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  • Princeton and Ivy Elitism

    From the Daily Princtonian by Susan Patton: http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2013/03/29/32755/

    Forget about having it all, or not having it all, leaning in or leaning out — here’s what you really need to know that nobody is telling you.

    For years (decades, really) we have been bombarded with advice on professional advancement, breaking through that glass ceiling and achieving work-life balance. We can figure that out — we are Princeton women. If anyone can overcome professional obstacles, it will be our brilliant, resourceful, very well-educated selves.

    A few weeks ago, I attended the Women and Leadership conference on campus that featured a conversation between President Shirley Tilghman and Wilson School professor Anne-Marie Slaughter, and I participated in the breakout session afterward that allowed current undergraduate women to speak informally with older and presumably wiser alumnae. I attended the event with my best friend since our freshman year in 1973. You girls glazed over at preliminary comments about our professional accomplishments and the importance of networking. Then the conversation shifted in tone and interest level when one of you asked how have Kendall and I sustained a friendship for 40 years. You asked if we were ever jealous of each other. You asked about the value of our friendship, about our husbands and children. Clearly, you don’t want any more career advice. At your core, you know that there are other things that you need that nobody is addressing. A lifelong friend is one of them. Finding the right man to marry is another.

    When I was an undergraduate in the mid-seventies, the 200 pioneer women in my class would talk about navigating the virile plains of Princeton as a precursor to professional success. Never being one to shy away from expressing an unpopular opinion, I said that I wanted to get married and have children. It was seen as heresy.

    For most of you, the cornerstone of your future and happiness will be inextricably linked to the man you marry, and you will never again have this concentration of men who are worthy of you.

    Here’s what nobody is telling you: Find a husband on campus before you graduate. Yes, I went there.
    I am the mother of two sons who are both Princetonians. My older son had the good judgment and great fortune to marry a classmate of his, but he could have married anyone. My younger son is a junior and the universe of women he can marry is limitless. Men regularly marry women who are younger, less intelligent, less educated. It’s amazing how forgiving men can be about a woman’s lack of erudition, if she is exceptionally pretty. Smart women can’t (shouldn’t) marry men who aren’t at least their intellectual equal. As Princeton women, we have almost priced ourselves out of the market. Simply put, there is a very limited population of men who are as smart or smarter than we are. And I say again — you will never again be surrounded by this concentration of men who are worthy of you.

    Of course, once you graduate, you will meet men who are your intellectual equal — just not that many of them. And, you could choose to marry a man who has other things to recommend him besides a soaring intellect. But ultimately, it will frustrate you to be with a man who just isn’t as smart as you.

    Here is another truth that you know, but nobody is talking about. As freshman women, you have four classes of men to choose from. Every year, you lose the men in the senior class, and you become older than the class of incoming freshman men. So, by the time you are a senior, you basically have only the men in your own class to choose from, and frankly, they now have four classes of women to choose from. Maybe you should have been a little nicer to these guys when you were freshmen?

    If I had daughters, this is what I would be telling them.

    Susan A. Patton ’77
    President of the Class of 1977New York, N.Y.


    And now reply to her letter in the NYT. by Ross Douthat

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/07/op...=fb-share&_r=2&

    SUSAN PATTON, the Princeton alumna who became famous for her letter urging Ivy League women to use their college years to find a mate, has been denounced as a traitor to feminism, to coeducation, to the university ideal. But really she’s something much more interesting: a traitor to her class.

    Her betrayal consists of being gauche enough to acknowledge publicly a truth that everyone who’s come up through Ivy League culture knows intuitively — that elite universities are about connecting more than learning, that the social world matters far more than the classroom to undergraduates, and that rather than an escalator elevating the best and brightest from every walk of life, the meritocracy as we know it mostly works to perpetuate the existing upper class.

    Every elite seeks its own perpetuation, of course, but that project is uniquely difficult in a society that’s formally democratic and egalitarian and colorblind. And it’s even more difficult for an elite that prides itself on its progressive politics, its social conscience, its enlightened distance from hierarchies of blood and birth and breeding.

