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  • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

    Originally posted by charliebrown View Post
    Before 2008, I got a good information that GGP was not viable. I bought puts and saw my money get chipped away a little each month waiting for it to go BK. It did blow up but nearly a year after i bought the puts. Going short takes excellent timing and nerves of steel. Instead of collecting a dividend, or interest you pay to hold that position. Even if the price just hovers you lose. I don't really short after this experience.
    On that note, I just woke up to see TSLA up $32+(15%) per share today.

    Pretty wacky roller coaster ride.

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    • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

      Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
      It never fails to amuse just how ridiculously effusive the so called "analysts" can be once they get an idea into their heads. The caption below reminded me of some of the stuff emitted by Mary Meeker (who is now a "venture capitalist" at Kleiner Perkins) and her peers during those heady days in the very late 1990s. "It's not just cars..." sounds a lot like "The internet changes everything...".

      On another thread about Tesla I made an offhand comment a while back about the stock going to $500 before reality finally sets in.

      Analysts are hired by the companies, like Tesla, to write stuff that justifies their "strategic" moves, and generate "the numbers" to support the latest strategy. Once a company has the full weight and backing of the most influential analysts on Wall Street the whole affair takes on the tone of a religious revival meeting. Tesla, a marginal car manufacturer, is now "in position to disrupt industries well beyond the realm of traditional auto manufacturing" (pause here for Hallelujah, we are saved chorus). Some day Tesla might be a widows and orphans short. Before that it might be the long of the decade though. $500 is well within the range of the achievable...

      "...Morgan Stanley, which also is bullish on the stock, is even more ebullient. “We are witnessing the most disruptive intersection of manufacturing, innovation and capital experienced by the auto industry in more than a century,” gushed analyst Adam Jonas in a note. “Tesla may be in position to disrupt industries well beyond the realm of traditional auto manufacturing. It’s not just cars.”..."
      It's all so bloody predictable...
      Tesla Motors Stock Soars After Analyst Upgrades Price Target

      Updated Feb 25th 2014 3:04PM

      Outside of the Dow, Tesla Motors soared 14% to another record high after Morgan Stanley more than doubled its projected price for the stock at $320. Analyst Adam Jonas had this to say in a note to investors:

      "If it can be a leader in commercializing battery packs, investors may never look at Tesla the same way again If Tesla can become the world's low-cost producer in energy storage, we see significant optionality for Tesla to disrupt adjacent industries."

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      • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

        Bedtime entertainment from Bloomberg (highlights mine):

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        • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year



          Batteries 'R Us

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          • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

            Originally posted by don View Post


            Batteries 'R Us
            Hmmmm...doesn't look like the sort of place the 1% with a Model S would shop.

            Maybe they need to hire some Girl Guides to sell cookies out front and generate some walk-in traffic?

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            • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

              Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
              And reports from Japan, meanwhile, have Tesla in talks with Panasonic for a massive lithium ion battery plant that would open in 2017. According to the Nikkei financial newspaper, Panasonic is already signing up local materials makers.
              I don't follow this field much, but do either of these companies have some outstanding battery technology that makes them stand out? Even giving Tesla the benefit of the doubt that they can be the next big battery supplier, what's separating them from the other companies in the industry?

              Comment


              • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

                Originally posted by Lasher View Post
                I don't follow this field much, but do either of these companies have some outstanding battery technology that makes them stand out? Even giving Tesla the benefit of the doubt that they can be the next big battery supplier, what's separating them from the other companies in the industry?
                The so called "analysts" like the story?

                Comment


                • Re: Tesla Steps Up Production
                  This is exactly the modus operandi of the dot-com analysts: roping retail investors in at higher and higher levels while the companies concerned massively diluted shareholders leading to an implosion... I cant remember a time apart from Dotcom where price targets were jacked up in this way right before a capital raising.



                  Tesla has just announced it intends to issue a $1.6 billion convertible note offering "for the development of a "Gigafactory" and a "Gen III" vehicle." While not that unusual - and of course, why not take advantage of low cost financing and a surging momentum in your stock - what we did find at least intriguing was the underwriters included Morgan Stanley. This is the same firm (though we would be very sure that Chinese walls ensured total lack of knowledge) that doubled their price target (from $153 to $320) for TSLA yesterday (following the analyst's now almost clairvoyant questions during the earnings conference call). Paging Henry Blodgett?
                  Four things jump out at us...

                  1. During the recent conference call, MS analyst Adam Jonas seems to be advancing the idea of a capital raising for this battery factory on the behalf of Musk, who just agrees with the concept...


                  Adam Jonas:
                  Elon, the stock price and the results have been obviously performing very well lately. You’ve got some great investment opportunities and some growth opportunities ahead of you, not only in the auto business but also in the non-auto business and the battery business. So I’m just wondering, how are you thinking about being opportunistic and pulling in some fresh capital to help derisk the plan, plan for a force majeure, or to see some of these opportunities that you have.

