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Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

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  • Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...77H31320110818

    From Ice Age to hyper-inflation with SocGen bear

    By Karen Brettell

    NEW YORK | Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:48am EDT

    NEW YORK (Reuters) - Three months ago, with the Federal Reserve nearing the end of its second major stimulus program and inflation pressures on the rise, Albert Edwards' bond market view stood out from the crowd.

    Societe Generale's famously bearish analyst, in contrast to most, did not see 10-year Treasury yields rising above 3 percent just because the Fed was going to stop buying bonds. Instead, he predicted they would fall below 2 percent.

    So far, Edwards -- who predicted the Asian financial crisis of 1997-98, the U.S. housing implosion and who sees China's economy suffering a hard landing -- has been closer than most on his debt call. Last week, yields tested their record low of 2.04 percent.

    Investors, however, should hope he's not as accurate on his next call: Edwards sees Treasury yields falling further because, he says, the economy will weaken. He is targeting benchmark rates at around 1.50 percent in the next six months.

    Be sure to lock in a low-rate mortgage while you can, though. After that, says Edwards, a period of hyper inflation will push bond yields into double digits and send the S&P 500 stock index tumbling to 400, only a third of its current value.

    "On a 10-year view I think government bonds are a horrible investment," Edwards told Reuters in an interview. "My view is that the end game for all this is monetization and trade war and very rapid inflation."

    ICE AGE

    London-based Edwards admits his views are outside the mainstream.

    "Many think I am mad," he wrote in a recent report.

    Still, Treasury yields have fallen from 6.5 percent in 1996 when Edwards went overweight the debt.

    And, with nerves shattered by wild price swings and portfolios that still show losses from the 2008 financial crisis, more people may be receptive to markedly bearish views.

    Edwards says the economy is in an Ice Age -- his term for a period of low inflation and near deflation and in which the economy has seen a broad deleveraging from the stock boom of the 1990s.

    "That was the great moderation -- the great moderation was a lie and a Ponzi scheme built on these massive debt mountains. And now those are finished you go back to normal, or worse than normal because you're so vulnerable," he said.

    Deleveraging leaves the economy more vulnerable to tightening, more volatile and shortens the gap between recessions, he said.

    In this way Edwards sees the U.S. economy playing out similarly to Japan's, which has experienced two "lost decades" marked by stagnant growth and low interest rates.

    "I think the U.S. is very much following the template of Japan," he said. "There are key differences but there are massive, massive similarities."

    Edwards' Ice Age is marked by a period when bond yields gradually decline as equity yields, as measured by averaging earnings and dividends, cheapen from the lows offered during the stock boom.

    The next phase, however, will be rapid inflation that hurts bond and equity positions alike.

    BOND YIELDS TO SOAR, EQUITIES PLUNGE

    What will end the bond rally is hard to pinpoint. Most likely, he said, it will start in Japan.

    "I think Japan will be the first to crack, really crack," he said. "Its demographics mean that big pension funds can no longer fund its huge deficit out of internal savings."

    Even with extremely low interest rates -- Japan's 10-year notes yield little over 1 percent -- the cost of servicing the country's debt will suck up over 20 percent of its 2011 budget, according to Japan's Ministry of Finance.

    Any upward pressure on yields has the potential to cause large and broad damage that would be felt internationally.

    "The markets can be quite forgiving for quite a while, but basically a country is deemed insolvent when the market for whatever reason decides it is," said Edwards.

    "You will get repeated rounds of money printing to try and stop it, but ultimately gravity has a habit of pulling markets down to where they should be. You can delay it, you can play around, but ultimately the pigeons come home to roost."

  • #2
    Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

    I wouldn't be betting against him...

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

      Does Albert Edwards have a blog somewhere? A thousand people quote him, where does he post?

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

        Originally posted by brent217 View Post
        Does Albert Edwards have a blog somewhere? A thousand people quote him, where does he post?
        occasional search of scribd.com, docstoc.com, or just google will find you stuff..

