Can anything be done now?

[Master Shake]

Re: Can anything be done now?

It's too late to prevent the depression.

You're in it.

Some observations from another Canadian watching the situation from this side of the border, courtesy of Barry Ritholtz's blog:

“We feel like this market still has some room to move higher,” said Burt White, chief investment officer at LPL Financial in Boston, which oversees $259 billion. “We’re still at levels that are lower than we were before Lehman Brothers. We are vastly better off than we were then.”

Are we really “vastly better off than we were then?” Gluskin Sheff’s David Rosenberg looks at the details and concludes not one tiny bit:

Since Lehman, we have lost 6.2 million jobs;

The unemployment rate is 10.2% now, versus 6.2% the day before Lehman collapse;

Real gross domestic product is still down 3% since the summer of 2008;

Housing starts are down 30%;

Auto sales are down 23%;

Bank credit has contracted by $500 billion, or 8%;

Household net worth is down $7 trillion;

Home prices are down an average of 10%;

Office-vacancy rates are up 3.5 percentage points, to 17.2%;

Apartment-vacancy rates are up a percentage point to 11.1%;

Consumer confidence is down 11 points;

The budget deficit has tripled;

If this is “vastly better off,” I shudder to think what “worse off” would look like...

Meantime we Canadians continue to act like idiots, hold interest rates at record lows, expanding consumer credit at an 8% annual rate, inflating an already overpriced national housing market, and doing everything we can to learn nothing from the experience of our American cousins. Ohhhhh Canada...:p

Perhaps we need a Warren Harding up here, before it's too late?

At some point, we're going to have to pay the piper. All we've done so far (and what the Keynesians/FDR aficionados seem to propose) is kick the can farther down the road, where the great reckoning will be even worse.

[D-Mack]

Re: Can anything be done now?

I bet a lot agree with him on "government not run by the financial sector"
http://www.itulip.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13050

[Crazyfingers]

Re: Can anything be done now?

Nice find! Heck this guy even supports Ron Paul on Auditing the Fed!

How come so many here are so bitter with this article? Even EJ himself thought we needed a huge investment in green technology/infrastructure to pull us out of this mess. Something about the only thing worse than another bubble is no bubble. He even wrote some article in Harpers Mag about it.

Of course it didnt happen and the crooks used the stimulus to save themselves. So lets fire them, maybe even arrest some and throw out another stimulus that puts people back to work. What the hell is so wrong with that? Tax holiday, gov spending on putting folks back to work doing something meaningful, fire some crooks, enforce laws.

Geez man whats so bad about putting people back to work doing something constructive, so folks will have earnings to buy good and services from entreprenuers. These policies brought us our highways, telephone lines, locks and damns, bridges, etc. All useful for individuals and businesses! Which allowed folks to earn a living and companies to innovate. It beats the hell out of giving our tax dollars to banks so they can LEND it back to us! How stupid was that?

Just seems like suicide to try and balance the damn budget when people are starving. Only the crooks that stole the money benefit from that, everyone else loses their jobs, homes, business, and dignity. When the bubble busted was when we needed Harding to let the scoundrels fall, instead we bailed them out and let everyone else rot.

Unfortunately our Government has been hijacked by crooks with most of the politicians and media on the take.

What a mess.

[rjwjr]

Re: Can anything be done now?

Wasn't ridiculing you at all. I just take issue with the conventional wisdom that FDR's New Deal policies shortened the Great Depression. Consider the Depression that never happened because of Harding's policies as perhaps an example more worthy of our interest than the same tired FDR as savior theme. Dr. Paul would certainly be more in tune with Harding than FDR.

http://www.dailypaul.com/node/111383

"some cat on the internet?" Did you hang out with the Rat Pack?

For what it's worth, I loved that Harding article. When someone first posted it a couple weeks ago or so, I printed it. I have read it 3 times since. I'd be very satisfied giving the Harding "solution" a try. The New Deal...not so much. As for it being too late for the Harding solution...no activity (closer to Harding's reaction) is better than more of the wrong activities (Bush/Obama reactions) in my opinion.

I like the Andrew Jackson (Abe Lincoln, John F Kennedy) solution, too. Come to think of it, that's pretty much the Ron Paul solution, ain't it?!

As for the comment by Burt White saying we're better off than before Lehman, he likely means the financial industry and executive bonuses.;)

[leegs]

Re: Can anything be done now?

IMHO what ended the depression was a big ass war that blew up half the world. Then we had to rebuild it with a smaller population. I would rather not go that route again.

FWIW, I don't think 'smaller population' had anything to do with it. World population in 1940 was about 2.3 billion, and by 1950 it was 2.5 billion, with total killed in WW2 of about 75 million.

[raja]

Re: Can anything be done now?

Lots of talk about what should happen . . . .

Aren't you guys ready to DO SOMETHING yourselves?

