Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

[c1ue]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

This Gavin person does a great job of showing how retarded these anti-global warming retards really are -

You mean this Gavin?:

Anyway, I wanted you guys to know that you're free to use RC [RealClimate for which both Mann and Gavin Schmidt are 'disinterested scientists'] in any way you think would be helpful. Gavin and I are going to be careful about what comments we screen through, and we'll be very careful to answer any questions that come up to any extent we can. On the other hand, you might want to visit the thread and post replies yourself. We can hold comments up in the queue and contact you about whether or not you think they should be screened through or not, and if so, any comments you'd like us to include.

I also like how Mr. Schmidt was able to say - categorically -

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/11/climate-hack

Gavin Schmidt, a research scientist with NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies, says the e-mails offer no damning indictment of climate researchers, and that bloggers are reading information in them out of context.
“There’s nothing in the e-mails that shows that global warming is a hoax,” he told Threat Level. “There’s no funding by nefarious groups. There’s no politics in any of these things; nobody from the [United Nations] telling people what to do. There’s nothing hidden, no manipulation.

Given that the emails had been available for less than 1 day at the time.

I guess he must be a world record speed reader to have gone through all 61 Megabytes (compressed) and 150+ megabytes (uncompressed) in that time.

Or maybe he's just a mouth for the AGW cardinalia.

[WDCRob]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Given that the emails had been available for less than 1 day at the time.

I guess he must be a world record speed reader to have gone through all 61 Megabytes (compressed) and 150+ megabytes (uncompressed) in that time.

Or maybe he's just a mouth for the AGW cardinalia.

One of the great benefits of telling the truth is never having to worry that someone is going to catch you in a lie.

[Mashuri]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Something all you pro-AGW fundamentalists will need to accept now is that this expose kills the credibility of the AGW movement, no matter what damage control Gavin attempts. Since they refuse to release their raw data for verification and proof of their conclusions, they've made their case stand on credibility alone. The ONLY way they'll get that credibility back is by releasing ALL their data and source code for others to scrutinize. How much you want to bet they don't do it?

[Mashuri]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

One of the great benefits of telling the truth is never having to worry that someone is going to catch you in a lie.

Yeah, it's the half-truths and omissions that will bite you in the ass.

[c1ue]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

One of the great benefits of telling the truth is never having to worry that someone is going to catch you in a lie.

Quite true.

And given the omissions, obstructions, machinations, and incompetency demonstrated in the CRU files - what is the truth?

:rolleyes:

[BigLandbaron]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

FINALLY - Inhofe Announces Climategate Investigation on Fox News

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1qa9...layer_embedded#

[t12357]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

FINALLY - Inhofe Announces Climategate Investigation on Fox News

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1qa9...layer_embedded#

Great, look for a dog and pony show and a whitewash at the end, a la 9-11 commission.

More or less like asking goldman sachs and the other big dogs to regulate themselves and cut their high bonuses.

[Diarmuid]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Great, look for a dog and pony show and a whitewash at the end, a la 9-11 commission.

More or less like asking goldman sachs and the other big dogs to regulate themselves and cut their high bonuses.

Goldman and the other investment cowboys are showing a lot of interest in the Carbon Credits, the so called AGW solution, wonder why that would be? :rolleyes:. I personally would like to see some debate on the so called solutions to AGW, this is practically non existent - I wonder will the Carbon Credits really offset Climate Change or will it just move the carbon emissions to low cost countries, the solution to me sounds as bad as the perceived, invented or real threat? My personal opinion is, when I see the solution and ask the question Cui Bono - I get the answer not the environment, not I or my kin but the same bandits who have brought the shit storm we now find ourselves in. It sets internal alarm bells ringing concerning the whole thesis.

