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  • FIRE Dead?

    When single-payer is not summarily swept from the table,which happened as a matter of course with the Obama 'health reform' commitee, then FIRE's flame may truly be flickering. Don't count on it.

    Single Payer:
    Vast Savings on Bureaucracy and Profits

    by David U. Himmelstein
    Testimony of David U. Himmelstein, M.D. before the Health, Employment, Labor, and Pensions Subcommittee, at the hearing on "Ways to Reduce the Cost of Health Insurance for Employers, Employees, and Their Families," 23 April 2009
    Mr. Chairman, members of the Committee. My name is David Himmelstein. I am a primary care doctor in Cambridge, Massachusetts and Associate Professor of Medicine at Harvard. I also serve as National Spokesperson for Physicians for a National Health Program. Our 15,000 physician members support non-profit, single payer national health insurance because of overwhelming evidence that lesser reforms will fail.

    Health reform must address the cost crisis for insured as well as uninsured Americans. My research group found that illness and medical bills caused about half of all personal bankruptcies in 2001, and even more than that in 2007. Strikingly, three quarters of the medically bankrupt were insured. But their coverage was too skimpy to protect them from financial collapse.

    A single payer reform would make care affordable through vast savings on bureaucracy and profits. As my colleagues and I have shown in research published in the New England Journal of Medicine, administration consumes 31% of health spending in the U.S., nearly double what Canada spends. In other words, if we cut our bureaucratic costs to Canadian levels, we'd save nearly $400 billion annually -- more than enough to cover the uninsured and to eliminate copayments and deductibles for all Americans.

    By simplifying its payment system Canada has cut insurance overhead to 1% of premiums -- one twentieth of Aetna's overhead -- and eliminated mounds of expensive paperwork for doctors and hospitals. In fact, while cutting insurance overhead could save us $131 billion annually, our insurers waste much more than that because of the useless paperwork they inflict on doctors and hospitals.

    A Canadian hospital gets paid like a fire department does in the U.S. It negotiates a global budget with the single insurance plan in its province, and gets one check each month that covers virtually all costs. They don't have to bill for each bandaid and aspirin tablet. At my hospital, we know our budget on January 1, but we collect it piecemeal in fights with hundreds of insurers over thousands of bills each day. The result is that hundreds of people work for Mass General's billing department, while Toronto General employs only a handful -- mostly to send bills to Americans who wander across the border. Altogether, U.S. hospitals could save about $120 billion annually on bureaucracy under a single payer system.

    And doctors in the U.S. waste about $95 billion each year fighting with insurance companies and filling out useless paperwork.

    Unfortunately, these massive potential savings on bureaucracy can only be achieved through a single payer reform. A health reform plan that includes a public plan option might realize some savings on insurance overhead. However, as long as multiple private plans coexist with the public plan, hospitals and doctors would have to maintain their costly billing and internal cost tracking apparatus. Indeed, my colleagues and I estimate that even if half of all privately insured Americans switched to a public plan with overhead at Medicare's level, the administrative savings would amount to only 9% of the savings under single payer.

    While administrative savings from a reform that includes a Medicare-like public plan option are modest, at least they're real. In contrast, other widely touted cost control measures are completely illusory. A raft of studies shows that prevention saves lives, but usually costs money. The recently-completed Medicare demonstration project found no cost savings from chronic disease management programs. And the claim that computers will save money is based on pure conjecture. Indeed, in a study of 3000 U.S. hospitals that my colleagues and I have recently completed, the most computerized hospitals had, if anything, slightly higher costs.

    My home state of Massachusetts' recent experience with health reform illustrates the dangers of believing overly optimistic cost control claims. Before its passage, the reform's backers made many of the same claims for savings that we're hearing today in Washington. Prevention, disease management, computers, and a health insurance exchange were supposed to make reform affordable. Instead, costs have skyrocketed, rising 23% between 2005 and 2007, and the insurance exchange adds 4% for its own administrative costs on top of the already high overhead charged by private insurers. As a result, one in five Massachusetts residents went without care last year because they couldn't afford it. Hundreds of thousands remain uninsured, and the state has drained money from safety net hospitals and clinics to kept the reform afloat. In sum, a single payer reform would make universal, comprehensive coverage affordable by diverting hundreds of billions of dollars from bureaucracy to patient care. Lesser reforms -- even those that include a public plan option -- cannot realize such savings. While reforms that maintain a major role for private insurers may be politically attractive, they are economically and medically nonsensical.

  • #2
    Re: FIRE Dead?

    bottom line, if no single payer system results then we know for sure that obama is in fire's pocket.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: FIRE Dead?

      In related news, advocates for a single-payer health care system plan are stepping up their lobbying efforts, Politico reports. According to Politico, "Their strategy is simple: By pushing hard for single-payer health care, a robust public insurance option ends up looking like a compromise Democrats could accept." Two groups advocating a single-payer system -- the California Nurses Association and the National Nurses Organizing Committee -- last week launched an online advertising campaign targeting the five Democratic committee chairs writing health care reform legislation. In addition, single-payer advocates are expected to hold a rally at the Capitol on May 13. Earlier this month, members of the Congressional Progressive Caucus sent a letter to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) saying that they support a single-payer system but that health care reform legislation should include "a public plan option, at minimum," because otherwise a "strong majority" of the caucus will oppose the legislation (Budoff Brown, Politico, 4/28).

