What about Ford?

[Ghent12]

Everyone is convinced that GM will go through what Chrysler is doing now, but I haven't heard anything about Ford. Every time I mention Ford, people say, "Well, they didn't need a bailout, so they're okay." I rather doubt that, but I can't find any hard evidence to support that. Won't Ford collapse a few months after GM? Don't they still have all the problems of the other two American companies, but were just in a slightly better position to start with?

Someone with better Google-fu please help!



Edit: Gah, this should probably be in a different forum, but I don't know how to move it.

[GRG55]

Re: What about Ford?

Everyone is convinced that GM will go through what Chrysler is doing now, but I haven't heard anything about Ford. Every time I mention Ford, people say, "Well, they didn't need a bailout, so they're okay." I rather doubt that, but I can't find any hard evidence to support that. Won't Ford collapse a few months after GM? Don't they still have all the problems of the other two American companies, but were just in a slightly better position to start with?

Someone with better Google-fu please help!



Edit: Gah, this should probably be in a different forum, but I don't know how to move it.

Have a look at Ford's balance sheet. That says it all...

The bailouts of Chrysler and GM just perpetuate the maintenance of far too much auto manufacturing capacity...in North America and around the world. Ford is in an unenviable position as a result of these bailouts.

The conventional view of analysts [and the government I suspect] is that US automobile sales cannot remain at current "depressed" levels for very long because "people have to replace their cars". This is a ridiculous bit of nonsense predicated on the assumption that the average fleet age cannot for long deviate from the averages seen in the past decade or so. I don't buy it. Contrary to popular opinion the quality and durability of North American made vehicles is much improved over the 1970s, and all those used SUVs, despite their gas guzzling reputations, are still much, much cheaper to keep on the road than to replace, even if that replacement is more fuel efficient vehicle. In an evironment of 15% to 20% U3 unemployment, I don't have any difficulty imagining the fleet age average increasing, and staying higher for years to come. If Cubans can keep their 1950s Chevrolets and Fords running to this day, Americans should have no difficulty squeezing 15 years or more out of their mid-2000 Yukons, F150s and even their Toyotas, Subarus and Bimmers.

[Judas]

Re: What about Ford?

Ford tried to play it smart, and in a normal capitalist society would be sitting pretty- it's competitors would go bankrupt, it could grab more market share and have less overcapacity to deal with, etc. and it could continue on as a viable domestic car company in a smaller market.

However, the government has decided that all three companies must continue. So the overcapacity will continue, and Ford will have to compete not only against foreign carmakers, but zombie companies as well as it's own federal government.

So yes, Ford is now probably doomed. It's a shame that Obama would rather have three broken, ruined companies than one viable one.

[jtabeb]

Re: What about Ford?

However, the government has decided that all three companies must continue. So the overcapacity will continue, and Ford will have to compete not only against foreign carmakers, but zombie companies as well as it's own federal government.

So yes, Ford is now probably doomed. It's a shame that Obama would rather have three broken, ruined companies than one viable one.

Ah, the TRUE GENIUS of market intervention. Punish the Strong and Prudent for the benefit the Weak and Imprudent. There is a reason you need to act morally in these situations and it's NOT JUST that it is the right thing to do.

The government by it's policies will end up Killing all productivity because if you are strong and prudent it doesn't matter because you just can't compete with a weaker, imprudent competitor that receives and unlimited fire-hose of gov money.

Same damn thing in the banking industry. The gov is KILLING what works (small local and regional banking) to SAVE what doesn't work (Mega Money Center banks).

In the end these policies achieve one thing. They kill all and end-up saving NONE.

Not a good way to formulate economic policy if you ask me.

Ford should be in the cat-bird seat, instead it's sitting on the toilet eating a shit-sandwich because of the polices put in place by the government.

Call me a realist, but paying attention to objective reality PAYS! (literally and figuratively).

Anyway you slice it, this "recovery" is going to be anything but. The only thing the government will succeed in is causing high inflation associated with simultaneous supply collape, not to mention High unemployment that will result in further downward wage pressure. Prices rising, wages declining, input costs rising, supply declining, fixed capital stock declining in value. Absolutely ******* BRILLIANT economic policy!!