    Thus the importance, in the modern meritocratic culture, of the unacknowledged mechanisms that preserve privilege, reward the inside game, and ensure that the advantages enjoyed in one generation can be passed safely onward to the next.

    The intermarriage of elite collegians is only one of these mechanisms — but it’s an enormously important one. The outraged reaction to her comments notwithstanding, Patton wasn’t telling Princetonians anything they didn’t already understand. Of course Ivy League schools double as dating services. Of course members of elites — yes, gender egalitarians, the males as well as the females — have strong incentives to marry one another, or at the very least find a spouse from within the wider meritocratic circle. What better way to double down on our pre-existing advantages? What better way to minimize, in our descendants, the chances of the dread phenomenon known as “regression to the mean”?


    That this “assortative mating,” in which the best-educated Americans increasingly marry one another, also ends up perpetuating existing inequalities seems blindingly obvious, which is no doubt why it’s considered embarrassing and reactionary to talk about it too overtly. We all know what we’re supposed to do — our mothers don’t have to come out and say it!


    Why, it would be like telling elite collegians that they should all move to similar cities and neighborhoods, surround themselves with their kinds of people and gradually price everybody else out of the places where social capital is built, influence exerted and great careers made. No need — that’s what we’re already doing! (What Richard Florida called “the mass relocation of highly skilled, highly educated and highly paid Americans to a relatively small number of metropolitan regions, and a corresponding exodus of the traditional lower and middle classes from these same places” is one of the striking social facts of the modern meritocratic era.) We don’t need well-meaning parents lecturing us about the advantages of elite self-segregation, and giving the game away to everybody else. ...

    Or it would be like telling admissions offices at elite schools that they should seek a form of student-body “diversity” that’s mostly cosmetic, designed to flatter multicultural sensibilities without threatening existing hierarchies all that much. They don’t need to be told — that’s how the system already works! The “holistic” approach to admissions, which privileges résumé-padding and extracurriculars over raw test scores or G.P.A.’s, has two major consequences: It enforces what looks suspiciously like de facto discrimination against Asian applicants with high SAT scores, while disadvantaging talented kids — often white and working class and geographically dispersed — who don’t grow up in elite enclaves with parents and friends who understand the system. The result is an upper class that looks superficially like America, but mostly reproduces the previous generation’s elite.

    But don’t come out and say it! Next people will start wondering why the names in the U.S. News rankings change so little from decade to decade. Or why the American population gets bigger and bigger, but our richest universities admit the same size classes every year, Or why in a country of 300 million people and countless universities, we can’t seem to elect a president or nominate a Supreme Court justice who doesn’t have a Harvard or Yale degree.

    No, it’s better for everyone when these questions aren’t asked too loudly. The days of noblesse oblige are long behind us, so our elite’s entire claim to legitimacy rests on theories of equal opportunity and upward mobility, and the promise that “merit” correlates with talents and deserts.

    That the actual practice of meritocracy mostly involves a strenuous quest to avoid any kind of downward mobility, for oneself or for one’s kids, is something every upper-class American understands deep in his or her highly educated bones.
    But really, Susan Patton, do we have to talk about it?

  • #2
    Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

    Susan "Jaffe" Patton is just trying to find a wife for her son, what else is an interfering old mother supposed to do with her time?

    http://www.ivygateblog.com/2013/03/m...ible-bachelor/

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

      Flat earth here we come. That attack on the perceived top-1% is going to be brutal for them. Lot's of clues of what's to come.
      The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge ~D Boorstin

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

        Originally posted by reggie View Post
        That attack on the perceived top-1% is going to be brutal for them. Lot's of clues of what's to come.



        becoming more widespread . . .

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

          That video was good. Thanks Don.

          The one thing I will say is that there is a whole generation coming through the ivies right now, particularly the middle class kids from around the world that make it in there, that are hyperaware that the system is rigged and broken. Particularly the banking system.

          It's the long depression all over again. We'll just have to sit here and watch in slow motion as one more big bubble forms before the real reformers are old enough to grab the reigns and change things.

