Behind England's Riots

[touchring]

Re: Behind England's Riots

[I]Former LA police detective Michael Ruppert's take:

So I guess the banks are also behind OBL and the collapse of the twin towers.

[KGW]

Re: Behind England's Riots

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/eu...html?hpt=hp_c1

Shock over 'respectable' lives behind masks of UK rioters


"ondon (CNN) -- Before they started appearing in court, most people assumed London's rioters and looters were unemployed youths with no hope and no future. So there was much surprise when details of the accused began to emerge, and they included some from wealthy backgrounds or with good jobs.
Those passing through London's courtrooms on Tuesday and Wednesday -- some courts sat overnight to cope with the numbers -- have included a teaching assistant, a lifeguard, a postman, a chef, a charity worker, a millionaire's daughter and an 11-year-old boy, newspapers reported.
The tabloid Sun newspaper wrote in its opinion page on Thursday of the "sick" society described by Prime Minister David Cameron: "The sickness starts on welfare-addicted estates where feckless parents let children run wild."
But its front-page headline told a different story about the accused: "Lifeguard, postman, hairdresser, teacher, millionaire's daughter, chef and schoolboy, 11."
The Daily Mail reported: "While the trouble has been largely blamed on feral teenagers, many of those paraded before the courts yesterday led apparently respectable lives."
The upmarket Daily Telegraph devoted its page three to the case of Laura Johnson, the 19-year-old daughter of a company director who pleaded not guilty to stealing £5,000 ($8,000) of electrical goods, under the headline: "Girl who has it all is accused of theft."
The newspaper said she lived in a converted farmhouse in the leafy London suburb of Orpington, Kent, with extensive grounds and a tennis court, had studied at one of the best-performing state schools in the country and now attends the University of Exeter.
Reporter Andrew Gilligan wrote in the Daily Telegraph: "Here in court, as David Cameron condemned the 'sickness' in parts of British society, we saw clearly, for the first time, the face of the riot: stripped of its hoods and masks, dressed in white prison T-shirts and handcuffed to burly security guards.
"It was rather different from the one we had been expecting."
He added of the defendants at Highbury Magistrates Court in north London: "Most were teenagers or in their early twenties, but a surprising number were older.
"Most interestingly of all, they were predominantly white, and many had jobs."

[renewable]

Re: Behind England's Riots

Those passing through London's courtrooms on Tuesday and Wednesday -- some courts sat overnight to cope with the numbers -- have included a teaching assistant, a lifeguard, a postman, a chef, a charity worker ...

Out of more than 1,000 arrests, one would have thought that there would be some more impressive sounding outliers.

[mesyn191]

Re: Behind England's Riots

There'll always be a few well off folks who want to do crap like this, but by and large most reports of looters tend to be that they're from the poorer areas and are poor to begin with. Which makes sense anyways since there are so many more poor folks than middle class or rich people in the UK just like in the US now.

Note how your story only mentions about 11-12 "well off" or rich folks but plays it up to make it seem like most of rioters are like that without ever actually including anymore hard numbers on the rioters divided by income and such. You're falling for pro FIRE media BS if you believe this was just some bored rich white kids rioting for shits n' giggles.

[BigBagel]

Re: Behind England's Riots

Former LA police detective Michael Ruppert's take:

Nice analysis. It's 'them' at work again. "They" are up to their old tricks. It's gibberish bro, gibberish.

[BigBagel]

Re: Behind England's Riots

Who the hell would want to live on an island where your place in society is assigned based on your accent.

[don]

Re: Behind England's Riots

Nice analysis. It's 'them' at work again. "They" are up to their old tricks. It's gibberish bro, gibberish.

Just one veteran of the force and where's he's gone.

As our defacto in-house law enforcement veteran, what's your take on a few related issues.

The admitted hundreds of billions in Mexican drug cartel money laundered by TBTF bank. The repeated use of agent provacateurs by police departments at anti-neoliberal demonstrations.

As an upright guy, what's your take on these matters? Do you agree it's disturbing?

