Is my job worth the effort?

[SpaceOptimist]

Finster is running around making a very good point about the Dollar decreasing relative to just about everything. EJ is making a very good case for the Fed/Government continuing on the path to destroy the Dollar. It's all very disturbing because my job pays me in these Dollars.

I'm about 3 years into my first job after 10 years of college to qualify me for this job. (Aerospace is my industry.) I realized something was wrong when I moved to Los Angeles and found that even with a high paying job it was only reasonable to live in a 1 bedroom apartment. It seems to me like engineers, doctors and other highly skilled jobs are not valued like they were 30 years ago. For example it is not reasonable for me to purchase a house anywhere within 20 miles of my job, even if I include my wife's income. She is also highly skilled.

I have wondered if I would be better off moving to some remote area and living off the land. Leave and pursue a monastic lifestyle. (My wife says no. ) I like my job, but is it worth it? It seems like EJ believes the current method of destroying the Dollar and passing out the remains to the well connected will continue. I have no desire to join the well connected so maybe I will not be valued? Will production once again be valued in this society.

Second question: Am I wrong? Does it just seem like highly skilled jobs were valued in the past? I first started wondering about this 2 years ago and I attempted to answer that question. I didn't get very far because for example my job didn't exist 30 years ago. I found it very hard to make appropriate comparisons to the quality of life a certain job purchased in the past. Is there a helpful resource on this topic?

I feel better having vented. I'm just frustrated because I don't want to consider such questions. I'd rather just study space related problems.

[*T*]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

I feel better having vented. I'm just frustrated because I don't want to consider such questions. I'd rather just study space related problems.

I work in a comparable area. Try doing your job because you enjoy it, not because they pay you. Money was never fair recompense for time, anyway.

[jimmygu3]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

I'm about 3 years into my first job after 10 years of college to qualify me for this job. (Aerospace is my industry.) I realized something was wrong when I moved to Los Angeles and found that even with a high paying job it was only reasonable to live in a 1 bedroom apartment.

....I'd rather just study space related problems.

One bedroom apartment? Sounds like a space related problem to me.

My advice would be that if you're only 3 years into your working career, you have a lot of room for future salary growth. For now, concentrate on acquiring skills that are valuable to your employer and other employers. Make yourself indisposable. If you don't get the raises you deserve, find another job and use that to leverage your current employer if you would rather stay.

Don't move to a farm if you like what you do in aerospace. That would be giving up everything you went to school for. If you have student loans, take comfort that those are also denominated in dollars.

Good luck!

Jimmy

[cjppjc]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

I work in a comparable area. Try doing your job because you enjoy it, not because they pay you. Money was never fair recompense for time, anyway.

True. I am always annoyed when I hear the expression "Time is money." Time is time. And while it is said they aren't making any more land. They sure aren't making any more time.

[Andreuccio]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

Finster is running around making a very good point about the Dollar decreasing relative to just about everything. EJ is making a very good case for the Fed/Government continuing on the path to destroy the Dollar. It's all very disturbing because my job pays me in these Dollars.

I'm about 3 years into my first job after 10 years of college to qualify me for this job. (Aerospace is my industry.) I realized something was wrong when I moved to Los Angeles and found that even with a high paying job it was only reasonable to live in a 1 bedroom apartment. It seems to me like engineers, doctors and other highly skilled jobs are not valued like they were 30 years ago. For example it is not reasonable for me to purchase a house anywhere within 20 miles of my job, even if I include my wife's income. She is also highly skilled.

I have wondered if I would be better off moving to some remote area and living off the land. Leave and pursue a monastic lifestyle. (My wife says no. ) I like my job, but is it worth it? It seems like EJ believes the current method of destroying the Dollar and passing out the remains to the well connected will continue. I have no desire to join the well connected so maybe I will not be valued? Will production once again be valued in this society.

Second question: Am I wrong? Does it just seem like highly skilled jobs were valued in the past? I first started wondering about this 2 years ago and I attempted to answer that question. I didn't get very far because for example my job didn't exist 30 years ago. I found it very hard to make appropriate comparisons to the quality of life a certain job purchased in the past. Is there a helpful resource on this topic?

I feel better having vented. I'm just frustrated because I don't want to consider such questions. I'd rather just study space related problems.