      Meanwhile, an array of powerful business groups that serve on the steering committee for the National Coalition on Benefits last week sent a letter to House Ways and Means Committee Chair Charles Rangel (D-N.Y.) expressing "grave reservations" about creating a public insurance option. The letter states, "A 'public plan' option administered by the federal government is inherently destabilizing to the employer-based health insurance benefit," as it "cannot operate on a level playing field and compete fairly if it acts as both a payer and a regulator." The letter was signed by groups including the Business Roundtable, the American Benefits Council, the National Association of Manufacturers, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the National Business Group on Health, the National Retail Federation and the ERISA Industry Committee (Reichard, CQ HealthBeat, 4/27).
      http://www.kaisernetwork.org/daily_r...fm?DR_ID=58239

      Although Barack Obama was elected on a health care reform platform, his version ignores single payer. Nor is single payer advocated by his allies in the well-funded coalition called Health Care for America Now, composed of MoveOn, USAction, ACORN, Americans United for Change, the unions SEIU and UFCW and other liberal heavy hitters. Journalist Russell Mokhiber, founder of the new group Single Payer Action, notes that no advocate of a single payer system was invited to the recent White House summit on health care reform. Only protests by Progressive Democrats of America and others won an invitation for Congressman John Conyers, sponsor of the United States National Health Care Act: H.R.676. Mokhiber quotes Dr. David Himmelstein of Physicians for a National Health Program: “The President once acknowledged that single payer reform was the best option, but now he’s caving in to corporate health care interests and completely shutting out advocates of single payer reform," even though "the majority of Americans favor single payer, and it’s the most popular reform option among doctors and health economists."
      http://www.prwatch.org/node/8272

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: FIRE Dead?

        So I assume single payer plan cuts the big insurance companies out completely and that won't go over too well with them?

        Interesting if the cost savings really add up to what this guy is saying. What is the downside of a single payer system? I'm assuming a single payer means the US government?

        Something needs to be done. The current system is a joke.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: FIRE Dead?

          Originally posted by don View Post
          In other words, if we cut our bureaucratic costs to Canadian levels, we'd save nearly $400 billion annually -- more than enough to cover the uninsured and to eliminate copayments and deductibles for all Americans.

          .
          that's 10 million bureaucrats at 40k p.a. What the hell are they going to do? service economy....hahahahaha.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: FIRE Dead?

            Originally posted by metalman View Post
            bottom line, if no single payer system results then we know for sure that obama is in fire's pocket.
            Obumma will give the FIRE guys and all the other Business Racketeers as much as he can without endangering his agenda, which is his political future and that of his wife, who wants to do what Hillary Clinton could not. Our fortunes are decided by Obumma's interests which have little to do with that of the country.

            Bo at least gets a bone, we should be so lucky.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: FIRE Dead?

              Originally posted by marvenger View Post
              that's 10 million bureaucrats at 40k p.a. What the hell are they going to do? service economy....hahahahaha.
              I would like to think there's a better way than what we currently have in the United States. But being a Paleoconservative always brings in BIG doubts where the government is involved.

              I don't doubt Dr. Himmelstein's assertion that paperwork would be reduced, but the certainty of his claim that we would save enough to cover all of the uninsured AND present copayments seems like the same tripe I've heard from politicians desperately attempting to explain how they will "pay" for a new program ("We'll save $XXBillion by eliminating fraud and waste"). Pardon my French, but this smells of bullshit.

              Have any of you ever seen the US Government run ANYTHING efficiently?

              I fear that we'll get all the compassion of the IRS with the efficiency of the US Postal Service.:rolleyes:

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: FIRE Dead?

                Originally posted by flintlock View Post
                So I assume single payer plan cuts the big insurance companies out completely and that won't go over too well with them?

                Interesting if the cost savings really add up to what this guy is saying. What is the downside of a single payer system? I'm assuming a single payer means the US government?

                Something needs to be done. The current system is a joke.
                The politics of health care causes a lot of people to call the Canadian single payer system "socialized medicine".

                The provincial health care systems up here provide a basic level of health care services, and there are national "rules" under the Federal Canada Health Act. The doctors get paid from the single payer system, so there is no issue about whether the patient "can pay", or whether the insurance company is going to dispute the fees. In addition we don't have quite the same level of malpractice related nonsense that the legal system has created in the USA, and that adds so much cost to health care there.

                The Canadian system doesn't completely cut out the insurance companies. Large numbers of employers here provide benefit plans with supplemental coverage for things that are not covered by the provincial plans, including dental care, eye care, and that sort of thing. These plans are administered on contract by insurance companies. In addition there's private supplemental service insurance that any citizen can buy. I travel a lot, sometimes to rather remote and difficult places [God had a sense of humour when she decided where to put the oil...just about every hell hole on earth] so I carry a private plan that gives me comprehensive coverage anywhere in the world [the provincial health care plans do not cover you if you are out of province, so even a trip to the USA or Mexico means that most Canadians buy travel insurance health coverage from a private insurance company].