[KGW]

Re: Behind England's Riots

You missed the big grin?

There'll always be a few well off folks who want to do crap like this, but by and large most reports of looters tend to be that they're from the poorer areas and are poor to begin with. Which makes sense anyways since there are so many more poor folks than middle class or rich people in the UK just like in the US now.

Note how your story only mentions about 11-12 "well off" or rich folks but plays it up to make it seem like most of rioters are like that without ever actually including anymore hard numbers on the rioters divided by income and such. You're falling for pro FIRE media BS if you believe this was just some bored rich white kids rioting for shits n' giggles.

[Chris Coles]

Re: Behind England's Riots

Ah, yes, the ol' "We should not attempt to examine the motives for this behavior, these people are simply EVIL" argument. Worked pretty well in the war on terror, didn't it?

I see this as pushing the question back, it doesn't provide any insight into the situation or help us to prevent it happening in the future. Saying that they are thugs engaged in pathological behavior isn't an answer. WHY are they engaging in this behavior? And why does this behavior cluster or originate in certain parts of the city? Why aren't kids in other countries doing it? You have to try hard to find answers that aren't related to economics and inequality.

Earlier this week I put this comment up on The Times, London.

The feral mobs stem from the way the Social Services here in the UK operate. Does anyone remember Cleveland? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clevela..._abuse_scandal
This was not an isolated incident, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...se_allegations

The end result was social services banned parents from any controlling contact with their children. Teachers have also lost control of the classroom for the same reason; today, neither parent nor teachers are permitted to chastise the child. The result is many children that have not been in any way brought under moral control. They grew up knowing that their parents could not spank them for their misdemeanours, their teachers the same. The long term consequence has arrived; a feral mob with no fear nor any inbuilt morality or respect for rules.

Now add, oh! yes!, add! .... Many of them have been damaged beyond repair by social services. Taken from their natural parents; moved, constantly; from one institution to another; deeply, DEEPLY, angry at their treatment. Back in the early 1990's, I walked home one night following a young man that was kicking out at everything in his path. He kicked in a shop window; he was kicking out and breaking everything he could get at. I followed him to where he was living, took note; reported to the police. You know what? He was being moved, constantly, by social services. The house where he was staying was owned by them and was one of the thousands of such places they use to cover up their mistakes.

My heart went out to that young man. He had been so damaged by the very people that are supposed to be there to protect him; he was completely out onto the edge of reason. THAT is the underlying problem we have here in the UK today. What we see this week is the long term result of indifference on the part of social services. The police are there to back up social services. For that, they are hated by these children and once children, now adults. So it is wrong to suggest we place the entire blame for their actions upon them, rather than accepting that there are deep reasons for their actions that must be addressed.

We must recognise the utter failure of the social services policy of a refusal to permit the physical chastisement of children by parents and teachers.

[mesyn191]

Re: Behind England's Riots

You missed the big grin?

I guess I misinterpreted it. My sarcasm detector is broken or something.

[don]

Re: Behind England's Riots

any news on this:

[WDCRob]

Re: Behind England's Riots

For a much better reasoned, and supported opinion piece than the original post ("I hate poor people."), see here.

[ljaycox]

Re: Behind England's Riots

Violence this violence that... I do not see anything in the news about people being hurt. Since when does destroying property constitute violence? That is what insurance is for. Let FIRE pay.

I would be cheering them on if they were burning down the banks. They are are not. They are just teens trying to steal money. Teens are stupid. Their brains are under-developed (yeah, it is science). Their parents should be held accountable.

This would not happen in the United States. Kids know better (they WILL be shot).

I don't know about the UK, but in the US standard homeowners insurance policies would not pay on losses through riots. That is explicitly stated in the policies. Extra riders could be purchased, but are probably uncommon. It is one of the main reasons you cannot just get the heck out and let them go at it. Here, one needs a plan to prevent the looting and destruction of one's home or business in the absence of police control of the streets. We would still suffer the incredible loss of price in an affected neighborhood, but al least some utility would survive and if the neighborhoods is stabilized after the riot, there could be a future.