One thing to keep in mind is that home prices in Los Angeles, even after having plummeted recently, are still much higher than they were a few years ago. I did a quick check on Zillow for two houses I'm familiar with. One sold for $229,000 in 2000. Zillow now values it at $562,000. (It hit $700K at the peak.) The other, which sold for about $200K in late 2002, now shows at about $370K. It peaked at $658K. I don't know precisely how home prices are doing now relative to income, but I doubt incomes are even at par with current home prices compared to the ratio of 7 or 9 years ago.

[don]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

A. Learn all you can that advances you in your field where you are currently employed.

B.Then look around for a move up.

C. Stay in the new, better paying and more interesting position until you have accomplished A above.

Time to do B.

Repeat and rinse A-C until you change careers altogether.

That's how it works today. Few work themselves "up the ladder" like in the daze of the Lone Ranger.

Play the game, you may get a two bedroom apartment.

[jtabeb]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

Finster is running around making a very good point about the Dollar decreasing relative to just about everything. EJ is making a very good case for the Fed/Government continuing on the path to destroy the Dollar. It's all very disturbing because my job pays me in these Dollars.

I'm about 3 years into my first job after 10 years of college to qualify me for this job. (Aerospace is my industry.) I realized something was wrong when I moved to Los Angeles and found that even with a high paying job it was only reasonable to live in a 1 bedroom apartment. It seems to me like engineers, doctors and other highly skilled jobs are not valued like they were 30 years ago. For example it is not reasonable for me to purchase a house anywhere within 20 miles of my job, even if I include my wife's income. She is also highly skilled.

I have wondered if I would be better off moving to some remote area and living off the land. Leave and pursue a monastic lifestyle. (My wife says no. ) I like my job, but is it worth it? It seems like EJ believes the current method of destroying the Dollar and passing out the remains to the well connected will continue. I have no desire to join the well connected so maybe I will not be valued? Will production once again be valued in this society.

Second question: Am I wrong? Does it just seem like highly skilled jobs were valued in the past? I first started wondering about this 2 years ago and I attempted to answer that question. I didn't get very far because for example my job didn't exist 30 years ago. I found it very hard to make appropriate comparisons to the quality of life a certain job purchased in the past. Is there a helpful resource on this topic?

I feel better having vented. I'm just frustrated because I don't want to consider such questions. I'd rather just study space related problems.

IMHO, NO, it's not worth it. If you could pay cash for a farm and have no debts, then I say go for it.

Most of us don't have the money to do that, that's why we keep working.

Have solace though. If you were able to buy a ton of precious metals and hold on to them until the systemic failure that our financial system is WELL PAST DUE for, then you should be a very well positioned person.

Don't go into debt to buy ANYTHING, save all you can (make sure it is in the correct savings vehicle , Physical PM only again IMHO) and do it for as long as you can stand it.

Hopefully we, err, I mean you will be able to last longer than this god-damned financial system and then be able to lead the lives we actually want to live.

The above is a compromise. I would love to say "FUCK YOU" to the man, but I have a wife and three kids, so I bide my time and pray for the time when I WILL BE ABLE to say "FUCK YOU" to the man.


It's better to live on your knees than die on your feet, no Sorry, it's not, it sucks ass, did I mention it really goddamned sucks.

But you can't immoliate yourself.

So have faith, grunt and live through it for the sake of your family, buy as much physical PMs as you possibly can, and live to see the day when you can say "FUCK YOU" to the man. If that day never comes, and you are near death's door, then go postal on the motherfuckers before you check out, and St. Peter will be waiting for you at the pearly gates with a cold frosty one.

Okay, NOW I FEEL better. Rant OFF.

Seriously though. Buy Physical PMs all that you can, don't go into debt FOR ANY REASON, and pray.

Can any of us do anymore than that at this point in this "Potempkin Recovery" that we are being sold.

[SpaceOptimist]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

Thank you for all the responses. I really appreciate the conversation.

I really want to believe that improving my skills and producing high quality engineering analysis will be enough to live a comfortable lifestyle. In fact that is most likely what I'll do simply because I would most likely find it more satisfying than owning a house for example.

I'm just not happy that everybody is ready to jump right back on the previous path toward riches. Just this weekend I was at a party and someone tried to convince me that now was a really good time to buy a house. At my work I've watched several people that have been waiting to buy and now they are moving on some houses. I was just hoping that as a society we would give more incentive to productive creativity.

