Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

[metalman]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

Gold at $1700/ oz. is a SELL, SELL, SELL, SELL, SELL, SELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL ! All day and all night, all week, all month, all year.

An ounce of gold, not long ago, was worth $35. ( about four or five large bags of groceries in the good ol' days )

er, you started to advise such @ $900...

[Starving Steve]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

U.S. Gold Holdings at Ft. Knox, Kentucky: ONE HUNDRED AND FORTY-SEVEN BILLION TROY OUNCES oF PURE GOLD.

Plus all of North America is floating on oil. Here on the California coast, oil is seeping-out of fissures in the sea-floor and floating in giant tar-balls onto beaches, everyday and everywhere.

Aqui en la costa de California, petroleo esta derramando afuera de las hendiduras, y el petroleo esta subiendo en las breas gigantes y esta floatando para que estar depositado en las playas en todas las partes del estado, cada dia. Este continente esta flotando arriba del petroleo. Hay petroleo en todas las partes.

The dollar is not dead. It's just that the people in America need to get their priorities and their engineering in order. There is oil everywhere.

Back to those gold holdings of Uncle Sam. By my 8th grade failure in math, I would think that 147 billion troy ounces @ $1700 per ounce just might translate to (147 x 10^9) x ( $17 x 10 ^2) = ($2500 x 10^11) = ($2.5 x 10^13) = $ 25 TRILLION.

Once again for slow learners like myself: THERE IS TWENTY-FIVE TRILLION DOLLARS oF GOLD in Ft. KNOX...... Maybe tell that to Al Qaide, Iran, the eco-frauds, and all of America's many enemies.... Anyone care to sell the dollar short? Every time the gold bugs ( like myself ) run the price of gold higher, they bid-up the value of the gold in Ft. Knox.

Would you like that translated into Spanish so that most of us in the West might understand this reality, Sir?

Sure, $ 25T is not enough gold to go around, but it would be a start....... And then we have the oil being deposited onto the beaches in California, and the eco-frauds don't want you to know about it. Then we have the oil deep under the Gulf of Mex. Then we have the oil in the Bakken Formation in North Dakota.... Then we have the oil sands in Canada, and Canada is our closest ally. Then we have Alaska oil. Then add to that the oil to be taken by fracturing shale. Then we have natural-gas, coal, atomic power, and hydro-electric dams................ And if we should get bored, we can explore the offshore East Coast, including Florida waters for oil.

[Fiat Currency]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

BAD MATH = $ 25 TRILLION.

Once again for slow learners like myself: THERE IS TWENTY-FIVE TRILLION DOLLARS oF GOLD in Ft. KNOX......

Steve ... with all due respect your MATH IS WAY OFF !!!!

A = 8133.5 tonnes (metric) of gold in Fort Knox (forgetting the 'maybe' factor)
B = 32,150.7466 troy ounces in a metric tonne
C = $1,700.00 rough price of gold

A*B*C = $444,546,765,700.87

That's $444 BILLION and change .... so you are off by about $24.5 Trillion and change !!!

With the US Debt increasing at about $4B per DAY ... the gold will cover you for about 111 days.

See the problem ??

[Starving Steve]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

I am wrong...... There are 147 MILLION troy ounces of pure gold in Ft. Knox. I had mis-read the mass of the gold to be quoted in billions of troy ounces and rather than quoted in millions of troy ounces--- using the CBS News story, "Is there gold in Ft. Knox?" of Jan 2010. So, my calculation was off by 10^3 ( three orders of magnitude ).

Therefore, my 25 trillion dollars is more like 25 billion dollars.

If CBS News is correct, which apparently it isn't, I then come up way low at $25 billion dollars. You have $444 billion. So who has the correct figure, or is most of the gold foreign-owned?

Now, I am lost..... A billion to a million is three orders of magnitude. So I deflate my dollar worth calculation by three orders of magnitude, and I arrive at $25 billion.

You can google the story, and get back to everyone on this. The story was from CBS News: "Is There Gold in Fort Knox?" (Jan 20, 2010).

[Fiat Currency]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

I am wrong...... There are 147 MILLION troy ounces of pure gold in Ft. Knox. I had mis-read the mass of the gold to be quoted in billions of troy ounces and rather than quoted in millions of troy ounces--- using the CBS News story,

Stop watching mainstream media. There are 261.5 million troy ounces of gold (maybe) in Fort Knox ... (A*B) per above.

This guy gets it right ... but his math is from when gold was $1,500 an ounce (June 2011).

http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2011/06/...-proper-audit/

EDIT: Actually his math should have worked out to $392B ... but I think he was quoting a stated value (probably at a lower price) when he wrote that.

As I've said many times ... money is the only thing that currently has no STANDARD UNIT OF MEASURE.

Even then ... there are 2 tons (tons vs. tonnes) 2 ounces (avoirdupois vs. troy) 2 MPG (US MPG vs. Imperial MPG) and so on .... easy to trip up.

[c1ue]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

Yes, electricity supply is a huge problem, and it is costing a huge amount to replace nuclear with coal, oil, and gas.

The cost of fossil fuel imports into Japan more than doubled in many categories, including fuel oil and crude oil. Note that the Fukushima disaster occurred in March, so it is quite likely the fossil fuel import impact on Japan's balance of trade will increase yet again in 2012.

http://thebreakthrough.org/blog/2012...e_soar_a.shtml

By "quite normal" I mean that aside from the lighting being turned down in the train stations, I cannot tell that anything happened. Visitors say the same. I specifically asked people who visited before the quake and who visited recently whether they can tell anything happened when they are in Tokyo, and they all said no.