As Matt Taibbi writes:

The new carboncredit market is a virtual repeat of the commodities-market casino that’s been kind to Goldman, except it has one delicious new wrinkle: If the plan goes forward as expected, the rise in prices will be government-mandated. Goldman won’t even have to rig the game. It will be rigged in advance.
Here’s how it works: If the bill passes, there will be limits for coal plants, utilities, natural-gas distributors and numerous other industries on the amount of carbon emissions (a.k.a. greenhouse gases) they can produce per year. If the companies go over their allotment, they will be able to buy “allocations” or credits from other companies that have managed to produce fewer emissions. President Obama conservatively estimates that about $646 billion worth of carbon credits will be auctioned in the first seven years; one of his top economic aides speculates that the real number might be twice or even three times that amount.
The feature of this plan that has special appeal to speculators is that the “cap” on carbon will be continually lowered by the government, which means that carbon credits will become more and more scarce with each passing year. Which means that this is a brand new commodities market where the main commodity to be traded is guaranteed to rise in price over time. The volume of this new market will be upwards of a trillion dollars annually; for comparison’s sake, the annual combined revenues of all electricity suppliers in the U.S. total $320 billion.
Goldman wants this bill. The plan is (1) to get in on the ground floor of paradigmshifting legislation, (2) make sure that they’re the profitmaking slice of that paradigm and (3) make sure the slice is a big slice. Goldman started pushing hard for capandtrade long ago, but things really ramped up last year when the firm spent $3.5 million to lobby climate issues. (One of their lobbyists at the time was none other than Patterson, now Treasury chief of staff.) Back in 2005, when Hank Paulson was chief of Goldman, he personally helped author the bank’s environmental policy, a document that contains some surprising elements for a firm that in all other areas has been consistently opposed to any sort of government regulation. Paulson’s report argued that “voluntary action alone cannot solve the climatechange problem.” A few years later, the bank’s carbon chief, Ken Newcombe, insisted that capandtrade alone won’t be enough to fix the climate problem and called for further public investments in research and development. Which is convenient, considering that Goldman made early investments in wind power (it bought a subsidiary called Horizon Wind Energy), renewable diesel (it is an investor in a firm called Changing World Technologies) and solar power (it partnered with BP Solar), exactly the kind of deals that will prosper if the government forces energy producers to use cleaner energy. As Paulson said at the time, “We’re not making those investments to lose money.”
The bank owns a 10 percent stake in the Chicago Climate Exchange, where the carbon credits will be traded. Moreover, Goldman owns a minority stake in Blue Source LLC, a Utahbased firm that sells carbon credits of the type that will be in great demand if the bill passes. Nobel Prize winner Al Gore, who is intimately involved with the planning of cap-and-trade, started up a company called Generation Investment Management with three former bigwigs from Goldman Sachs Asset Management, David Blood, Mark Ferguson and Peter Harris. Their business? Investing in carbon offsets. There’s also a $500 million Green Growth Fund set up by a Goldmanite to invest in greentech … the list goes on and on. Goldman is ahead of the headlines again, just waiting for someone to make it rain in the right spot. Will this market be bigger than the energyfutures market?

Goldman Sachs: "New Carbon Market Presents Major Opportunity"
A recent Goldman Sachs report on the Waxman-Markey climate bill confirms it would result in one of the largest commodity markets in the world subject to significant speculation and have relatively marginal impacts on the renewable power industry.

---

A Goldman Sachs report on the Waxman-Markey climate bill, recently issued to Goldman Sachs' clients, confirms Breakthrough Institute analysis showing the legislation would result in one of the largest commodity markets in the world subject to significant speculation by financial firms, and would have relatively marginal impacts on the renewable power industry.

Goldman Sachs Buys Into Carbon Offsets

By KATE GALBRAITH

Goldman Sachs has recently bought pieces of two carbon-offset companies, in the latest sign of investment banks’ interest in the area.
On Monday E+Co, a company focused on bringing clean power to developing countries, announced that Goldman had purchased a majority of its carbon-offsets portfolio. In late October, Goldman took a minority stake in BlueSource, which is more focused on the tiny offsets market in the United States, and plans to market BlueSource offsets to clients.
Last December, Goldman also invested in APX, a California company that registers carbon offsets.
“These two deals show Goldman Sachs’ interest in the global carbon market and our commitment to assisting our clients who participate in these markets,” said Michael DuVally, a bank spokesman, in an e-mail message.
Carbon offsets are projects that reduce greenhouse gas emissions — thus potentially counterbalancing a rise in emissions elsewhere. Planting trees are the most obvious offset; but other examples include capturing methane (a potent greenhouse gas) from a coal mine, or undertaking a qualified energy-efficiency project. Offsets are used in the European carbon dioxide cap-and-trade system, but have been slow to catch on in this country, where carbon trading is largely voluntary.




Mr. Ard also pointed out that banks buying into the offsets business could benefit if a federal carbon-trading system took hold in the United States. President-elect Barack Obama favors such a system, but some experts think that the financial crisis will cause Congress to delay passing a cap-and-trade bill.