So I guess I'm saying my best case would be for houses to drop in price by 50% and stay there and for other financial assets to have a similar fate. The future looks great. :eek:

[*T*]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

I'm just not happy that everybody is ready to jump right back on the previous path toward riches. Just this weekend I was at a party and someone tried to convince me that now was a really good time to buy a house. At my work I've watched several people that have been waiting to buy and now they are moving on some houses. I was just hoping that as a society we would give more incentive to productive creativity.

Sadly, most people are wilful idiots. It's stopped bothering me. Don't let their views bother you.

[touchring]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

I'm about 3 years into my first job after 10 years of college to qualify me for this job. (Aerospace is my industry.) I realized something was wrong when I moved to Los Angeles and found that even with a high paying job it was only reasonable to live in a 1 bedroom apartment. It seems to me like engineers, doctors and other highly skilled jobs are not valued like they were 30 years ago. For example it is not reasonable for me to purchase a house anywhere within 20 miles of my job, even if I include my wife's income. She is also highly skilled.

The pressure on the wages of engineers are everywhere.

In Singapore, the typical engineer with 10 years experience may earn $3000 a mth. It was also $3000 a month 15 years ago. The rent for a small apartment will cost around $1500 a mth, which is about half the pay of the engineer. The same engineer in China may earn about $600-$700 a month.

The pool of available engineers that big corps can hire may have increased by a factor of 4 or 5 folds over the last 15 years, but the market for the products the engineers create is still about the same as 15 years ago - $10 trillion from the US and probably another $10 trillion from the EU. The difference today - China and India contributes an extra $2 trillion.

[Spartacus]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

If you're making a decent amount of money, you can work on some skills and retire in 10 years.

http://www.yourmoneyoryourlife.org/

http://www.amazon.ca/Your-Money-Life.../dp/0140286780

I was doing that program and would be "retired" today if various personal affairs had not "taken a turn".

Is there a helpful resource on this topic?

I feel better having vented. I'm just frustrated because I don't want to consider such questions. I'd rather just study space related problems.

Sounds like you want a university based R&D job.
You'd have job security then too (probably)

Professor of physics / mech eng / elec eng , maybe? The huge surplus of PhDs qualified to do this work makes getting these jobs problematic, though. 10 years of postdoc before you can even be considered for entry level professorships - excessive.

[*T*]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

The pressure on the wages of engineers are everywhere.

In Singapore, the typical engineer with 10 years experience may earn $3000 a mth. It was also $3000 a month 15 years ago. The rent for a small apartment will cost around $1500 a mth, which is about half the pay of the engineer. The same engineer in China may earn about $600-$700 a month.

The pool of available engineers that big corps can hire may have increased by a factor of 4 or 5 folds over the last 15 years, but the market for the products the engineers create is still about the same as 15 years ago - $10 trillion from the US and probably another $10 trillion from the EU. The difference today - China and India contributes an extra $2 trillion.

This shows how ridiculous our economy is.
A reducing number of people / amount of effort can produce enough for everybody, and this is considered a problem. It should be making us wealthier.

[touchring]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

This shows how ridiculous our economy is.
A reducing number of people / amount of effort can produce enough for everybody, and this is considered a problem. It should be making us wealthier.

It is making the brand holders and marketers wealthier and the bankers will even wealthy when all that extra money goes into ponzi schemes.

[touchring]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

This shows how ridiculous our economy is.
A reducing number of people / amount of effort can produce enough for everybody, and this is considered a problem. It should be making us wealthier.

It is making the brand holders and marketers wealthier and the bankers will even wealthy when all that extra money goes into ponzi schemes.

This is capitalism.

[touhy]

Re: Is my job worth the effort?

I have a quick question concerning Jtabeb's counsel of "do not go into debt for anything". If the coming currency debasement of Poom is likely, would it not make sense to stop being a responsible 'pay as you go' saver and instead be an irresponsible debtor to some extent. I recently purchased a plane with credit in the hope that this will be somewhat of an inflation hedge. Am I wrong here. Should Itulipers be on the 'wrong' side' of the 'moral hazards' environment that our elites are creating? Does being responsible just make us rubes?