(I think it's called "The Worst of ALL WORLDS")

P.S. Forgot to add the BEST part. This is a Globally Syncronized policy decision/implementation. (e.g. Everyone is choosing to follow the WRONG road, not just us).

So think about THAT for a second and you tell me what you think the economic outcome will be.

[flintlock]

Re: What about Ford?

I'm long shit-sandwiches.

[D-Mack]

Re: What about Ford?http://itulip.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=95863

What would happen if they did inspections like in Germany ? How many cars would be taken of the streets?

Watching Pimp my Ride from California, the standards there can't be that high.

TÜV SÜD Prepares to Begin Auto Inspection Activities in Turkey


MUNICH, Germany and ISTANBUL, Turkey, May 10 /PRNewswire/ -- The TÜV SÜD Group will soon begin conducting German-style auto inspections in Turkey. Following an international tendering process, the Turkish Ministry of Finance awarded a 20-year contract for the project to Munich-based TÜV SÜD along with its partners, the Turkish conglomerate DOGUS Group and the AKFEN construction company. The contracts are to be signed in Ankara within a matter of days, subject to clarification of several outstanding matters, including the project's exclusivity and financing modalities. The TÜV SÜD, DOGUS and AKFEN consortium, in which each partner holds a one-third share, will be conducting its auto inspection activities under the aegis of a newly formed company TÜV TURK AG, which is slated to have approximately 190 service centers in operation throughout Turkey by the end of this year, and will also be constructing and outfitting 38 mobile inspection units.

The TÜV stations will conduct auto inspections and exhaust tests and will mainly be operated by franchises. This privatization of auto inspections will result in the creation of 3,000 new jobs in Turkey. The consortium's investment in the Turkish TÜV is expected to total approximately EUR568 million, EUR423 million of which will be expended on franchise and license acquisitions.

"This is the largest project in the history of TÜV SÜD," commented company CEO Dr. Peter Hupfer, who also noted that the project represents a major step toward the internationalization of TÜV SÜD, which currently operates auto inspection and exhaust gas testing stations in Austria, France and Spain. TÜV SÜD is the German market leader in this area, with approximately 4.4 million annual inspections.

http://www.prnewswire.co.uk/cgi/news/release?id=145690


in German

[Scott4139]

Re: What about Ford?

There will be less capacity one way or another if/when GM follows Chrysler into C11. Do you really think all those Chrysler plants temporarily closed will reopen? Same for GM. The truck plants are down 9 weeks, no way they all reopen.

When we're done there will be less capacity in the system; both OEMs and suppliers. I'd say the real winner here will be Fiat, not Ford.

[Slimprofits]

Re: What about Ford?

There will be less capacity one way or another if/when GM follows Chrysler into C11. Do you really think all those Chrysler plants temporarily closed will reopen? Same for GM. The truck plants are down 9 weeks, no way they all reopen.

When we're done there will be less capacity in the system; both OEMs and suppliers. I'd say the real winner here will be Fiat, not Ford.

If those plants don't reopen than the people celebrating the latest initial jobless claims as a bottom are going to be hugely dissapointed in a couple of months.

[charliebrown]

Re: What about Ford?http://itulip.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=95863

im in ne illinois and already go through a bi-annual emission check. it is a royal pain in the butt, as the lines are long, unless you can take it mid-week. sorry but i still have a job.

every time i pass i'm way under the limits so i dont know why they dont have some graded system where if you are close to the limit you go annually if you are far away less frequent. I have owned my car for 15 years so I have spent 6 trips to the testing station wasting my saturdays, the emission is now tied to registration so you cant renew your plates if you have not been tested.

If they come up with some kind of safety check to get old cars off the road, im not buying a new car! ill take the bus, or buy another beater.
ive just about had enough of the gvt taking my money.

this year ...
sales tax up 1% 7.25 to 8.25, state income tax going up 1-2% 3 to 4.5%, property tax up 5% yoy. got hit with a $100 cop in a box ticket rolling through right turn on red, i'm sure i will do this again when I'm not paying attention. btw it was an intersection through corn fields with no cars in sight. when does it stop? i'm almost ready for a trailer in the desert.

[GRG55]

Re: What about Ford?

There will be less capacity one way or another if/when GM follows Chrysler into C11. Do you really think all those Chrysler plants temporarily closed will reopen? Same for GM. The truck plants are down 9 weeks, no way they all reopen.