Below I would say is just for starters, wait till this wealth extraction mechanism kicks into full momentum with binding legal agreements.

Goldman Sachs Sells $12M in Carbon Offsets in Largest Such U.S. Deal So Far



Goldman Sachs marketed $12 million worth of carbon offsets to CE2 Carbon Capital in what Goldman Sachs is calling the largest publicly announced U.S. offset deal so far, reports Reuters.
CE2 Carbon Capital is a U.S. investor and owner of carbon-based assets and commodities.
Goldman Sachs sold the offsets on behalf of Blue Source, a company that generated the offsets from projects aimed at preventing forests from being cut down, as well as carbon capture projects at landfills and coal mines. Goldman Sachs is a minority partner in Blue Source.

[charliebrown]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Hmm, was Robin Hood good or bad? Stealing from an evil king?

If I steal from someone trying to perpretrate an imorall act on someone else it this theft? In the Dugard case, if someone would have trespassed onto the property, took some picutures and sent them to the authorities, things would have worked out much better.

I guess if we get a search warrant or something it would make it more legal, but can david get a search warrant against golliath? In the Dugard case the authorities were definitely equipped to handle it, but If I had access to show the GW is a scam who would I send it too? The police, FBI. The higher ups want GW, cap and trade etc, the data would be
conviently lost, or would take years to get anyone's attention after billions of dollars have been spent (wasted) addressing a problem that doesn't exist. (This is not my opinion that GW doesn't exist only hypothetical for this argument)

To youp point tt would be nice for the "thief" to publish all the data in its entirety so we can make a more informed opinion. Now aday 160MB of data is chump change. Although the line about the university saying that it can't confirm the that material is genuine is rubbish. Give me the server the stolen content and a weekend and I can parse it a million ways and come up with a very good answer of whether the info origninated on their server, and I'm not a linguist. This sounds like major CYA IMHO

[we_are_toast]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Hmm, was Robin Hood good or bad? Stealing from an evil king?

Obviously your analogy is completely incorrect. The proper analogy would be Bernie Madoff, He stole from a bunch of people and then he completely lied about what he stole.

Fortunately, the denier campaign of misinformation and distorted information appears not to be working very well. A washington post poll taken 11/15/09 says 82% of the public believe Global Warming is a serious problem while 17% say it isn't serious. Apparently the pseudoscience wasn't enough to fool even the American public(that's pretty bad), so bumping it up a notch to theft was an option to try and get past the tea-bagger/birther fringe.

[MulaMan]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

You can find answers to all the anti-American talking points being reguritated around the Internet by these retards here:

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php.../the-cru-hack/

"Records show ExxonMobil gave hundreds of thousands of pounds to lobby groups that have published 'misleading and inaccurate information' about climate change"

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...eptics-funding

Most interesting is that as governments invest in alternative engergy then Exxon is done - think whale blubber industry!

Exxon CANNOT reinvent thier business into clean tech, 100% cut out of the action and are DESPERATE.

I would never hold large integrated oil stocks long term. Oil reserves yes.

The same retarded talking points are repeated over and over and over and over and over.....by these same retards yet there is ZERO impact on the facts around climate change.

Nothing is more un-American than to be an ignorant retard unable to think for yourself.

Do these retards really believe in evil scientists? LOL!

How is it possible to be so ignorant? Is it fear of science? seems no different then the "intelligent design" retards - Ha Ha Ha Ha!

Just imagine the poor children of these retards over thanksgiving diner? and you wonder why America is in decline!

[MulaMan]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

FINALLY - Inhofe Announces Climategate Investigation on Fox News

Yes, Inhofe is a very scary, anti-American scumbag - one of the most corrupt scumbags in congress. And you wonder why America is in decline.

"The contributions Inhofe has received from the energy and natural resource sector since taking office have exceeded one million dollars."

The scumbag needs to go in the next mid-terms.

Here is a great article that exposes his lies:

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php...enator-inhofe/

[c1ue]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Fortunately, the denier campaign of misinformation and distorted information appears not to be working very well. A washington post poll taken 11/15/09 says 82% of the public believe Global Warming is a serious problem while 17% say it isn't serious. Apparently the pseudoscience wasn't enough to fool even the American public(that's pretty bad), so bumping it up a notch to theft was an option to try and get past the tea-bagger/birther fringe.