          Somewhere out there will be a little FDR - a mamma's boy who the boys at Groton never really got along with - who is studying up on how to put a stick in their eye for the little guy. Somewhere out there already is a Carter Glass, reading Aristotle and Plato, and wondering why these pinstripe plastic smiles have Maseratis for crashing the economy while he's eating oatmeal for supper.

          The longer they go without justice, and the richer they get, the more the rage will simmer and seethe just under the surface. In 1894 they marched on Wall Street. In 1920 they blew it up. In 1933 they taxed the hell out of it. I'm afraid it's just a case of history repeating. The kids who marched in Occupy aren't going to just grow up and forget it. They have no power today. What about 20 years from now?

          The old railroad and telephone and oil barrons have given way to internet and semiconductor and computer barrons. Bankers stay rich all the while. New technological infrastructure abounds. Unemployment will be blamed on technology instead of policy just as it was before. But I honestly wonder if history will be any kinder to the robber barrons of this era than those of the last one. These ones have been careful not to congregate together, outside of Davos. They don't have a Newport in which to be gaudy.

          Still, my guess is people will look back on this time as a time of crooks and thieves and crooked government. We're probably only two or three presidents away from the next Teapot Dome. I mean a Teapot Dome style scandle that actually blows up. Harding giving no bid oil contracts away is reminiscent of the Haliburton deals of the last administration. Then the Supreme Court handed down the Citizens United decision. These sorts of things will live in historical infamy as evidence of a new age of wonton corruption.

          Just like the late 1800s. Nothing but a divided do-nothing congress, substandard and corrupt presidential administrations, robber barrons running the show, and the general public slowly but surely getting wise to how bad they're taking it. Sure, this era will have run the fiber optic cables and built the internet. The infrastructure could be important for a long time. But the policy will simply be looked upon as abject failure that needs to be changed drastically.

          And this history will be attached to all of Europe, perhaps save Germany, as well.

          It's all pretty crazy to think about.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

            Originally posted by dcarrigg View Post
            That video was good. Thanks Don.

            The one thing I will say is that there is a whole generation coming through the ivies right now, particularly the middle class kids from around the world that make it in there, that are hyperaware that the system is rigged and broken. Particularly the banking system.

            It's the long depression all over again. We'll just have to sit here and watch in slow motion as one more big bubble forms before the real reformers are old enough to grab the reigns and change things.

            Somewhere out there will be a little FDR - a mamma's boy who the boys at Groton never really got along with - who is studying up on how to put a stick in their eye for the little guy. Somewhere out there already is a Carter Glass, reading Aristotle and Plato, and wondering why these pinstripe plastic smiles have Maseratis for crashing the economy while he's eating oatmeal for supper.

            The longer they go without justice, and the richer they get, the more the rage will simmer and seethe just under the surface. In 1894 they marched on Wall Street. In 1920 they blew it up. In 1933 they taxed the hell out of it. I'm afraid it's just a case of history repeating. The kids who marched in Occupy aren't going to just grow up and forget it. They have no power today. What about 20 years from now?

            The old railroad and telephone and oil barrons have given way to internet and semiconductor and computer barrons. Bankers stay rich all the while. New technological infrastructure abounds. Unemployment will be blamed on technology instead of policy just as it was before. But I honestly wonder if history will be any kinder to the robber barrons of this era than those of the last one. These ones have been careful not to congregate together, outside of Davos. They don't have a Newport in which to be gaudy.

            Still, my guess is people will look back on this time as a time of crooks and thieves and crooked government. We're probably only two or three presidents away from the next Teapot Dome. I mean a Teapot Dome style scandle that actually blows up. Harding giving no bid oil contracts away is reminiscent of the Haliburton deals of the last administration. Then the Supreme Court handed down the Citizens United decision. These sorts of things will live in historical infamy as evidence of a new age of wonton corruption.

            Just like the late 1800s. Nothing but a divided do-nothing congress, substandard and corrupt presidential administrations, robber barrons running the show, and the general public slowly but surely getting wise to how bad they're taking it. Sure, this era will have run the fiber optic cables and built the internet. The infrastructure could be important for a long time. But the policy will simply be looked upon as abject failure that needs to be changed drastically.

            And this history will be attached to all of Europe, perhaps save Germany, as well.