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

          Originally posted by doom&gloom View Post
          occasional search of scribd.com, docstoc.com, or just google will find you stuff..
          Thanks for these news resources.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

            Originally posted by Iron Zeppelin View Post
            Thanks for these news resources.

            Do take note that he doesn't really give a timeline.

            I'll probably wait a little more before scouping some dividend paying agri and oil stocks when gold drops to $1300.
            Last edited by touchring; September 03, 2011, 02:12 AM.

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            • #7
              Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

              Albert Edwards was a non-entity prior to 2008; he didn't even join SocGen under late 2007.

              http://www.sgib.com/Net/sdpv6.nsf/36F88A71EB07A302C12573B4003CCEB6/$file/PRelease%20Appointments%20SG%20Equity%20Research%2 0141207.pdf

              If you look at what he did prior to 2008 - he was a perma-bear in the best Doomer model:

              http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/12005060-1...#axzz1WvqhK1VF

              So while I wouldn't discount anything he says, at the same time the possibility of the broken clock does present itself.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

                Originally posted by c1ue View Post
                Albert Edwards was a non-entity prior to 2008; he didn't even join SocGen under late 2007.

                http://www.sgib.com/Net/sdpv6.nsf/36F88A71EB07A302C12573B4003CCEB6/$file/PRelease%20Appointments%20SG%20Equity%20Research%2 0141207.pdf

                If you look at what he did prior to 2008 - he was a perma-bear in the best Doomer model:

                http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/12005060-1...#axzz1WvqhK1VF

                So while I wouldn't discount anything he says, at the same time the possibility of the broken clock does present itself.

                He's not a perpetual bear, but more of a contrarian something along the lines of Marc Faber.

                With emerging markets and properties so inflated, it is good to be fearful. In recent months, the Singapore property market is flooded with sellers and few buyers. Yet prices are still holding up.

                Another monetary crisis or a big earthquake will blow off the emerging market time bomb, which will be very damaging to commodities. Commodities ain't seen the bottom yet...
                Last edited by touchring; September 04, 2011, 01:06 AM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

                  Originally posted by touchring
                  He's not a perpetual bear, but more of a contrarian something along the lines of Marc Faber.

                  With emerging markets and properties so inflated, it is good to be fearful. In recent months, the Singapore property market is flooded with sellers and few buyers. Yet prices are still holding up.

                  Another monetary crisis or a big earthquake will blow off the emerging market time bomb, which will be very damaging to commodities. Commodities ain't seen the bottom yet...
                  Clearly you didn't read the link, nor any others associated with his time before his most recent SocGen tenure.

                  http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...V48&refer=home

                  Edwards, 45, has recommended investors hold fewer stocks than Dresdner's benchmark since 1996. In November of that year he said the world had entered a period of low inflation that would push stocks into an ``Ice Age'' in which stock valuations would return to the levels of the 1950s and '60s.
                  So he's been repeating the 'Ice Age' since 1996? And the stock markets would tank since 1996? That's as wrong as wrong can be.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

                    Originally posted by c1ue View Post
                    Clearly you didn't read the link, nor any others associated with his time before his most recent SocGen tenure.

                    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...V48&refer=home



                    So he's been repeating the 'Ice Age' since 1996? And the stock markets would tank since 1996? That's as wrong as wrong can be.


                    I'd be wary if the writer talks about the personal life of the analyst. Soros is currently having a problem with his 28 year old girlfriend, recently he sold 80% of his gold and equity, does this mean he is wrong?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Albert Edwards foresaw stock bust and treasury boom in May.

                      I don't see what you're trying to say.

                      I presented proof via a public press release that Albert Edwards has been saying 'Ice Age' and blahberty blah - much as he is saying today - 15 years ago.

                      Clearly the identical message cannot possibly have been correct the entire 15 year period.

                      For that matter, the Dow in 1996 was 6000-ish.

                      Today it is 11000-ish.

                      Seems more like a Warm Period than an Ice Age if you look at the starting and ending points.

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