400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

[charliebrown]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Thankyou for your excellent posts. We have wandered a bit, but if you are a regular reader you will see that peak - cheap energry is a major theme in the economic and social landscape that I fear will be upon us before I leave the planet. (I'm in my late 40's). Do you have any knowledge of LENR (Cold fusion). This seems to be raising its head again.
Is this just a scam too?

[Chris Coles]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

And just in case someone has a crackpot theory they'd like to take public, an index and scoring methodology have already been developed. My personal favorite: 30 points for claiming that your theories were developed by an extraterrestrial civilization (without good evidence).

http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/crackpot.html

Let me guess, the same list as proposed by those that were certain we would never fly and or never travel in space, hang on a minute, I forgot the flat Earth.... Please, give it a rest, the human race would still live in a cave if you were the final arbiter of the sense of any new thinking. If there is one trait that stands out it is those that cannot cope with the idea of new thinking and can only cast about sufficient negatives to cover up their own inability to think beyond that which is already set out in a school text book. Humbug!

http://www.rexresearch.com/minato/minato.htm#japinc

http://www.rexresearch.com/minato/minato.htm#4751

http://www.rexresearch.com/minato/minato.htm#5594

[ASH]

Maybe thrifty but not boring, thanks. It was nice to see this thread bring out the scientists and engineers. Maybe Ash will start a "Promise of the Hydrino", thread after this one finally dies out...or maybe we need a whole section devoted to crackpot physics...:rolleyes:

Actually, a technical thread devoted to what is and is not possible (according to established physics) in the realm of alternative energy, fuels, engines, etc. might be of some value to the iTulip community, from the standpoint of rating/ranking alt-E investment opportunities.

I'm just getting my feet wet in the realm of exotic photovoltaics at work. My "day job" is to design avalanche photodiodes, but the company also has a chemistry group which is good at synthesizing and surface-functionalizing colloidal nanocrystals -- a.k.a. quantum dots -- that can be used as spectrally-tunable light-in/light-out, electricity-in/light-out, and light-in/electricity-out "pigments". We're assessing the use of these pigments in various roles in photovoltaic cells -- both as spectral down-converters to improve the efficiency of conventional solar cells, and as photovoltaic materials themselves. Since I'm the only real device physicist we've got, I get to do photovoltaic modelling in my "spare" time. Soon I'll be selling snake oil myself! Given your knowledge of the photovoltaic field, I hope you'll lead me from straying into error.

I somehow managed to skip the part of thermodynamics relevant to mechanical engineering in school (it was possible to substitute a course on the statistical mechanics of reaction rate theory for standard thermodynamics, and I did so), so the comments from others about heat engines are much appreciated.

[Beavus]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Mass wins and keeps you alive. Semi Truck Vs. Geo Metro. In the US, cars Vs Trucks is very common.

[santafe2]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Let me guess, the same list as proposed by those that were certain we would never fly and or never travel in space, hang on a minute, I forgot the flat Earth.... Please, give it a rest, the human race would still live in a cave if you were the final arbiter of the sense of any new thinking. If there is one trait that stands out it is those that cannot cope with the idea of new thinking and can only cast about sufficient negatives to cover up their own inability to think beyond that which is already set out in a school text book. Humbug!

Whoa there Chris. I'm not suggesting the luddite way, just having some fun - now back to the lab with you my good man and invent something!

[santafe2]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Actually, a technical thread devoted to what is and is not possible (according to established physics) in the realm of alternative energy, fuels, engines, etc. might be of some value to the iTulip community, from the standpoint of rating/ranking alt-E investment opportunities.

I'm just getting my feet wet in the realm of exotic photovoltaics at work. My "day job" is to design avalanche photodiodes, but the company also has a chemistry group which is good at synthesizing and surface-functionalizing colloidal nanocrystals -- a.k.a. quantum dots -- that can be used as spectrally-tunable light-in/light-out, electricity-in/light-out, and light-in/electricity-out "pigments". We're assessing the use of these pigments in various roles in photovoltaic cells -- both as spectral down-converters to improve the efficiency of conventional solar cells, and as photovoltaic materials themselves. Since I'm the only real device physicist we've got, I get to do photovoltaic modelling in my "spare" time. Soon I'll be selling snake oil myself! Given your knowledge of the photovoltaic field, I hope you'll lead me from straying into error.

I somehow managed to skip the part of thermodynamics relevant to mechanical engineering in school (it was possible to substitute a course on the statistical mechanics of reaction rate theory for standard thermodynamics, and I did so), so the comments from others about heat engines are much appreciated.

Ash, are you familiar with the Very High Efficiency Solar Cell, (VHESC), program being funded by DARPA and DuPont at University of Delaware? This program sounds similar to your research. I can PM contact information if you don't already have it.

[thriftyandboringinohio]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Actually, a technical thread devoted to what is and is not possible (according to established physics) in the realm of alternative energy, fuels, engines, etc. might be of some value to the iTulip community, from the standpoint of rating/ranking alt-E investment opportunities.

I like this idea, ASH. Wind turbines, photovoltaics, batteries for hybrid cars, microgenerators for soldiers -I suspect a few companies are starting in these field that could return many-fold if we can find them and evaluate them.

[ASH]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

http://www.rexresearch.com/minato/minato.htm#japinc

Seriously, Chris -- linking a perpetual motion machine based on permanent magnets?

[Chris Coles]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Seriously, Chris -- linking a perpetual motion machine based on permanent magnets?

Read the full story and you will discover that Minato has designed and manufactures an electric motor that uses only 20% of the input of a conventional motor delivering the same output. Yes, he does seem to have demonstrated an over unity machine, but he does not make any claims. The article is not a PR stunt but instead a level headed report about an inventor that Japan inc. themselves admit was beyond belief. Add to that the US patents that take a while to fully understand, but make sense when given some careful thought.

