Surviving the Economic Collapse

[grapejelly]

Fernando "Ferfal" Aguirre has written a terrific survival guide "based upon first hand experience of the 2001 economic collapse in Argentina."

It is loaded with spelling mistakes and almost stream of consciousness writing. But I dare you to pick it up anywhere and stop reading.

It's a great read.

Some of his conclusions fly in the face of conventional wisdom. He makes some great points.

1. The country is more dangerous than the city in a collapse. The country is too isolated and hard to protect and vulnerable to crime. In urban neighborhoods neighbors can protect each other or pay for security more readily, and police can assist.

2. The center of the city is better than the 'burbs, so long as they aren't the run down center. People want to move into the center because of jobs, and the lack of affordable transportation.

3. A shotgun is not as good as a handgun. It is clumsy to maneuver and its lack of concealment is a real bummer.

4. It is important to have PMs but junk jewelry is most valuable as would be junk silver in the US. You want to be the guy or gal who is hawking a bit of the family jewelry, wedding ring, or length of gold chain, rather than the rich guy with gold coins.

A lot of other stuff in here that is very worthwhile if you believe in SHTF scenarios at all.

[swgprop]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

Fernando "Ferfal" Aguirre has written a terrific survival guide "based upon first hand experience of the 2001 economic collapse in Argentina."

...

A lot of other stuff in here that is very worthwhile if you believe in SHTF scenarios at all.

Yes definitely worth a read, here is the link.

[wayiwalk]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

Fernando "Ferfal" Aguirre has written a terrific survival guide "based upon first hand experience of the 2001 economic collapse in Argentina."

It is loaded with spelling mistakes and almost stream of consciousness writing. But I dare you to pick it up anywhere and stop reading.

It's a great read.

Some of his conclusions fly in the face of conventional wisdom. He makes some great points.

1. The country is more dangerous than the city in a collapse. The country is too isolated and hard to protect and vulnerable to crime. In urban neighborhoods neighbors can protect each other or pay for security more readily, and police can assist.

2. The center of the city is better than the 'burbs, so long as they aren't the run down center. People want to move into the center because of jobs, and the lack of affordable transportation.

3. A shotgun is not as good as a handgun. It is clumsy to maneuver and its lack of concealment is a real bummer.

4. It is important to have PMs but junk jewelry is most valuable as would be junk silver in the US. You want to be the guy or gal who is hawking a bit of the family jewelry, wedding ring, or length of gold chain, rather than the rich guy with gold coins.

A lot of other stuff in here that is very worthwhile if you believe in SHTF scenarios at all.

Do you have a link? I've got doomster friends that are weighing the alternatives; the biggest factor for safety is the breakdown of law enforcement relative to the ease/risk perceived by criminals to succeed.

I had thought that the gold chain/link-by-link approach made sense until I heard that a lot of jewelry is not at the gold content that is claimed, even by reputable (large brand name dept stores) sources.

[wayiwalk]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

Do you have a link? I've got doomster friends that are weighing the alternatives; the biggest factor for safety is the breakdown of law enforcement relative to the ease/risk perceived by criminals to succeed.

I had thought that the gold chain/link-by-link approach made sense until I heard that a lot of jewelry is not at the gold content that is claimed, even by reputable (large brand name dept stores) sources.

Thanks for the link....

[Fiat Currency]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

I had thought that the gold chain/link-by-link approach made sense until I heard that a lot of jewelry is not at the gold content that is claimed, even by reputable (large brand name dept stores) sources.

Not to give away all my secrets but ... you can buy a roll of jeweller's gold wire (18-24K) and a small scale. Just cut off the appropriate amount. Easy as pie. I think even kitco sells them.

[WDCRob]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

I believe Ferfal has posted here before, no?

ETA: nope - but his blog has been referenced several times...

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/

[jneal3]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

I think Detroit has elements of a local SHTF scenario currently, 30% unemployment being the primary element. And the political leaders are getting concealed weapons permits...

[pianodoctor]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

I hate to go down the road of fantasizing about utter societal collapse in the U.S., but have to admit there is at least a slight possibility it could happen.

I just wanted to add a little personal experience, as a U.S. collapse would of course have U.S. characteristics as opposed to being a duplicate of the Argentinian's experience.