When we're done there will be less capacity in the system; both OEMs and suppliers. I'd say the real winner here will be Fiat, not Ford.

Nobody, other than the totally deluded, could or would think that "...all those Chrysler plants temporarily closed will reopen? Same for GM...".

The point is that there will continue to be too much capacity because of the government's support. Less than before. But still too much.

Unless the government finds it is unable to have its way, and the secured creditors ultimately prevail...

Chrysler Non-TARP Lenders Object to Auction Plan

May 4 (Bloomberg) -- A group of Chrysler LLC’s secured lenders is seeking to block the bankrupt company’s plan to sell its business at auction this month, arguing that the U.S. government is violating federal law to preserve the automaker.

The group, calling itself Chrysler’s non-TARP lenders, in reference to the Troubled Assets Relief Program, seeks to block the proposed sale to an alliance led by Fiat SpA, as well as a request by the U.S. automaker for approval of a $4.5 billion Treasury loan to finance the reorganization.

Secured lenders that agreed to the Fiat deal, including JPMorgan Chase & Co., Citigroup Inc. and Goldman Sachs Group Inc., had conflicts of interest because they had also accepted TARP funds, the group said.

The process is “tainted” because it was dominated by the government, the lenders argued in papers filed today in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Manhattan...

...The sale “improperly attempts to extinguish their property rights without their comment,” attorneys for the objecting lenders wrote in court papers.

“The sale motion should be denied because it seeks approval of a sale that cannot be approved under the bankruptcy code,” they argued. “The court should not permit a patently illegal sales process to go forward.”...

[fliped42]

Re: What about Ford?

We have been discussing this on many threads. We have agreed that as opposed to the bondholders of GM the creditors of Chrysler are secured. The recent Chicago Politics attack on the secured holders asserting their rights has grown loud. I am am trying to do the math on the deal.

http://www.ustreas.gov/press/releases/tg115.htm

April 30, 2009
TG-115

Obama Administration Auto Restructuring Initiative
Chrysler-Fiat Alliance

On March 30, 2009, President Obama laid out a framework for Chrysler to achieve viability by partnering with the international car company Fiat. After a month of close engagement with the President's Auto Task Force, Chrysler, Fiat and their key stakeholders have made unprecedented sacrifices and executed an agreement that positions Chrysler for a viable future.
Chrysler has not only been an icon of America's auto industry and a source of pride for generations of American workers; it has also been responsible for helping build our middle class, giving countless Americans the chance to provide for their families, send their kids to college, and save for a secure retirement. As a result of the sacrifices by key stakeholders and a substantial commitment of U.S. government resources, Chrysler has an opportunity to thrive as a long-term viable 21^st century company. To execute this agreement, Chrysler will use Section 363 of the bankruptcy code to clear away the remaining impediments to its successful re-launch.

The Chrysler Fiat Alliance – Shared Sacrifice

• The alliance will retain Chrysler's existing factory footprint and continue producing Chrysler cars in U.S. factories. The alliance will create the sixth-largest global automaker, spreading R&D and design development costs over higher volumes,making it more competitive in an increasingly global and consolidating industry.
• Fiat is contributing billions of dollars in advanced technology and intellectual property, and offering Chrysler access to a global distribution network. Fiat's technology will allow Chrysler to build new fuel efficient cars and engines in U.S. factories.

(FIAT GETS A NO MONEY DOWN DEAL) WINNER

• The UAW has made important concessions on wages, benefits, and retiree health care that, while difficult, will help save jobs for active employees, pensions and health care for retirees and make Chrysler more competitive.

(THE UNION BOSSES KEEP JOBS) WINNER

• Chrysler's largest secured creditors have agreed to exchange their portion of the Company's $6.9 billion secured claim for their pro-rata share of $2 billion in cash at closing. The Bankruptcy Court process will be used to confirm this treatment on those lenders that failed to accept the offer that was accepted by a majority of the lenders.

