Bitcoin soon to enter early adopter phase

[*T*]

Re: Bitcoin soon to enter early adopter phase

If you believe that bitcoin will take care of all your needs for money - then I'd suggest trying to live for a month without recourse to using dollars. Or try paying your taxes with bitcoin.

It's been done more than once:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirh...ourney-begins/
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirh...tarting-today/

[*T*]

Re: Bitcoin soon to enter early adopter phase

If you're saying bitcoin is money because you can buy stuff with it - the same can be said for day labor, for barter, or for any number of other activities where you can gain something in return for something else.

My view is that if you can't freely exchange nor you can you pay off legal debts, then it isn't money.



mon·ey

/ˈmənē/
Noun

1. A current medium of exchange in the form of coins and banknotes; coins and banknotes collectively.
2. Sums of money.

Bitcoin is money, according to US case law:

http://www.finextra.com/news/fullsto...wsitemid=25099

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirh...is-real-money/

A US federal judge has ruled that bitcoin is a "form of money", paving the way for a legal case against a man accused of running a giant ponzi scheme using the virtual currency.

Last month the Securities and Exchange Commission charged Trendon Shavers with running a bitcoin Ponzi scheme through his Bitcoin Savings and Trust (BTCST), which raked in 700,000 bitcoins, worth $4.5 million, from unwary investors.

Shavers argued that the case should be ditched because the SEC has no jurisdiction because the bitcoin investments he was offering were not securities because the crypto-currency is not money or subject to any regulations.

However, US Magistrate Judge Amos Mazzant has rejected the claim, ruling that "it is clear that bitcoin can be used as money" and "is a currency or form of money, and investors wishing to invest in BTCST provided an investment of money".

Therefore, the court ruled, "BTCST investments meet the definition of investment contract, and as such, are securities".

[c1ue]

Re: Bitcoin soon to enter early adopter phase

It's been done more than once:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirh...ourney-begins/
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirh...tarting-today/

If these articles are meant to be positive - that's not the reading I got out of them.

The first one: Living on bitcoin for even just 1 week is incredibly challenging.

The second one: the couple is going to try, but it is still far from clear how successful that attempt will be.

It is less than 1 month since their 3 month publicity stunt has begun.

Bitcoin is money, according to US case law:

http://www.finextra.com/news/fullsto...wsitemid=25099

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirh...is-real-money/

The problem with the case law is that it has nothing to do with monetary authority. The ruling was solely to judge whether the bitcoin Ponzi scammer's assertion - that bitcoins are not securities - is valid.

The primary reason bitcoin isn't yet defined is purely procedural - the definition of what constitutes money is quite clear from such things as the BSA definition of a money services business:

http://www.fincen.gov/financial_inst...sb/amimsb.html

Money Orders	Issuer of money orders Seller of money orders Redeemer of money orders
Traveler's Checks	Issuer of traveler's checks Seller of traveler's checks Redeemer of traveler's checks
Money Transmission	Money transmitter
Check Cashing	Check casher
Currency Exchange	Dealer in foreign exchange
Currency Dealing	Dealer in foreign exchange
Prepaid Access	Provider of Prepaid Access Seller of Prepaid Access

This list defines all of the various money services businesses right now, and the form of money associated with said businesses.

Is bitcoin a money order? Is it a foreign currency? Is it a traveller's check? Is it a prepaid access? The answer is right now is no on all counts.

Thus legally speaking, a bitcoin exchange isn't a money services business. If in fact bitcoin is money, then the above definition has to change.

This situation is identical with taxi services masquerading as 'ride sharing', with hotel rental masquerading as 'room sharing', and all the other forms of legal definition avoidance in order to get around existing regulation.

[*T*]

Re: Bitcoin soon to enter early adopter phase

If these articles are meant to be positive - that's not the reading I got out of them.

The first one: Living on bitcoin for even just 1 week is incredibly challenging.

The second one: the couple is going to try, but it is still far from clear how successful that attempt will be.

It is less than 1 month since their 3 month publicity stunt has begun.



The problem with the case law is that it has nothing to do with monetary authority. The ruling was solely to judge whether the bitcoin Ponzi scammer's assertion - that bitcoins are not securities - is valid.

The primary reason bitcoin isn't yet defined is purely procedural - the definition of what constitutes money is quite clear from such things as the BSA definition of a money services business:

http://www.fincen.gov/financial_inst...sb/amimsb.html



This list defines all of the various money services businesses right now, and the form of money associated with said businesses.

Is bitcoin a money order? Is it a foreign currency? Is it a traveller's check? Is it a prepaid access? The answer is right now is no on all counts.

Thus legally speaking, a bitcoin exchange isn't a money services business. If in fact bitcoin is money, then the above definition has to change.

This situation is identical with taxi services masquerading as 'ride sharing', with hotel rental masquerading as 'room sharing', and all the other forms of legal definition avoidance in order to get around existing regulation.

The articles were meant to illustrate that it is possible to live on bitcoin -- though being early days, yes of course it's very challenging. I would not attempt it personally.

Unfortunately FINCEN has issued guidance saying that bitcoin businesses (exchanges and miners) ARE money transmitters and money service businesses.
www.fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/pdf/FIN-2013-G001.pdf

Of course this is not tested in court yet so you may end up being right (I hope it is the case actually) but for now FINCEN clearly judges otherwise.

What I am saying is that the regulatory environment in the US is shaping up to regard bitcoin as some kind of money.
Germany's finmin has ruled it is private money http://translate.google.de/translate...s-Geld-an.html.

[swgprop]

Re: Bitcoin gets the MSM Treatment

Dale doesn't exactly look like an international crypto-criminal. He's soft-spoken, baby-faced, and a senior at an Ivy League college. But every couple of weeks the political science major logs onto the Silk Road, an online black market that has been described as an "amazon.com of drugs" to buy wholesale quantities of "molly" (also known as MDMA, a particularly "pure" form of ecstasy), LSD and magic mushrooms. Some of these will be for his personal use, and the rest he'll flog to less tech-savvy classmates at a mark-up of up to 300%. On a good weekend, he can net a profit of around $2,500. It's a more lucrative sideline than waiting tables.

Well, not any more ...
Feds Take Down Online Fraud Bazaar ‘Silk Road’, Arrest Alleged Mastermind