                  Elon Musk: Yes, I think that’s a good idea. I agree with that. I think that would be the smart move. We can talk more about that next week with — and also discuss the Gigafactory plans. Unfortunately, I can’t say anything [indiscernible] right now, except that I agree. I think your advice is good.

                  Adam Jonas: Okay. And I don’t want to follow up [ph] or anything, but as a follow-up to that, I guess, is a — would a capital raising be a prerequisite to launch the Gigafactory? Or is that an understatement?

                  Elon Musk: I think it’s necessary to have it occur in 3 years. It’s not necessary if we allow that time frame to expand.

                  2. Morgan Stanley raises their price target for TSLA by over 100%


                  January 25: Raising our price target to $320 from $153 previously.
                  We understand the change to our fair valuation of TSLA shares is significant – more than $13bn on a fully diluted share count of 142m.

                  This magnitude of value attribution is equivalent to an additional $1.7bn of after tax free cash flow by 2020, growing at 5% with a 12% discount rate. A $1.7bn NOPAT number is enormous within the scope of Tesla’s existing business path (our current forecasts call for $0.8bn of net income by 2015 and $2.1bn by 2020).

                  However, from the perspective of a global auto industry (>100 million annual unit sales and >$2 trillion of revenues by 2020) or a global electric utility industry (0.7 billion households combined in US + Europe + China out of households 1.4 billion globally) it is a tiny number. Our previous forecast of 500k complete TSLA vehicles by 2028 would account for 40bps of global market share.

                  Successful? Yes. Disruptive? Not really at all.


                  3. Day after Stock soars $60, Morgan Stanley underwrites a huge convertible note issue for TSLA (implicitly reducing an dilution via the stock ramp).



                  Tesla announced today an offering of $1.6 billion aggregate principal amount of convertible senior notes in an underwritten registered public offering. Of the total offering, Tesla will offer $800 million aggregate principal amount of convertible senior notes due 2019 and $800 million aggregate principal amount of convertible senior notes due 2021. In addition, Tesla intends to grant the underwriters a 30-day option to purchase up to an additional $120 million in aggregate principal amount of convertible senior notes due 2019 and an additional $120 million in aggregate principal amount of convertible senior notes due 2021, for a total potential offering size of up to $1.84 billion.
                  ...
                  Goldman, Sachs & Co., Morgan Stanley, J.P. Morgan and Deutsche Bank Securities are acting as joint book-running managers for the offering.

                  and 4. In the disclosures, of course, Morgan Stanley admitted it would seek compensation from Tesla (which it did)...


                  In the next 3 months, Morgan Stanley expects to receive or intends to seek compensation for investment banking services from Autoliv, Avis Budget Group Inc, BorgWarner Inc., Dana Holding Corp., Delphi Automotive PLC, Ford Motor Company, General Motors Company, Goodyear Tire & Rubber Company, Hertz Global Holdings Inc, Johnson Controls, Inc., Lear Corporation, Magna International Inc., Tenneco Inc., Tesla Motors Inc., TRW Automotive Holdings Corp.


                  As long as CNBC (and everyone else in the status quo hugging mainstream media) keeps pumping every word from the sell-side as gospel, this will never end...

                  While we are sure this is a mere coincidence and that sell-side research which absolutely cannot pay its own way has learned its lessons, as one smart chap wrote us...

                  from zerocred

                  Comment


                  • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

                    Originally posted by Lasher View Post
                    I don't follow this field much, but do either of these companies have some outstanding battery technology that makes them stand out? Even giving Tesla the benefit of the doubt that they can be the next big battery supplier, what's separating them from the other companies in the industry?
                    I find yours a very good question. Where shall they get the lithium from?
                    What about today batteries producers?
                    Yours is a very simple yet important unanswered question

                    Comment


                    • Re: Tesla Steps Up Production

                      Originally posted by ZeroHedge
                      tesla has just announced it intends to issue a $1.6 billion convertible note offering "for the development of a "gigafactory" and a "gen iii" vehicle." while not that unusual - and of course, why not take advantage of low cost financing and a surging momentum in your stock - what we did find at least intriguing was the underwriters included morgan stanley. This is the same firm (though we would be very sure that chinese walls ensured total lack of knowledge) that doubled their price target (from $153 to $320) for tsla yesterday (following the analyst's now almost clairvoyant questions during the earnings conference call).
                      Has Tesla floated all of their shares since their IPO? If not, wouldn't it be better to sell shares of stock they're still holding rather than issuing a note?

                      Comment


                      • Re: The Tesla battery swap is the hoax of the year

                        Originally posted by Southernguy View Post
                        I find yours a very good question. Where shall they get the lithium from?
                        Uyuni Salt Flats in Bolivia: The largest mirror in the world.

                        Could the town of Potosi (close to the salt flats) once again become a top 5 largest city in the world after the Spanish exploited its silver and gold hoard? Probably not but fun to think about the "Saudi Arabia of Lithium."

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