(THE LENDERS WHO AGREED ARE TARP BANKS) WINNER (THEY GOT LOOT ALREADY IN TARP FUNDING) (BAD EVIL HEDGEFUNDS WHO OWN THE FIRST CLAIM ON THE PROPERTY WILL HAVE THIS DEAL CONFIRMED ON THEM) LOSER

• Daimler, Chrysler's current minority shareholder, has agreed to waive its share of Chrysler's $2 billion of second lien debt, give up its 19% equity interest in Chrysler's ultimate parent, and settle its guaranty obligation to the PBGC by agreeing to pay $600 million to Chrysler's pension funds.

(GETS TO SETTLE A MULTI-BILLION DOLLAR LIABILITY FREE AND CLEAR FOR $600,000,000) WINNER

• Cerberus has agreed to waive its share of Chrysler's $2 billion of second lien debt and forfeit its entire equity stake in Chrysler. Cerberus has also agreed to transfer its ownership of the Chrysler headquarters in Auburn Hills, Michigan to the new Chrysler alliance. Lastly, Cerberus will contribute a claim it had against Daimler to assist in the Daimler settlement with the PBGC.

(TAKING LOSSES AND GETTING RID OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF LIABILITIES BY THROWING IN A LITIGATION CLAIM) EVEN




Details on the Chrysler Fiat Alliance:

• Fiat will contribute a free license to use all of its intellectual property and "know how" to capitalize Chrysler in exchange for 20% of the equity of the reorganized Chrysler. Fiat will have the right to select three directors of Chrysler once reorganized. In addition, Fiat will have the right to earn up to 15% in additional equity in three tranches of 5% – each in exchange for meeting performance metrics, including introducing a vehicle produced at a Chrysler factory in the U.S. that performs at 40 mpg; providing Chrysler with a distribution network in numerous foreign jurisdictions; and manufacturing state-of-the art, next generation engines at a U.S Chrysler facility.

(ENVIORNMENTAL LOBBY GETS SMALL CARS PRODUCED IN USA) WINNER

• The newly reorganized Chrysler will purchase substantially all of the assets of the old Chrysler out of a chapter 11 bankruptcy case in exchange for a $2 billion payment to its secured lenders.

(BUYING ALL OF CHRYSLERS ASSETS FOR $2,000,000,000) BIG WINNER

• This new Chrysler will establish an independent trust (VEBA) that will provide health care benefits for Chrysler's retirees. The VEBA will be funded by a note of $4.6 billion payable over approximately 13 years with a 9% rate of interest and will receive 55% of the equity of New Chrysler. The VEBA will have the right to select one independent director and will have no other governance rights.

(THE UNION IS GIVING/GETTING A $4,600,000,000 NOTE @ 9% AND 55% OF THE EQUITY AND A BOARD SEAT) WINNER

The Chrysler Pension Plans will be preserved, and their stability will be strengthened from the Daimler contribution of $600 million.

(UNION GETS $600,000,000 CASH) WINNER AGAIN

• The U.S. Treasury will receive 8% of the equity of the new Chrysler. U.S. Treasury also has the right to select the initial group of four independent directors, but thereafter will not play a role in the governance or management of the Company.

(GOVERNMENT GETS TO CONTROL THE BOARD) WINNER

• The Governments of Canada and Ontario will together receive 2% of the equity of the new Chrysler. Based on its substantial financial contribution, Canada will also have the right to select one independent director, on the same basis as the four independent directors initially chosen by the U.S.

(CANADA GETS EQUITY AND A BOARD SEAT TO BOOT) SMALL WINNER

Details on U.S. Government Support:


Consistent with the President's commitment to provide adequate working capital to help Chrysler through this restructuring period and loan up to $6 billion to the Chrysler-Fiat Alliance, the U.S. government has committed to provide assistance sufficient to help give Chrysler a chance to achieve financial viability.

• Working capital: The U.S. government is prepared to provide approximately $3.3 billion in debtor in possession financing to support Chrysler through an expedited chapter 11 proceeding.

(GOVERNMENT PLACES DIP FINANCING CRAMMING DOWN SECURED HOLDERS BY PRIMING THEIR LIEN BY $4,500,000,000) WINNER




http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/...tcy-fiat_N.htm

• Loan to the New Chrysler: Upon closing, the U.S. government is prepared to loan approximately $4.7 billion to New Chrysler, in the form of a term loan with $2.1 billion due in 30 months and the balance 50% due on the 7th anniversary and 50% due on the 8th anniversary of the loan. The interest will be an appropriate combination of cash and payment-in-kind. There is also an additional note of $288 million which is a fee for making these loans. The loans will be secured by a first priority lien on all of Chrysler's assets.