Our world is collapsing around us.
We're being forced into serfdom by the financial elite.
But no one is talking about what WE can do about it.

Waiting for divine intervention . . . or what? :eek:

[Rajiv]

Re: Can anything be done now?

I think suffering from "Sleep Paralysis"

Physiologically, sleep paralysis is closely related to the paralysis that occurs as a natural part of REM (rapid eye movement) sleep, which is known as REM atonia. Sleep paralysis occurs when the brain awakes from a REM state, but the body paralysis persists. This leaves the person fully conscious, but unable to move. The paralysis can last from several seconds to several minutes "after which the individual may experience panic symptoms and the realization that the distorted perceptions were false".[5] As the correlation with REM sleep suggests, the paralysis is not entirely complete; use of EOG traces shows that eye movement can be instigated during such episodes.[6] When there is an absence of narcolepsy, sleep paralysis is referred to as isolated sleep paralysis (ISP).[7]

In addition, the paralysis state may be accompanied by terrifying hallucinations (hypnopompic or hypnagogic) and an acute sense of danger.[8] Sleep paralysis is particularly frightening to the individual because of the vividness of such hallucinations.[7] The hallucinatory element to sleep paralysis makes it even more likely that someone will interpret the experience as a dream, since completely fanciful, or dream-like, objects may appear in the room alongside one's normal vision.

[Crazyfingers]

Re: Can anything be done now?

"The few who understand the system will be so interested in its profits, the rest so dependent on it's favors, that there will be no opposition from either class." -Rothschild Brothers of London, 1863

Raja, this quote pretty much sums up what the majority are doing right now.

The unemployed are thankful for their benefits and the ones that profited from the last 30 years of booms n busts are trying to hold on to it.

All the time distracted by the wormtongue's

Divide and conquer at its finest...

Capital must protect itself in every possible manner by combination and legislation. Debts must be collected, bonds and mortgages must be foreclosed as rapidly as possible. When, through a process of law, the common people lose their homes they will become more docile and more easily governed through the influence of the strong arm of government, applied by a central power of wealth under control of leading financiers. This truth is well known among our principal men now engaged in forming an imperialism of Capital to govern the world. By dividing voters through the political party system, we get them to expend energies fighting over questions of no importance. Thus by discreet action we can secure for ourselves what has been so well planned and successfully accomplished. ~Aug. 25, 1924 USA Banker's Magazine

[rjwjr]

Re: Can anything be done now?

Lots of talk about what should happen . . . .

Aren't you guys ready to DO SOMETHING yourselves?

Our world is collapsing around us.
We're being forced into serfdom by the financial elite.
But no one is talking about what WE can do about it.

Waiting for divine intervention . . . or what? :eek:

Whereas your post was a real to do list and action plan.

In our defense, we are taking actions to protect us and our loved ones by trying to protect our assets. At least we're taking some personal responsibility, if not any external action...yet.

[ricket]

Re: Can anything be done now?

Lots of talk about what should happen . . . .

Aren't you guys ready to DO SOMETHING yourselves?

Our world is collapsing around us.
We're being forced into serfdom by the financial elite.
But no one is talking about what WE can do about it.

Waiting for divine intervention . . . or what? :eek:

"The revolution will *not* be televised" does in fact have multiple meanings ;)

[BadJuju]

Re: Can anything be done now?

Lots of talk about what should happen . . . .

Aren't you guys ready to DO SOMETHING yourselves?

Our world is collapsing around us.
We're being forced into serfdom by the financial elite.
But no one is talking about what WE can do about it.

Waiting for divine intervention . . . or what? :eek:

It is a very uphill battle. We are facing institutions that are so entrenched in people's minds that they are natural to them. And these institutions have the backing of countless millions and numerous resources.

The best thing I think you can do is get involved in local politics. It is the most malleable part of the system. Right now, I am just trying to get situated and then I am going to try to do precisely that.

[raja]

Re: Can anything be done now?

"The few who understand the system will be so interested in its profits, the rest so dependent on it's favors, that there will be no opposition from either class." -Rothschild Brothers of London, 1863

Raja, this quote pretty much sums up what the majority are doing right now.

If I were looking for an excuse to do nothing, that would be a good one.

Perhaps what the Rothschilds said was true in 1863, but it's not now. With the rise of the internet and a relatively educated public, it's a whole different ball game. I've been talking to folks here in rural Tennessee, and they feel that they would get more and have a better life if the financial elite weren't ripping them off . . . and they are getting mad. Even some in the MSM (Dylan Radigan, for one) are calling this the greatest theft in history.

rjwjr:
In our defense, we are taking actions to protect us and our loved ones by trying to protect our assets. At least we're taking some personal responsibility, if not any external action...yet.