            It's all pretty crazy to think about.
            Thanks for putting it all in a historical perspective. In a sense, we all know the times we are living in will someday be other people's historical stories. But somehow it is still easy to forget that problems like this have also been faced down before, with a whole range of solutions.

            One only needs to set aside the idea that we have somehow evolved to a point that puts us above or beyond those solutions, and one can see what might unfold. History repeats because people don't think it can.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

              Originally posted by astonas View Post
              people don't think ...
              You have correctly diagnosed the problem

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                Originally posted by dcarrigg View Post
                That video was good. Thanks Don.

                The one thing I will say is that there is a whole generation coming through the ivies right now, particularly the middle class kids from around the world that make it in there, that are hyperaware that the system is rigged and broken. Particularly the banking system.

                It's the long depression all over again. We'll just have to sit here and watch in slow motion as one more big bubble forms before the real reformers are old enough to grab the reigns and change things.

                Somewhere out there will be a little FDR - a mamma's boy who the boys at Groton never really got along with - who is studying up on how to put a stick in their eye for the little guy. Somewhere out there already is a Carter Glass, reading Aristotle and Plato, and wondering why these pinstripe plastic smiles have Maseratis for crashing the economy while he's eating oatmeal for supper.

                The longer they go without justice, and the richer they get, the more the rage will simmer and seethe just under the surface. In 1894 they marched on Wall Street. In 1920 they blew it up. In 1933 they taxed the hell out of it. I'm afraid it's just a case of history repeating. The kids who marched in Occupy aren't going to just grow up and forget it. They have no power today. What about 20 years from now?

                The old railroad and telephone and oil barrons have given way to internet and semiconductor and computer barrons. Bankers stay rich all the while. New technological infrastructure abounds. Unemployment will be blamed on technology instead of policy just as it was before. But I honestly wonder if history will be any kinder to the robber barrons of this era than those of the last one. These ones have been careful not to congregate together, outside of Davos. They don't have a Newport in which to be gaudy.

                Still, my guess is people will look back on this time as a time of crooks and thieves and crooked government. We're probably only two or three presidents away from the next Teapot Dome. I mean a Teapot Dome style scandle that actually blows up. Harding giving no bid oil contracts away is reminiscent of the Haliburton deals of the last administration. Then the Supreme Court handed down the Citizens United decision. These sorts of things will live in historical infamy as evidence of a new age of wonton corruption.

                Just like the late 1800s. Nothing but a divided do-nothing congress, substandard and corrupt presidential administrations, robber barrons running the show, and the general public slowly but surely getting wise to how bad they're taking it. Sure, this era will have run the fiber optic cables and built the internet. The infrastructure could be important for a long time. But the policy will simply be looked upon as abject failure that needs to be changed drastically.

                And this history will be attached to all of Europe, perhaps save Germany, as well.

                It's all pretty crazy to think about.
                I'll take an FDR (but, actually, I'd rather have another Teddy Roosevelt - now that was a man who stood up to the bankers). It's the budding Adolf Hitlers, Benito Mussolinis, Vladimir Lenins and Mao Zedungs that I worry about.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                  Originally posted by RebbePete View Post
                  I'll take an FDR (but, actually, I'd rather have another Teddy Roosevelt - now that was a man who stood up to the bankers). It's the budding Adolf Hitlers, Benito Mussolinis, Vladimir Lenins and Mao Zedungs that I worry about.
                  We've got them now, only they're more polite than the ones you listed. DHS has surveillance powers that the KGB could only dream of. The Patriot Act? NDAA? The noose is around our necks already. Just because they haven't tightened it doesn't mean they can't or won't. The police state isn't going to happen, it has happened. As long as we're "good" it will be mostly invisible, but I remember what it used to feel like to be free.

                  Think you still have freedom? Try getting on a plane, getting a job, opening a bank account or buying a weapon without showing your "Papers, please". Everything about you is in a database, controlled by people who want to manage you.

                  This post, I'm sure, is being recorded with my IP address in a database.

                  Recently in Boston the veneer of civility was pulled aside. We saw the police state in action as it forcibly removed citizens from their homes at gunpoint and searched their houses without warrants. Think you still have freedom? Try saying "No" when they come to your door with guns and order you out so they can search your home without a warrant.