(NEW ENTITY GETS ANOTHER $4,700,000,000 FINANCING FROM GOVERNMENT AT CLOSING WITH NO INTEREST THAT IS DISCLOSED GOVERNMENT LOANS THEM $288,000,000 IN FEES) WINNERS BOTH OF THEM.




Canadian Government Participation:

• The governments of Canada and Ontario will participate alongside the U.S. Treasury in lending money to Chrysler and New Chrysler based on a 3:1 formula using Canadian currency. The amount lent by the Canadians is incremental to the funding referenced above.

(CANADA GETS A PIECE OF THE ACTION AS WELL) WINNER

Viable Financing Solution:

• Chrysler will enter into an agreement with GMAC to provide dealer and customer financing. This agreement will continue once Chrysler has emerged from bankruptcy. Chrysler Financial has agreed to uphold and cooperate in the transition of its current agreements with dealers to GMAC. The U.S. Government is supporting the automotive restructuring initiative by promoting the availability of credit financing for dealers and customers, including liquidity and capitalization that would be available to GMAC, and by providing the capitalization that GMAC requires to support the Chrysler business.

(CHRYSLER GETS GOVERNMENT VENDOR FINANCING) WINNER




Warranties:

• Chrysler will continue to honor consumer warranties. Yesterday, the U.S. Treasury made available the Warranty Support Program to Chrysler and $280 million was funded to a special vehicle available to provide a backstop on the orderly payment of warranties for cars sold during this restructuring period.

(CONSUMERS GET TO SUBSIDIZE THEIR OWN WARRANTIES BUY PAYING THEIR TAXES) WINNER?

Executing the Chrysler-Fiat Alliance
While many stakeholders made sacrifices and worked constructively in this process, some did not. In particular, a group of investment firms and hedge funds failed to accept reasonable offers to settle on their debt. In order to effectuate this alliance without rewarding those who refused to sacrifice, the U.S. government will stand behind Chrysler's efforts to use our bankruptcy code to clear away remaining obligations and emerge stronger and more competitive.

(THOSE PESKEY EVIL HEDGEFUNDS AGAIN) LOSER

During this process, Chrysler will continue operating in the ordinary course. From an operating perspective, the day after the filing will not be materially different from the day before the filing. The following parties will be treated as described below:

(NOTHING TO SEE HERE MOVE ALONG ONLY NASTY HEDGEFUNDS GETTING IN THE WAY OF YOUR GOVERNMENTS BUSINESS)

• Employees: Employees will get paid in the ordinary course, including salary, wages and ordinary benefits. Workers compensation claims will continue to be paid by Chrysler's insurers. Assuming the sale moves forward as expected, Pension Plan and VEBA funding will be transferred to the purchaser.
• Suppliers: Chrysler will seek authority at its "first day" hearing to continue to pay suppliers in the ordinary course. In addition, the U.S. Treasury's Supplier Support Program will continue to operate, and Chrysler suppliers benefiting from the program will continue to receive that benefit.
• Dealers: Chrysler will seek authority at its "first day" hearing to honor its customer warranties in the ordinary course. Moreover, Chrysler will seek to continue to honor its dealer incentives for those dealers who are expected to continue to be part of Chrysler's distribution network going forward. There are some dealers that Chrysler has identified and certain other dealers identified by GMAC as being risky credits that will not continue with Chrysler. It is expected that the terminated dealers will wind down their operations over time and in an orderly manner.
• UAW: The modified labor agreement reached between the UAW and Chrysler will be operative.
• Creditors: A majority of the Senior Secured Lenders now support the transaction with Chrysler.

$4,500,000,000 - Dip financing
$4,600,000,000 - Pension bond at 9% (interst per annum $423,000,000)
$4,700,000,000 - Additional government bonds
$ 600,000,000 - Cash infusion to the Unions
$ 280,000,000 - Warranty guarantees
$14,680,000,000

at a 70 % LTV this values Chrysler after bankruptcy at $20,971,000,000

and the secured creditors with the property rights only get $2,000,000,000


SOUNDS LIKE A FAIR DEAL TO ME

[Scott4139]

Re: What about Ford?

