependence on infrastructure consulting jobs means an overdependence on the government investment funding cycle...which can be notoriously volatile...but then so are commodity prices which is where I spent my career :-)

                  Overall what engineering school will give him is a grounding in the applied sciences coupled with better reasoning and other problem solving skills. These can be applied throughout one's life in many diverse areas.

                  Thanks for the thoughts! I lucked out last night and met a near-founder of a SW game company that would be THE place my son would choose to work today if he could do so. As a result of this encounter, he is supposed to get a 'tour' and if luck of all luck happens, a summer job -- though not holding my breath on that one.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Kung Fooey, Batman, Bay Bridge in Peril

                    redacted
                    Last edited by nedtheguy; October 09, 2014, 04:23 PM.

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