The data above shows that despite the noticeable decrease in energy usage, the economic impact is still quite significant. As noted in many posts elsewhere: individual energy consumption is a relatively small part of overall energy usage and lighting is a small part of residential electricity consumption.

A better measurement would be an overview which included things like industrial electricity consumption - a fall of which is much more directly related to output or miles of rail transport movement.

Some anecdotal results:

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/economy...AJ201201260065

In fiscal 2012, fossil fuel imports for power generation will increase by more than 3 trillion yen from fiscal 2010, according to estimates by the Institute of Energy Economics, Japan.

...

Tokyo Electric Power Co. has decided to raise electricity rates for large corporate users. Hayashida said the steel industry will have to shoulder an additional 20 billion yen a year.

You have to remember that TEPCO normally had 20% above peak capacity before the quake, so if everyone cuts electricity use by 10% or so, we would still be OK except if we have an unusually hot summer.

You cannot operate with zero additional capacity without a severe risk of brownouts.

I suppose in the medium term, a mass exodus of industry would help reduce the impact of energy imports on Japan's balance of trade, but I don't think the overall effect is positive.

[DSpencer]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

Steve ... with all due respect your MATH IS WAY OFF !!!!

A = 8133.5 tonnes (metric) of gold in Fort Knox (forgetting the 'maybe' factor)
B = 32,150.7466 troy ounces in a metric tonne
C = $1,700.00 rough price of gold

A*B*C = $444,546,765,700.87

That's $444 BILLION and change .... so you are off by about $24.5 Trillion and change !!!

With the US Debt increasing at about $4B per DAY ... the gold will cover you for about 111 days.

See the problem ??

This is not the first time that Starving Steve has railed on about something on these boards with his "math abilities" on display to back up his argument...only to be proven to be completely wrong.

"Ooops! I was wrong on my math by over 24,000,000,000,000 dollars. My bad. Never mind that this completely undermines the whole point I was making"

To be fair, I don't know why we should expect his math to be any less hyperbolic than the rest of what he says.

[Starving Steve]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

OK, the U.S. can not use Ft. Knox gold to buy significant time to put its financial house in order. I concede that point..... But the U.S. does have federal lands in the West, also in Alaska. These lands are worth some big money, including the minerals under these lands. The U.S. also has office buildings and military hardware, things that might be worth something on the world market. The U.S. also has federal highways and bridges, like the Golden Gate Bridge, for example. It also has oil fields, like the gigantic one here off of the California coast that no-one, especially the eco-frauds, claim to exist. The U.S. also has hydro-electric dams, like the Hoover Dam, the Glen Canyon Dam, Shasta Dam, etc. The U.S. also has locks and canals in the Great Lakes. The U.S. has unexplored ocean bottoms off of its shores which probably contain vast amounts of cheap and available oil. The U.S. has reserves of other metals such as silver at West Point, NY. The U.S. also has the best engineers and the best universities in the world, and as a nation, that asset is worth a great deal. The U.S. has the Santa Clara Valley, (the Silicon Valley) which is an asset of innumerable value. So, Uncle Sam is financially in trouble, but hardly bankrupt.... The U.S. is also the financial centre of the world, and that is quite important in avoiding any hyper-inflationary collapse. In other words, nations have their money invested in America, so they have a vested interest in keeping this nation's financial house afloat.

But some people would rather invest in Yemen or Iran, Nigeria or Syria, Algeria or Libya, Aden or Ethiopia, Togo or Cote Divoire, Sudan or Somalia, Mali or Chad, Senegal or Western Sahara, Djibouti or Mauritania, Iraq or Afghanistan, etc..... Everyone sees the investment world differently.

Back to how bankrupt Uncle Sam is: He owns much of the Messabi Range in Minnesota. He owns the Tennessee Valley Authority. He owns most of the Island of Hawaii, not to mention large portions of the other islands. He owns America's harbours and airports, too. He owns the National Parks. He has the sovereign taxing authority over the entire nation and its industries.

And speaking about a place like Silicon Valley with its priceless real estate, Uncle owns all of the old Moffett Field airbase in Mountain View, Cal. That pre-WWII airbase may be subdivided for industry and homes soon. There are federal hospitals owned by Uncle. Puerto Rico has federal lands, also the other territories/commonwealths of America have federal lands. Almost nearly all of New Mexico is federally owned, so too South Dakota, Wyoming and Nevada.

Taking a long position on gold at $1700 per ounce upon the assumption that hyper-inflation is going to break-out any day in the U.S, I would think would be financial suicide, at least in the long run. Just horsing about with a tiny bit of gold from Ft. Knox, maybe a few 400 ounce bars, Uncle would bury your position in gold and other U.S. dollar shorts..... It is not a question of how many days Uncle might hold-out (remain solvent) on a gold standard for the dollar, it is a question of how many hours you, or anyone else can financially hold-out against Uncle Sam.

[GRG55]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

...Uncle owns all of the old Moffett Field airbase in Mountain View, Cal. That pre-WWII airbase may be subdivided for industry and homes soon...

Uncle Sam's military owns a ton of great real estate. Just imagine the seaside condo developments that could be created on the Pacific Fleet navy base at Coronado alone. All they need to do is figure out a way to keep all those carrier task forces busy overseas 24/7 so they never have to come home... :-)

[cbr]

Re: Well, that just about wraps it up for the Dollar !

not to mention having complete veto power on any chosen sector of world trade by reason of the only true bluewater navy on the planet, as well as current control of space and the air in any chosen region.

you don't actually think anyone plans on the US paying back all that foreign held debt do you? those countries run those accounts because it empowers the employment that keeps their governments fat and happy and not hanging from trees and stuck with pitchforks. and because, despite the continually pathetic embarrassment that the US government has been devolving into since about 1913, the US is still the safest place to play.