As always, a failure to provide context to statements.

Here is the actual poll data and the questions used:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv...T2009112403099

40. On another subject, you may have heard about the idea that the world's temperature may have been going up slowly over the past 100 years. What is your personal opinion on this - do you think this has probably been happening, or do you think it probably has not been happening?
	Has been happening	Has not been happening	No opinion
11/15/2009	72	26	2
7/28/2008	80	18	2
4/10/2007	84	13	3
3/14/2006	85	13	2
2/13/98*	80	18	2
10/5/97*	76	22	2
*Ohio State University poll
41. (IF GLOBAL WARMING HAPPENING) How serious of a problem do you think global warming is right now: very serious, somewhat serious, not so serious or not serious at all?
------ Serious ------ ----- Not serious -------
	NET	Very	Somewhat	NET	Not so	Not at all	No opinion
11/15/2009	82	44	38	17	11	6	*
7/28/2008	84	38	46	15	10	5	1
42. There's a proposed system called "cap and trade." The government would issue permits limiting the amount of greenhouse gases companies can put out. Companies that did not use all their permits could sell them to other companies. The idea is that many companies would find ways to put out less greenhouse gases, because that would be cheaper than buying permits. Would you support or oppose this system?
	Support	Oppose
11/15/2009	53	42	5
8/17/2009	52	43	6
6/21/2009	52	42	6
7/28/2008	59	34	7

Given the above questions - I'd answer yes to the first two, and no to the third.

Notice no mention whatsoever of CO2 causing global warming nor mention of Anthropogenic Global Warming.

And also notice the numbers are going the opposite direction even to the generic statement of warming: apparently the deniers are having an effect despite the 'settled science'.

More importantly, the last poll date is BEFORE the CRU revelations - CRU data came to light on 11/19 and 11/20 - many days after this poll was conducted.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the next poll.

[Diarmuid]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Nothing is more un-American than to be an ignorant retard unable to think for yourself.



How is it possible to be so ignorant?
Just imagine the poor children of these retards over thanksgiving diner? and you wonder why America is in decline!

Opps dont look in the mirror - might find one staring back at you, to boot this one will be rude, arrogant and uncouth.

[MulaMan]

Re: Global Warming Scam Uncovered by Hacker

Being a retard and spreading ignorance is the greatest threat to democracy, freedom, and liberty and hence is 100% anti-American.

Spreading this type ignorance onto your children is even worse.

Here is a collection of sources that debunk all of the Denier myths, lies and distortions with actual science:

http://gristmill.grist.org/skeptics How to talk to Global Warming Skeptic

http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/dn11462 Climate Change: A guide for the perplexed

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2004/12/index/#Responses Response to common contrarian arguments

http://www.nerc.ac.uk/about/consult/debate/climatechange/summary.asp Climate change debate summary

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/corporate/pressoffice/myths/index.html Climate Change Myths

http://scholarsandrogues.wordpress.com/2007/07/23/anti-global-heating-claims-a-reasonably-thorough-debunking/ A Thorough Debunking

Skeptical Science

Debunking the Urban Legends of Climate Change

http://www.logicalscience.com/skeptic_arguments/skeptic-arguments.html

http://environment.newscientist.com/climatemyths

http://www.sierraclub.ca/national/programs/atmosphere-energy/climate-change/ten-myths.html

http://www.desmogblog.com/slamming-the-climate-skeptic-scam

http://royalsociety.org/page.asp?id=6229

http://scholarsandrogues.wordpress.com/2007/07/23/anti-global-heating-claims-a-reasonably-thorough-debunking/#m18

The skeptics, who are they http://www.davidsuzuki.org/Climate_Change/Science/Skeptics.asp http://earthfirst.com/why-youre-a-global-warming-denier/

Who funds them? http://www.enn.com/ecosystems/article/37379 92% of "neutral" Eco-skeptics turn out to be industry shills, http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2006/sep/19/ethicalliving.g2 and http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/campaigns/global-warming-and-energy/exxon-secrets
How did all this come about? see http://www.scienceprogress.org/2008/05/manufacturing-uncertainty/ GLOBAL WARMING
The Truth About Denial http://www.newsweek.com/id/32482

Who is behind climate change deniers? http://www.watoday.com.au/opinion/who-is-behind-climate-change-deniers-20080802-3ou6.html?page=1