                  Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                    Originally posted by shiny! View Post
                    We've got them now, only they're more polite than the ones you listed. DHS has surveillance powers that the KGB could only dream of. The Patriot Act? NDAA? The noose is around our necks already. Just because they haven't tightened it doesn't mean they can't or won't. The police state isn't going to happen, it has happened. As long as we're "good" it will be mostly invisible, but I remember what it used to feel like to be free.

                    Think you still have freedom? Try getting on a plane, getting a job, opening a bank account or buying a weapon without showing your "Papers, please". Everything about you is in a database, controlled by people who want to manage you.

                    This post, I'm sure, is being recorded with my IP address in a database.

                    Recently in Boston the veneer of civility was pulled aside. We saw the police state in action as it forcibly removed citizens from their homes at gunpoint and searched their houses without warrants. Think you still have freedom? Try saying "No" when they come to your door with guns and order you out so they can search your home without a warrant.
                    I know that the "ship" of tyranny has been built, but so far, I haven't seen a powerful captain to man it. That's the last piece of the puzzle, when the whole mechanism will be brought to bear to crush any who would think to dissent, rooting out all forbidden ideas, shattering any illusion of freedom for the sake of what will be proclaimed as "peace and safety." I don't think it will be confined to just the United States, but will be world-wide.

                    It's taken us years to get here, and my only hope is that it takes long enough that I'm dead before that "ship" launches, or that the generations coming up will indeed have enough courage to dismantle it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                      Originally posted by RebbePete View Post
                      I know that the "ship" of tyranny has been built, but so far, I haven't seen a powerful captain to man it. That's the last piece of the puzzle, when the whole mechanism will be brought to bear to crush any who would think to dissent, rooting out all forbidden ideas, shattering any illusion of freedom for the sake of what will be proclaimed as "peace and safety." I don't think it will be confined to just the United States, but will be world-wide.

                      It's taken us years to get here, and my only hope is that it takes long enough that I'm dead before that "ship" launches, or that the generations coming up will indeed have enough courage to dismantle it.
                      I will do it no worries dismantle the ship that is.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                        Originally posted by dcarrigg View Post
                        We're probably only two or three presidents away from the next Teapot Dome. I mean a Teapot Dome style scandle that actually blows up.
                        With the current state of the new media, it will be interesting to see how it unfolds...

                        http://www.washingtonpost.com/busine...y.html?hpid=z1

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                          Originally posted by RebbePete View Post
                          I know that the "ship" of tyranny has been built, but so far, I haven't seen a powerful captain to man it. That's the last piece of the puzzle, when the whole mechanism will be brought to bear to crush any who would think to dissent, rooting out all forbidden ideas, shattering any illusion of freedom for the sake of what will be proclaimed as "peace and safety." I don't think it will be confined to just the United States, but will be world-wide.

                          It's taken us years to get here, and my only hope is that it takes long enough that I'm dead before that "ship" launches, or that the generations coming up will indeed have enough courage to dismantle it.
                          Sorry, but this perspective is old school - where hierarchical institutions rule the masses enabling individuals to lead and change those institutions for the benefit of everyone.

                          We live in a world where Complexity [theory] reigns suppreme, and where the masses are managed via sophisticated feedback systems of big data and millions of algorithms. Not only have the masses been dumbed down, their heath depleted, but now it will take a super sophisticated mass army (who really understands a networked society and how to control it) to create different feedback that can actually perturbate the system sufficiently to alter it's trajectory.

                          Someday those graduating from Ivy League schools, at least the ones who haven't been utterly corrupted by the indoctrincation, will understand how big of a lie the Internet was and is. But right now, talking like this results in a hostile response at best, or avoidance at worst.
                          The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge ~D Boorstin

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Princeton and Ivy Elitism

                            And here is Brzezinski on Fox news in 2009 discussing the possibility of lists being created to target those who made extreme wealth in recent years. It looks to me like Zbigniew has to hold back he glee at the prospect of such a societal paradigm.

                            The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge ~D Boorstin

                            Comment

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