[Chris Coles]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Whoa there Chris. I'm not suggesting the luddite way, just having some fun - now back to the lab with you my good man and invent something!

Most recently:

US patents; 5,712,679; 6,181,373; 6,469,735. Japan patent: 2896930

I do also have a UK patent application in process that the examiner tells me he could not cite a single document against it at the initial examination and I am waiting for the full examination. That is for a similar subject matter to the Minato motor.

Also; http://www.lrsp.com/b2c.html

[ASH]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Read the full story and you will discover that Minato has designed and manufactures an electric motor that uses only 20% of the input of a conventional motor delivering the same output. Yes, he does seem to have demonstrated an over unity machine, but he does not make any claims. The article is not a PR stunt but instead a level headed report about an inventor that Japan inc. themselves admit was beyond belief. Add to that the US patents that take a while to fully understand, but make sense when given some careful thought.

Next we move to a unit with its motor connected to a generator. What we see is striking. The meters showed an input to the stator electromagnets of approximately 1.8 volts and 150mA input, and from the generator, 9.144 volts and 192mA output. 1.8 x 0.15 x 2 = 540mW input and 9.144 x 0.192 = 1.755W out.

Well over unity, it seems! Let me know where I can buy one of these motor/generator pairs mentioned in the article. If it turns out that I can indeed run the motor off the generator, while realizing a 225% surplus of power from the generator, then I promise to be less hidebound about the whole conservation of energy thing.

[Chris Coles]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Next we move to a unit with its motor connected to a generator. What we see is striking. The meters showed an input to the stator electromagnets of approximately 1.8 volts and 150mA input, and from the generator, 9.144 volts and 192mA output. 1.8 x 0.15 x 2 = 540mW input and 9.144 x 0.192 = 1.755W out.

Well over unity, it seems! Let me know where I can buy one of these motor/generator pairs mentioned in the article. If it turns out that I can indeed run the motor off the generator, while realizing a 225% surplus of power from the generator, then I promise to be less hidebound about the whole conservation of energy thing.

Ash, I am in some difficulties here as I have a new book coming out soon, but have a commitment to EJ not to misuse iTulip and sell; I am sure you will understand. For that reason, I am not going to make any other comment.

[ASH]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

Ash, I am in some difficulties here as I have a new book coming out soon, but have a commitment to EJ not to misuse iTulip and sell; I am sure you will understand. For that reason, I am not going to make any other comment.

I quite understand. You have mentioned this book in other threads, in connection to several categories of poorly understood physical phenomena. I wish you every success with your book, and should it clarify these phenomena, I hope the book brings your ideas the recognition they merit.

[jheis]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

There used to be many stories in the Popular Mechanics magazine about inventors of new technology automotive engines that would one day replace the conventional internal combustion engines currently in use. We are still waiting for one of these inventions to work out, and this new engine will not be an exception. A lone inventor will not be able to improve upon the engines that automakers have spent millions of dollars and yen on, unless the inventor has found a way to repeal the laws of physics.

[MarkL]

Re: 400hp, 500ft/lbs...and 110+ MPG?!

This is a scam on so many levels...

First of all, this guy has been claiming this for years in various forms and has never been willing to "prove it" with a gas-in gas-out trip with a major journalist despite multiple requests. I rechecked today and still can't find one.

He didn't even get into the XPrize.... http://www.progressiveautoxprize.org/teams. He did however get tons and tons of press on his way to Las Vegas!

The few people that have attempted to understand this have parsed his words carefully and determined that he's probably intentionally misinterpreting the meaning of the term MPGe to mean "only petroleum products" and thus excluding the ethanol input. Even without that he doesn't claim to get 110 miles per gallon with normal "city driving" or even normal "highway driving." If one doesn't read his website carefully you do get the impression that he's gotten 110 MPGe under city conditions from some areas and 110MPGe under 400HP circumstances under others. But careful reading will see these are SEPARATE claims. In other words, the car is capable of city driving, and capable of utilizing 400HP to go from 0-60 in 3 seconds, and capable under optimal conditions of getting 110MPGe. But not at the same time. In his CNN interview, he verbally only claimed to get 110 MPGe when "driving down the highway under optimal conditions." My personal guess is that means on a severe downhill!

This makes sense... this is a heavy old Mustang with an 8 cylinder engine. These are 8 guys in a garage with no transformative technology save for "better tolerances." There's no braking energy reclaim, no electric assist, no new unique type of engine... there's nothing here except smoke and mirrors.

The Second scam here is that using ethanol actually creates more smog than using regular gas, and the EPA's own attorneys had to admit that fact in front of the justices presiding over the Third Circuit Court of Appeals in 1995 (API v. EPA).

Thirdly, of the 7 independent studies on Ethanol efficiency 6 found the fuel itself to be energy negative and 1 found it to be energy netural. This means that it takes MORE energy to make a gallon of Ethanol than you get from it. At best this could be claimed to be a transport medium, NOT a source of energy. Please note that I use the term "independent" studies. There are a number of studies backed by the ethanol industry that give different results, but on closer inspection one can see they exclude major energy inputs like fertilizer, harvesting costs, or catalyst agents.

There is a reason that despite extensive government subsidies the Ethanol industry is going bankrupt. And this doesn't touch on the increased cost of food we would see if it was utilized as a "fuel source."

CNG is a realistic alternative for cars even in the shorter term. Nuclear is realistic for electric energy and for electric vehicles, but will take a decade even if we get on a crash course. Sadly, "Clean Coal" is a myth despite it being mentioned in the inaugural. Maybe someday it could be realized... but nobody is doing it today, not even in the lab.

I love the theory of Ethanol... but the science doesn't back it up.