I lived in the worst-hit area of Hurricane Andrew, south of Miami. I lived in a middle-lower-middle class neighborhood that had poorer neighborhoods on its borders. Crime was a fairly common occurrence in the region.

All houses were heavily damaged if not destroyed by the hurricane. Home security was not possible because of the loss of windows at a minimum, and often doors as well. There was no electricity or streetlights for weeks, no police presence, and often no phone service. Many roads were unpassable except on foot, due to downed trees.

Immediately after the storm and for the next couple nights, roving people looked for looting opportunities. General awareness of this spread quickly. Neighborhood people quickly adopted the practice of painting a crude, hand-painted warning on the front of their houses "YOU LOOT, WE SHOOT!"

The first couple nights you could occasionally hear a shot ring out in the dark, but after that the looting problem seemed to just go away.

The way I view it is the looters were the ones at the disadvantage. They were the ones walking around exposed, whereas the homeowners were waiting, armed and out of sight in their dark houses in which the lack of windows made for very good hearing of anyone walking around outside. And they were ready to use their guns. Once the looters comprehended this, they thought better of their plan.

So the problem went away and I'm not aware of any dead bodies being produced in the process. Though perhaps a couple near misses went down. I'll never know.

I offer the above for whatever it is worth. Of course "your mileage may vary".

[Jay]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

Not to give away all my secrets but ... you can buy a roll of jeweller's gold wire (18-24K) and a small scale. Just cut off the appropriate amount. Easy as pie. I think even kitco sells them.

If it gets this bad silver works well too for the small items.

[Starving Steve]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

Stealing the copper roof of the old train depot in Detroit, during the dark of night, to salvage for old copper is a crime which marks a new low in urban degeneracy.

If Detroit's capers were not enough, a couple of weeks ago, a bronze funeral urn containing the ashes of an American war hero, who died in Afganistan, was stolen from the back of a hearse. This urn, like the roof in Detroit, apparently was taken for its copper melt-value. The urn was to have been buried at Arlington National Cemetery in Washington, D.C, but the urn disappeared en-route to the cemetery.

The burial at Arlington did proceed, but there were no remains of the soldier to bury; both urn and ashes had disappeared.... Copper closed to-day on the COMEX for $3.22 per pound.

[metalman]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

good threads on survival stuff, including the argentina guy's stuff posted here in 2007... only one i could find...

I'm seriously spooked and switching to preparations

[thriftyandboringinohio]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

good threads on survival stuff, including the argentina guy's stuff posted here in 2007... only one i could find...

I'm seriously spooked and switching to preparations

Metalman, you are a marvel. Have you actually committed to memory every posting on every thread at iTulip?

[Anon21456]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

I've been following his blog for more than a year It's a great read !

[hayekvindicated]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

If you have money, why would you hang around for things to get that bad? makes no sense to me.

There are a whole lot of countries that one can escape to. Sitting around in your house with a gun sounds like a lot of fun to survivalists and doomsters but it doesn't appeal to me.

I also don't think that American cities will be the place to be if things start to go belly up. Ethnic gangs will form and riots will break out. The first human instinct when things get bad is to seek security among one's own "group". Multiculturalism is a "wonderful" idea in boom times. When things get bad, it doesn't sound so swell any more.

[grapejelly]

Re: Surviving the Economic Collapse

If you have money, why would you hang around for things to get that bad? makes no sense to me.

There are a whole lot of countries that one can escape to. Sitting around in your house with a gun sounds like a lot of fun to survivalists and doomsters but it doesn't appeal to me.

I also don't think that American cities will be the place to be if things start to go belly up. Ethnic gangs will form and riots will break out. The first human instinct when things get bad is to seek security among one's own "group". Multiculturalism is a "wonderful" idea in boom times. When things get bad, it doesn't sound so swell any more.

Now that I've thought about this, I don't agree. The affluent parts of major cities will be quite safe. That is one thing you can be sure of. That doesn't mean there won't be a lot more crime, or some riots. But they will be contained. Cities with strong gun rights are going to be fine. I am not sure I'd want to be in NYC or Chicago, although Manhattan and downtown Chicago should be fine near, say, The Loop.