Maybe Itulipers see this, but the alternative is not saleable.

Fiat walked away with $2B from GM last time they partnered up. I have a strong belief Marchionne will win big from this situation. No one can be a global player without the USA's 30%+/- of the global market. With his play with Chrysler and GME he can jump to #5 on the list. With a little luck he can move up to #2 which seems to be his long term goal.

Living in the middle of this crisis I have an insiders view. What's interesting to me is what people outside the industry think.

[Scott4139]

Re: What about Ford?

"During this process, Chrysler will continue operating in the ordinary course. From an operating perspective, the day after the filing will not be materially different from the day before the filing. The following parties will be treated as described below:"

Well except that all their plants are closed down until further notice. Most will not re-open.

[fliped42]

Re: What about Ford?

Maybe Itulipers see this, but the alternative is not saleable.

Fiat walked away with $2B from GM last time they partnered up. I have a strong belief Marchionne will win big from this situation. No one can be a global player without the USA's 30%+/- of the global market. With his play with Chrysler and GME he can jump to #5 on the list. With a little luck he can move up to #2 which seems to be his long term goal.

Living in the middle of this crisis I have an insiders view. What's interesting to me is what people outside the industry think.

I agree the alterative is not saleable by the Obama Administration. His constituents would never support it. Still does not make it right in my view. As an insider do you think this is good for the industry as a whole? I really have no knowledge of the inner workings of the auto industry and I would be curious of your opinion of the deal. I am watching this proceeding as a way to gauge future business trends especially as it applies to the ability of risk takers to assert their contractual rights without government interference. I believe that EJ is right regarding the inability to invest in this environment and I do believe the recent actions will cause serious long term ramifications in the credit markets. All credit markets. But it would be great if you can post how an insider sees this on a macro level.

[thunderdownunder]

Re: What about Ford?http://itulip.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=95863

Chrysler Non-TARP Lenders Object to Auction Plan

May 4 (Bloomberg) -- A group of Chrysler LLC’s secured lenders is seeking to block the bankrupt company’s plan to sell its business at auction this month, arguing that the U.S. government is violating federal law to preserve the automaker.

The group, calling itself Chrysler’s non-TARP lenders, in reference to the Troubled Assets Relief Program, seeks to block the proposed sale to an alliance led by Fiat SpA, as well as a request by the U.S. automaker for approval of a $4.5 billion Treasury loan to finance the reorganization.

Secured lenders that agreed to the Fiat deal, including JPMorgan Chase & Co., Citigroup Inc. and Goldman Sachs Group Inc., had conflicts of interest because they had also accepted TARP funds, the group said.

The process is “tainted” because it was dominated by the government, the lenders argued in papers filed today in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Manhattan...

...The sale “improperly attempts to extinguish their property rights without their comment,” attorneys for the objecting lenders wrote in court papers.

“The sale motion should be denied because it seeks approval of a sale that cannot be approved under the bankruptcy code,” they argued. “The court should not permit a patently illegal sales process to go forward.”...

Well this will be an interesting battle - I have wondered of late if the US Judicial system will be last vestage of hope for those Indians that refuse to go quitely to the reservation. "government for the people by the people" can only survive with a free and unbridled legal system. OR is that for Sale for 30 silver coins and a nudge and a wink.
Should you (the people) lose faith in those who are sworn to protect,you have only one avenue of escape - read your "declaration of independence" and understand that -
"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."
Question - does that sound a "bell"
If this continues along the path for much longer the result will be ......
as history shows and the highlights tell.
Remember that the greatest tangible asset the US has is its people -hard working ,industrious, inventive, hospitable and patient. Dont add apathetic (edit-as an Aussie who has travelled through your country and made many friends - your citizens feel hopeless against the monied lobbists who grease the hands that turn the wheels - I have never understood why it cost so much to run for presidential nomination after all it doesn't pay that well ? - would Abraham Lincoln be a contender to day or would he be working in a Denneys diner for tips (Tips = Slavery - yes another blight on your society as it keeps the the poor-well-poor- have you ever asked yourself if the 15% gets to the cook or the kitchen hand out the back- Yes I eat a Denneys and say at a motel 6 which is usually close by - No I don't waste capital - yes I have a few Quid (aussie for a $) End edit.