I think most of us understand that there are multiple very serious economic threats out there, and the end result could possibly be catastrophic. You may think you are protecting your family, and you may be IF things don't get too bad. But consider these possibilities:

1. The gov't seeks revenue wherever it can find it as the debt continues to grow. Driven by populist fervor and a desire to save their own necks, politicians enact a 70% gold profits tax against the "wealthy speculators". Of course, this dampens gold sales and reduces future income from profit taxes . . . but would we be surprised if the gov't failed to look beyond the short-term benefit?

2. The gov't decides to create a "new dollar", and claims that gold is "distorting" the market and jeopardizing "social stability", so personal ownership of gold is outlawed and personally held gold is confiscated. The gov't's real motivation is to the add to its gold coffers to give the "new dollar" some international legitimacy by partially backing it with gold.

3. As the depression worsens and crime rises, frustrated, angry and destitute people who have been accustomed to a middle-class lifestyle start striking out at anyone who is perceived as rich. Some of them will really go nuts. In the wealthier neighbors, we'll see rocks through car and house windows, robberies, and worse. A gated community will not protect the rich.

4. If there is a hyperinflation, your business could fail, along with many others, putting a big dent in your financial outlook. There could be a real breakdown in the fabric of society. The government may nationalize the food industry and issue food and gas ration cards, which would put a crimp in our lifestyles.

The inequality of wealth and the looting by the financial elite must be dealt with at the systemic level, and that will only occur through political action and educating the masses. If you really want to protect your family, I suggest you do more than just try to ensure your own family's well being.

rjwjr:
Whereas your post was a real to do list and action plan.

I have repeatedly posted those things that I am doing.
I try to restrain from doing it too much, because those who are not inspired to action will probably just turn off from the repetition, and see anything I say as discredited. Being a nag is self-defeating.

One thing I've added to my repertoire is passing out copies of the Chris Martenson Crash Course (thanks, Rajiv). This is an amazing tool for educating less economically savvy people, and I learned quite a few things from it myself. I highly recommend it to everyone.

If you go to his website, you can watch it for free -- www.chrismartenson.com. There are also instructions on how to download the Crash Course to a DVD.

[raja]

Re: Can anything be done now?

An iTulip member sent me a private message asking what I am doing about the economic crisis. After I wrote up the answer, I figured I might as well post it here . . . again:

1) I call my 2 Senators and 1 Representative anytime I see some economic news that I think is outrageous.
I tell them that it is their job to protect us, and they are doing a lousy job at it. If they don't do such-and-such (a list of things I see that need correcting), I will not vote for them and will encourage everyone I know to do the same.

2) I also email them, just so they have my protests in writing.

3) I canceled my bank account with a big bank (Wachovia) and switched to a small local bank.
I'm not going to give the thieves my money to gamble with.

4) I canceled my credit cards with big banks.
That will cost me $500 a year in lost "cash rewards" -- I'm willing to sacrifice this to bring about reform. I now use a debit card from my small local bank.

5) I regularly email my friends with economic news. I encourage them to spread the word and take action.

6) I give away Chris Martenson's Crash Course (a freely downloaded DVD) to anyone who seems interested (www.chrismartenson.com).

7) I talk about the economy with those I meet in my daily activities: store owners, clerks . . . everyone.
Most people are very receptive. I tell them not to get distracted by party politics -- this is a battle against the Financial Elite and their political enablers from both parties.

8) I read about economics everyday. My main source is iTulip, which of course leads me to many other sources. I also read Chris Martenson, Global Perspectives, Krugman's blog, Bloomberg and Google News. I watch ABC Evening News daily for the MSM perspective.

9) I'm working on a 1-page information sheet that I can hand out to people I meet. It will have a brief description of the cause of the economic crisis, and some ideas about what the "average" person can do personally to bring about reform.
It starts off:

* 1 in 10 Americans are officially unemployed. But including all forms of unemployed and underemployed, the rate is 17.5%. That's almost 1 in 5 out-of-work Americans . . . and the number is rising.

* More than one in every 136 U.S. homes is in foreclosure, and the number is steadily growing.

* The U.S. is over $50 trillion in debt. (To get an idea of how much this is -- million dollars is a stack of $1000 bills 4 inches high . . . a trillion dollars is a stack of $1000 bills over 67 miles high.)

* So far, more than $11 trillion has been promised by the government for economic stimulus efforts. Where will they try and get that money? From you, in the form of higher taxes, fewer services, reduced social security and medicare benefits, etc.

* The government has given $645 billion of taxpayer money to banks and other failed institutions. While Americans are losing jobs and homes in record numbers, the three biggest U.S. banks will pay about $30 billion in bonuses this year.

The Financial Elite is stealing the our money, jobs, homes, and savings. Dylan Radigan of MSNBC has call the economic crisis the "greatest theft in the history of humankind."

Are you going to let the Big Bankers and Wall Street Gamblers steal your life out from under you without a fight . . . or are you going to act to stop them? Here's what you can do . . . .

What will you do?