                The Canadian system is far from perfect, but I think any effort to truly improve the insanely expensive US health care system needs to objectively look at the systems in other jurisdictions like Canada, France and elsewhere to see what can be learned. We'll see if the politics down there allows that...

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: FIRE Dead?

                  As long as the party paying for medical service is different than the party demanding it or providing it costs will continue to climb.

                  Somewhere along the line Americans have forgotten that 'nsurance is for expensive and rare events. Not to spread the price of annual checkups over 12 months or get free MRIs when you have the sniffles.

                  I pay about $30 a month in health premiums because my deductible is $1000, like insurance was meant to be. However, Aetna is so scared of me getting sick they give me 2 doctors visits and 1 dentist visit a year for free. If you assume those are about $100 a pop then I pay $60 a year for health coverage.


                  I remember the 1990s arguments for and against hillary-care. Remember the beef people had about HMOs not covering *potential* life saving procedures because the cost/benefit didn't work out? A single payer system would be so much worse because everyone will have to be averaged together.

                  I'll be happy to determine the cost and fork over the cash for my own life, thank you.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: FIRE Dead?

                    Originally posted by snakela View Post
                    As long as the party paying for medical service is different than the party demanding it or providing it costs will continue to climb.

                    Somewhere along the line Americans have forgotten that 'nsurance is for expensive and rare events. Not to spread the price of annual checkups over 12 months or get free MRIs when you have the sniffles.

                    I pay about $30 a month in health premiums because my deductible is $1000, like insurance was meant to be. However, Aetna is so scared of me getting sick they give me 2 doctors visits and 1 dentist visit a year for free. If you assume those are about $100 a pop then I pay $60 a year for health coverage.

                    I remember the 1990s arguments for and against hillary-care. Remember the beef people had about HMOs not covering *potential* life saving procedures because the cost/benefit didn't work out? A single payer system would be so much worse because everyone will have to be averaged together.

                    I'll be happy to determine the cost and fork over the cash for my own life, thank you.
                    Fine for you. But your simplistic response overlooks a myriad of issues unique to healthcare that you conveniently overlook. Find a good health care economist; it'll make for an interesting and enlightening debate for you.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: FIRE Dead?

                      i've been in [private] practice for over 30 years, and have reluctantly concluded that single payer is the only thing that makes sense. i say "reluctantly" because i share others' concerns about government run programs. otoh, medicare is a single payer system for a defined population, and has overhead much lower than the insurance cos. the va health system is also run relatively well [at least in the last several years] with low administrative costs. it is crazy to spend as much as we do on red tape. the government programs' red tape is far, far less than the private insurers'.

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                      • #12
                        Re: FIRE Dead?

                        Wasn't overhead effeciency the reason cited for so many bank mergers that are all currently being regretted?

                        Not that I don't believe you about the amount of red-tape, but I have a hard time accepting that a monopoly (gov't or otherwise) in health insurance would work out when it hasn't in other areas.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: FIRE Dead?

                          Originally posted by snakela View Post
                          Wasn't overhead effeciency the reason cited for so many bank mergers that are all currently being regretted?

                          Not that I don't believe you about the amount of red-tape, but I have a hard time accepting that a monopoly (gov't or otherwise) in health insurance would work out when it hasn't in other areas.
                          Go back and read what I posted.

                          A single payer system need NOT be a monopoly in health care or in health care insurance.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: FIRE Dead?

                            A monopoly on primary care with other entities providing supplemental insurance sounds like a monopoly to me. Unless individuals could opt out of the single-payer and replace it with primary care of their own.

                            Whatever you want to call it, how does moving to a single payer or double-payer or whatever do anything to change the trajectory of costs? Cutting overhead should give a one-time drop in end costs but isn't the problem that costs aren't just high but they keep increasing?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: FIRE Dead?

                              Originally posted by Raz View Post
                              Have any of you ever seen the US Government run ANYTHING efficiently?
                              Let's see...

                              WWII turned out OK. The Cuyahoga River doesn't catch fire anymore. You can breath the air in Pittsburgh without a visit to the emergency room. Once endangered fisheries and wildlife are recovering in many parts of the U.S. The G.I. bill was a roaring success. The percentage of elderly eating cat food is way way down compared to pre-1930s. I rather enjoy being able to travel from DC to my hometown on Interstates in four hours instead of the eight+ it took when I was a kid. NASA seems to have accomplished rather a lot. NIH hands off an awful lot of useful proto-research to the for-profit sector too. Glass-Steagall and the other post-Depression reforms helped limit credit crises for almost 50 years - right up until they were repealed. Six year old kids aren't dying in coal mines of my home state these days. In fact, almost no one is dying in coal mines anymore. Until FDA was taken over by anti-regulation ideologues we had the privilege of not living as characters in an Upton Sinclair novel. Planes don't seem to crash into each other very often. Etc etc etc...

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